[Nirmalanow]

See my later post below for the solution to my problem with the custom molds. Here is the original post about how I was having a problem with them:

I have been really enjoying my Etymotic ER4S especially since I got Apuresound's S cable for them. The sound is incredibly close to what I get with my AT-W1000s combined with the Echofone (a kind of supertweeter for headphones, see my review here: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/ech...paired-278315/)

So I decided to splurge and get a set of custom earmolds from Westone for the ER4. All went well, I got my impressions made locally, the molds came and are very comfortable with an apparently good seal. But something wasn't right anymore with the sound. It seems like a little bit less of everything. Less detail and clarity, and also less body and warmth to the tone. I am a detail junkie and I really miss the startling presence and aliveness I am used to with the Etys. I would say there is a 10-15% reduction in the details with the custom earmolds. They do place the speakers in the Etys a little further away from my ear drum, and also have a longer "tunnel" for the sound to travel through than there is with the tri-flange tips, so that probably explains the change in SQ. The sound is also slightly lower in volume, but I could not really get back the detail and clarity even when I am careful to equalize volume levels.

I don't think it is purely a problem with the seal, as there is still a similar amount of bass, unlike when I haven't got the regular tri-flange tips seated well and the bass drops out. But I may try and get another fitting to be sure, since I tried getting my money back from Westone, and they were not willing to even talk about it with me. They referred me to the local supplier and the local folks said there was no way they could get their money back from Westone on a custom product.

Has anyone else noticed a change in the sound of an ER4 with the custom molds from Westone? I may still use them with my Iriver H140 for long plane trips because the comfort is very nice, but for serious listening on my main rig, I will still be using the tri-flange tips.

I use the Etys when I take my newly semi-portable fully battery powered system out in the backyard to listen in the great outdoors. See my thread about my motivation for listening outdoors on the audio asylum here: Isolation Ward

My current setup:
Dell laptop with WMP-11 and Burwen Bobcat software
Kimber usb cable
Headamp Pico used as a USB DAC
JPS labs Superconductor + (Harmonic Tech Magic Link Two on order)
Lisa III
Ety ER4S with Apuresound cable
(or...AT-w1000s with Echofone and Aura Bass Cushion when I am inside and plugged in -the Echofone and Aura are not portable)

 

[episiarch]

What material did you get?

I found that the soft W1 silicone adversely affected the sound, but I'm very pleased with the sound of the harder OtoBlast material.

 

[Nirmalanow]

I got the clear Octoblast. I think I will try getting another fitting. Maybe I can get an even tighter seal and that will help. I was surprised when the SQ went down, because I actually read a review online that suggested these would improve the sound.

 

[episiarch]

If you think you have a pretty good seal already then you probably have about as good a seal as I have.

I don't think the earphone with the OtoBlast custom mold sounds quite the same as with the tri-flanges. The sound is still, to me, very good (whereas with the W1 I felt it really wasn't), and given the comfort and the convenience of the customs I have been satisfied enough with them not to try too hard to figure out in what respects they differ from or suffer with respect to the tri-flanged ER-4S. But I do feel that the difference is there.

The tri-flanges give me great sound when I have them adjusted just right, but I find myself tweaking them every few minutes for comfort reasons or to keep the seal; on the whole I therefore find the customs a somewhat preferable listening experience because I'm not fiddling with them all the time. I think it's very possible that my customs sound no better than yours, but that your SQ standards are higher than mine.

 

[Nirmalanow]

Thanks for your more detailed perspective.

It is mostly the slightly less detailed sound that I hear. The custom molds somehow do not effortlessly involve me in the music as much as when I use the tri-flanges. I do get a very definite seal with the tri-flanges, but it does not feel quite as airtight with the custom molds. I do wonder if the seal is as good as it gets....but since I bought em and it doesn't cost more to have a refit, I may give it a try.

 

[Nirmalanow]

I think I may have figured out my problem. I am used to using a little water on the triflanges to make it easier to insert them and also to get a better seal. Just a few drops make them work much better.

So being a creature of habit, I was putting a few drops of water in my ear before inserting the custom molds......WRONG! That was slightly interfering with me getting a good seal. If I just put them in dry they sound fine! I remember now the audiologist who made my impressions saying something about the material having a tacky texture that would stick to my skin. I think I was preventing that from happening by adding a few drops of moisture. And since I was swapping back and forth between the triflanges and the customs to try and pin down what I was hearing, they never even had enough time to really dry out while in my ear.

As happens with this hobby, it is sometimes the smallest things that trip you up.

 

[episiarch]

FWIW I have the customs in both OtoBlast glossy finish - I assume that's what you have since you mention the tacky texture - and OtoBlast matte finish. The matte ones are a lot easier to insert, and give somewhat less isolation, but I feel the SQ is about the same either way. On the glossies I usually use a drop of oto-ease to ease insertion, and that doesn't seem to me to harm the seal that I get - the opposite, in fact.

Anyway I'm glad if you've found the secret to getting these to work right for you. Congratulations

(Drat, Jude still hasn't put back the ety smiley.

Or that one either.

)

 

[Nirmalanow]

I am not sure about the glossy vs/ matte finish as that was not mentioned as an option when I ordered. They do have a very slightly tacky feel, so maybe you are right and it is the glossy finish.

I did get a tiny sample of oto-ease to use with my molds. As I recall it did offer a bit of lubrication, but then seemed to dry up quickly, unlike the water I was using which would get trapped under the mold and stay moist for a while. So maybe the oto-ease works to ease insertion and then disappears to allow a better seal.

I am glad I found a way to get them to work as they are so much more comfortable compared to the tri-flanges, and the ety foam tips have never worked for me.

 

[Nirmalanow]

Another thing I have discovered is that it takes a little while for the seal to really take hold with these custom molds. I put them in and for the first 10 minutes or so, the sound is kind of thin again. And during this time it helps if I push lightly on the earmolds to add to the seal. Then they seem to take hold and the sound is great, and it no longer changes the sound to push on the earphones. A likely explanation is that the molds actually warm up from being stuck in my body temperature ear canals, and they expand a little which completes the seal.

This probably was also affecting my dissatisfaction a few days ago when I was switching from the earmolds to the triflanges to see how the sound compared. I probably never left the earmolds in long enough for them to warm up and expand.

It would help if some of this info was in the instructions that came with the ear molds, but I add it here for anyone who might end up with a pair.