[StanD]

  you cannot tell me that my cowon j3 and my fiio x5 sound the same. i cannot care less why. with x5 i can hear instruments that i cannot with j3, using sennheiser ie8, which are easy to drive. does not matter if it is loud or quiet. the test was double, quiet listening and loud listening to some songs, metal. guitars and some drums cannot be heared with j3, no matter what you do.
 
this is why one should not ever belive that equipment sounds the same. they all sound different.

Unless one has a poorly designed device or it cannot properly drive your IEMs or headphones I wouldn't expect much. If both devices are good and no tone controls are engaged (flat FR) and both have their volumes carefully matched, things should sound the same.
 
If one of the devices has distortion or a lack of DR (headroom) or other defects, then it will sound inferior. According to Cowon the J3 can only produce 29 mW at 16 Ohms, which means that as the impedance goes up, the power will most likely go down further. On the other hand the FiiO X5 cranks out 460 mW at 16 Ohms. I don't know what the sensitivity of your IEMs are, but perhaps the J3 doesn't have not enough power to properly drive them. Personally I wouldn't buy something that can only deliver 29 mW at 16 Ohms.
 
You can google up information on "Equal Loudness Contours" or "Fletcher-Munson" to better understand the importance of precisely matching volumes for comparison. You might also look up how human iconic memory works. These might be interesting topics. I have a feeling that their might be a power gap.

 

[Roly1650]

Unless one has a poorly designed device or it cannot properly drive your IEMs or headphones I wouldn't expect much. If both devices are good and no tone controls are engaged (flat FR) and both have their volumes carefully matched, things should sound the same.

If one of the devices has distortion or a lack of DR (headroom) or other defects, then it will sound inferior. According to Cowon the J3 can only produce 29 mW at 16 Ohms, which means that as the impedance goes up, the power will most likely go down further. On the other hand the FiiO X5 cranks out 460 mW at 16 Ohms. I don't know what the sensitivity of your IEMs are, but perhaps the J3 doesn't have not enough power to properly drive them. Personally I wouldn't buy something that can only deliver 29 mW at 16 Ohms.

You can google up information on "Equal Loudness Contours" or "Fletcher-Munson" to better understand the importance of precisely matching volumes for comparison. You might also look up how human iconic memory works. These might be interesting topics. I have a feeling that their might be a power gap.

Small correction required, it's echoic memory for hearing, with a capacity of no more than 3 - 4 seconds, iconic memory is the equivalent thing visually. But your main point is correct. Never trust anyone who gives you a difference comparison between two things, one they heard last week and one they're listening to now. Being charitable, if anybody believes they can do that, it called wishful thinking.

 

[StanD]

Small correction required, it's echoic memory for hearing, with a capacity of no more than 3 - 4 seconds, iconic memory is the equivalent thing visually. But your main point is correct. Never trust anyone who gives you a difference comparison between two things, one they heard last week and one they're listening to now. Being charitable, if anybody believes they can do that, it called wishful thinking.

Yep, I used the wrong word. I believe that echoic memory, as you stated, is good for a few seconds. The exact time is debatable but generally it's said to last 2 to 4 seconds. Some say longer but not by much or enough to do time consuming switches for comparisons. Unless something stands out as a listenable observation like sibilance, booming bass, V shaped response, etc. doing a comparison of fine details has its limits and is not the same as an observational note. Even if someone remembers an observation note it is not a memory of the sound itself thus it is not sufficient for making a real comparison.
Somehow I don't think the faithful will believe me. That's their choice.

 

[Dobrescu George]

  OK, you still don't get it :
WHEN/IF a Hi-Fi amplifier 'sounds' 'different', it is either 'defective' (by design and/or technically) or operating outside design-specs - or both .
At this stage of technological progress, there  is no excuse for Hi-Fi amplifiers having 'a sound signature' and it doesn't even have to cost a fortune .
That is really good news, because it means -
You can stop worrying and learn how to love the music .
All serious money should be spent on source-material and 'transducers' . And 'WAF', if you have a better half

what exactly do you mean by waf?
 
in my experience, fiio x5 still added something to the sound, that, no matter how many times i test, and how i test was not there and is not there with cowon j3...
 
i have both and listened to both for two days, to proove to myself that i spent 450$ on x5 for a reason. i really see the reason. i also have my phone and other eq pieces, inclusive my laptop. every one of them has a different sound, if i listen the same song, with a very few seconds difference, because i plug in and out the headphones.out of all, x5 is the most superior by far. j3 is better than my laptop. clip + is extremely close to j3...
 
ie8 are considered one of the most power efficient iems ever created.
 
the fun fact is that even in controled spl , same volume conditions, the same differences as in uncontroled envoirment existed. maybe the power of j3 is way too low. i don't know.

 

[StanD]

@skerry2006aj WAF usually means, "Wife Appeal Factor" or the "A" can mean Approval or Acceptance. Sometimes one needs an Approval from the boss before a large audio purchase.

 

[Dobrescu George]

  @skerry2006aj WAF usually means, "Wife Appeal Factor" or the "A" can mean Approval or Acceptance. Sometimes one needs an Approval from the boss before a large audio purchase.

how?
why?
where?
again why in the world?.. 
 
Talking about what i am going to buy with my wife would be different from asking for approval.
Changing opinions is better.
 
 i feel like asking, for most people in head-fi, the wives do not listen to music?
 
or why instead of treating the hobby like it could instigate a quarrel with the loved, try to share the hobby.
 
Like, okay, i will spend tomorrow about 10.000$ on audio equipment, hugo and edition 5 unlimited, signature dj, ie800. 
 
If you do this, do a little stretch, and spend another 4000$ for your wife and get her a setup!
 
like lcd-3 and burson conductor. or a lamp amp that is cheaper and can push lcd 3 to the limits.  or whatever amp and headphone setup she likes. instead of this becoming a problem for a couple, it could become a thing that makes your bond stronger. more like, you get better, she gets better. life can be designed in such a way that everyone becomes happier. I had experienced far more fun while listening even to bad comercial pop with good headphones. And i think that most people in the world do love music, one way or another.
 
Tell your wife about new bands, and try to enjoy audiophile life as a couple. it is far more fun this way.
 
I am married btw, so this is no idealst story. 
 
And about amps, and power. and volume. Chord hugo seems to be able to drive hd800 to it's limits. also, hugo sounded 5% better than my x5. this 5% means more instrument separation, better definition of notes, and better everything in general. no one can tell me that it does not sound better, after listening to it. no matter what you do. listen to it, come back, and we can actually ask ourselves why. one should be able to fiind it to try in several places, as it is pretty popular.

 

[StanD]

@skerry2006aj How long have you been married? An effective bribe is usually Jewelry not guy stuff. 

 
 
The X5 can only push out 28 mW at 300 Ohms so I wouldn't consider it a great candidate for HD800's.

 

[Dobrescu George]

  @skerry2006aj How long have you been married? An effective bribe is usually Jewelry not guy stuff. 

 
 
The X5 can only push out 28 mW at 300 Ohms so I wouldn't consider it a great candidate for HD800's.

Practically for one. But i had been together with my wife for 5 years.
i know that x5 cannot push that much, but at first look, hugo does not have that much power at 300 ohm, but most people say that it is extremely enough to power hd800. i am in between what to buy as my main amp portable. i am torn between hugo, ifi idsd or both.
 
EDIT:: i incline to think that even for a women, something that brings out pleasure is better than something that does not give you anything at all. for example, i can see how a woman could like jewelry, but i cannot see how a person, regardless of sex, would enjoy something that does nothing more than something that gives you music, a physical pleasure. Maybe it is me, but i see my way like, watches, cars, or anything that does no give back pleasure after it is bought is blocking money in something. instead of spending 10.000$ on a say neck chain, or whatever a girl could say she preffers at first hand, i will forever think that buying a Stax setup would bring her much more happiness. 
or buying something that is within her hobby. like if a person likes photography, if you want [or feel the need] to keep balance you can just buy a very expensive glass objective thingy. or a TV and surround speakers, if a person is into anime. or whatever. 
 
my strong advie to everyone is that before considering that their wives would even think to be angry at them, they should try to think from their perspective. 
-like she might not even feel wrong if you buy something for yourself, and that is it.
-if she might, try to buy something coherent to her, and her hobbies, not random stuff.
-would you be happy to receive say even a good car, a porche, or whatever, even if you just wanted a stax setup? i think that the answer is not. at least for me. i would any day take an audio setup over an expensive car.
 
sorry for derailing the thread. I feel that i should apologize now.