[oqvist]

Quote:

Is all you care about Sub-bass?  If that's all you say, then you'll get people recommending headphones as wildly different in sound as the LCD-2 and Pro 2900.  There's no way in heaven that you could like both of those headphones. 
 
BTW, The M50 is said to have good sub bass.  I'm not sure I notice or care about sub bass. 

Haven´t heard the 2900 but enjoy both the Pro 900 and LCD-2.
 
Sub bass is something you don´t realise you are missing until you remove it
 
HD 800 has great sub bass but well then it start to get really really expensive. M50 as mentioned is quite decent.
 

 

[rhythmdevils]

Hey, I agree, deep LCD-2 sub bass is great.  I just have much higher priorities.  I would easily sacrifice bass and treble extension for flat, even response from the lower to upper mids.  If the midrange is right, I think a lot of other things can be missing and phones will still sound good.  But that's not a theory that many/any companies follow as far as I can tell. 

 

[NA Blur]

Ultrasone PRO 2900 have a sub-bass bump at the 85 Hz area.  Open headphones are not typically known for their sub-bass.  Compare 10 open with 10 closed cans and you will notice that in almost every case the closed cans have better sub-bass performance.  Closed cans do not roll off nearly as early as open cans.  Open cans typically give superior access to imaging and the perceived distance from the source to your eardrum.
 
Perhaps pose the same question, but for a closed can and you will find numerous good answers.
 
I did not find any headphones in your price range with "good" mid-bass response.  The HE-500 and LCD-2 are the best for sub-bass for open cans, but they are really more specialized than open.
 
The HE-500LE is the closest headphone to your price point with good sub-bass.
http://www.headphone.com/headphones/hifiman-he-5le.php
 
Let us know if you decide on a closed can.
 
For a fun open can with decent sub-bass try the Philips SBC HP-910
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/PhilipsSBCHP910.pdf

 

[oqvist]

Quote:

Hey, I agree, deep LCD-2 sub bass is great.  I just have much higher priorities.  I would easily sacrifice bass and treble extension for flat, even response from the lower to upper mids.  If the midrange is right, I think a lot of other things can be missing and phones will still sound good.  But that's not a theory that many/any companies follow as far as I can tell. 

I agree mid range is crucial but why don´t have the whole mounty . sub bass is part of the music as well and affect how we perceive it.
 
 
 

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Ultrasone PRO 2900 have a sub-bass bump at the 85 Hz area.  Open headphones are not typically known for their sub-bass.  Compare 10 open with 10 closed cans and you will notice that in almost every case the closed cans have better sub-bass performance.  Closed cans do not roll off nearly as early as open cans.  Open cans typically give superior access to imaging and the perceived distance from the source to your eardrum.
 

 
More air is mean more sound flow all the way to 20hz this is why is hard to hear the 20-30hz in a closed can, and is much more pronouns and easy to hear it in a open design cans. In my experience with hps is the sub-bass rolloff around 20-30hz that is the important to create the real sub sonic sound. The bass bumps are mostly create the overpowering sensation of a bassy hps, I mean the more the graphs are above the 0 db this will be considered over. 2-to-3 db minus or plus around the 30hz is still  considered to be a balanced hps, above 5 db is considered notable and when you can hear it is already over (boosted), if the sub bass is blend in with the rest of the sound frequencies is considered balanced.

 

[TMRaven]

I've had the exact opposite experiences.  Hard to hear 20hz in open cans (beyerdynamic, sennheiser, audio technica) but cans that are known for going low like M50 and D2000 I can hear 20hz easily.  The SPL gets trapped moreso in a closed can too, so the impact of kick drums and the like are greater in a closed can as well.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

I've had the exact opposite experiences.  Hard to hear 20hz in open cans (beyerdynamic, sennheiser, audio technica) but cans that are known for going low like M50 and D2000 I can hear 20hz easily.  The SPL gets trapped moreso in a closed can too, so the impact of kick drums and the like are greater in a closed can as well.

The question is if you really aimed for the 20hz, because the impact of the kick drum is not on the 20hz.

 

[TMRaven]

Two different things I was talking about.  The 20hz I opened up audacity and generated that tone.

 

[koolkat]

I used a signal gen and my closed HD438s produce sound deep in the 20+Hz region but they start to get wobbly as they go lower.
 
I guess one of the various reasons closed cans give better sub bass is because of the isolation. 

 

[NancyHifi]

it's all about what kind of music you like.... if you listen to jazz, soft classical, easy listening etc all you need is midrange, you just don't care about sub bass at all... if you listen to metal, trance , hard rock, pop, hip hop you will be satisfied with 40hz extension, personally I like trip-hop, electronic experimental industrial among other genres, that have synthesized bass that go as deep as only a few ears can hear, In my case I don't care how good midrange would be, if my headphones or speakers have no sub bass I can't hear many notes of my music. So it is all down to musical preferences. I get pissed when audiophiles tell me that sub bass is not for music, or when they vote/review speakers or headphones mainly for its midrange. for me a perfect speaker should have absolute flat response from 10hz to 20khz (the graph should look like a straight line) but sadly thats utopia so i'll stick to my equalizer.

 

[Acix]

In my experience a good hps should reproduce bass as studio monitors in acoustic treated room. For me is more important the presentation of the bass in relation to the rest of the FR. If any hps goes above 20hz with a few dbs this will cause audible distortion to the bass area.

 

[NancyHifi]

I mainly agree, but maybe that distortion is due to the physical limitation of the drivers... Obviously I am not an expert in the subject.
ps  I love bass, and nice hi-fi talk 

 

[TMRaven]

Quote:

In my experience a good hps should reproduce bass as studio monitors in acoustic treated room. For me is more important the presentation of the bass in relation to the rest of the FR. If any hps goes above 20hz with a few dbs this will cause audible distortion to the bass area.

Studio monitors with how large of a woofer?  Most mid-sized studio monitors start to rolloff at 70hz.  

 

[JK1]

Most people can't hear  much below 40hz anyway, unless it is at a very high volume. Human ears are very insensitive to low frequency sound. While most people can just barely hear 1,000 hz at 0 db, they can just barely hear 40 hz at around 50db,  30 hz at around 60 db, and  20hz at around 70 db. To sound as loud as 40db at 1,000 hz, it needs to be around 70 db at 40hz, 90 db at 30 hz, or around 100 db at 20hz.
 
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fletcher%E2%80%93Munson_curves
 

 

[Dubstep Girl]

Quote:

HD650s have pretty decent sub bass, I listen to plenty of hip hop and electronic music through them and they do a decent job with those genres. They would pound your brain out at 20Hz, but they will play cleanly down to and below the lower limits of my hearing (I can't hear below 23-25Hz).

+1
 
the  beyer dt 990s are pretty good too, but i love the hd 650s more natural and sub-wooferish sound to it.
 
best sub-bass quality though, lcd-2