my take on the top tier IEMs
Oct 15, 2009 at 2:34 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 47

timmyGCSE

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Tomorrow I will have the chance to test the following IEM's side by side:
- Westone 3
- Westone UM2
- Shure SE530
- Ultimate Ears triple.fi 10
- Sennheiser IE8

I will be left in a listening room with these 5 IEM's so I will take my notepad and pen and jot a few notes and type up my own personal impressions below. These impressions will be entirely subjective (YMMV) and whilst I may have an ok grasp on what I'm listening for, I'm still learning and a relative newbie when it comes to audiophillia, so bear with me I will do my best. I also understand this won't be of interest to all (heard 'em all before, thoughts of a newbie aren't important etc.) but I'm hoping that sharing my experiences will help one or two. I will try taking a sneaky pic of all the IEM's next to each other too.

I'm hoping my source will be a Cowon D2+ if fedex decide to deliver it in the morning before I leave work at 12:30pm, but if not it will have to be the fuze.

These are the songs I will be playing for my testing, the genre and the reason I'm playing them

testing playlist:
  1. Kings of Leon - Arizona (Rock, for the lush electric guitars and the strong drum beat, my favourite KoL track by a mile)
  2. Rick Ross - Luxury Tax (rnb'ish, for a typical modern rnb sound - bassy, male vocals, female backup vocals that type of thing)
  3. 2pac - Heartz of Men (rap/hip-hop, for the fact that 2pac is my fav artist with an extremly distinct and emotional voice (you can alot of the time gather his facial expressions from his tone of voice) and this song has alot of scratching and detail with alot more to it such as sampling putting it in the category of hiphop which is a departure from 2pacs usual style)
  4. America - Chasing Rainbows (American-English folk, acoustic guitar for mids and xylophone for highs)
  5. America - Muskrat Love (American-English folk, wonderful guitars, the end of the first verse ends with an audible guitar string vibration that sounds unbelievable on Grado's)
  6. America - Ventura Highway (American-English folk, wonderful acoustic guitar playing with subtle detail)
  7. Bow Wow - She's My (rnb, Bow Wow has a good voice for testing male vocals especially on the chorus, very good song for testing sibilance)
  8. Bow Wow - Shake it (hip hop, huge bass on this track in quantity and depth)
  9. Commix - Life We Live (Drum n Bass, a very warm bass-line, lots of detail and barely audiable sound effects and agressive highs)
  10. Enigma - Sadeness (New Age, mainly for soundstage testing, there is a glittery-sparkling sound throughtout the song that circles your head giving a nice picture of where the sound is, plus the male vocals are from a choir..IEM's with a narrow soundstage sound like the choirists are in a room with you, large soundstage IEM's such as the FX500 feel like you are in a cathedral)
  11. John Mayer - Something's Missing (Blues Rock, JM is my favourite guitarist, looking for instrument seperation and quality of guitar and drum reproduction on this track)
  12. Lil Wayne - Dontgetit (rap, extremely deep bassline - shocked when I first heard it on the FX500's. Also Lil Wayne has a distict complex voice which is noticibly produced better on certain IEM's/headphones)
  13. Metallica - For Whom The Bells Toll (Metal, electric guitars, drums, powerful male vocals)
  14. Metallica - One (Metal, simply the greatest electric guitar intro to any song, ever)
  15. DJ Hype - Thunderball (Drum n Bass, classic DJ Hype - fast BPM with lots of detail, thumping beats)
  16. Keyshia Cole - Love live @ AOL (rnb, Keyshia's voice smacks you dead in the face on this track and its very easy with a good phone to pick up the nuances and cracking in her voice. Its an outstanding and beautiful track (the studio version is no where near as good) plus there is a piano that plays far in the background, good for soundstage testing)
  17. Claude VonStroke - Aundy (Techno, bass and nothing else..@ about 4mins in there is a wonderful section that is pure bass..its deep but punchy, textured and strong. Amazing)
And the overall reason for these set of songs is that it pretty much encompasses my day to day listening.

And whatever IEM I like the best..I will buy
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comfort and fit will be a huge factor in my decision - I've had a lot of issues with IEM fit causing me to sell the RE0's and FX500's. The only ones that truely fitted were the e2c's. SF3's fit alright but cause pain after a while so I'm thinking the tf10's just simply won't be for me even though the sound signature of the sf3's are very pleasing. I am also discounting the IE8's from the off because they provide the least isolation - I do most of my listening on the train and the e2c's and sf3's have been the only IEM's that have provided adequate isolation (infact the NE-7M's may have done too from memory, but nothing like the e2c's).

Watch this space
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 2:37 PM Post #2 of 47
so I went along today to hald held audio in Enfield Lock, they were based in a small business park next to a canal. A small place, not a shop but a mainly online sales operation, and I was met by 'Bari'. He took me up the stairs into a small room that looked like a standard Regis office room, in one corner a computer and on the other side of the room a table, chair, and some shelves on the table with various IEM's. "Which IEM's would you like to try?' said Bari..I was like a kid in a sweet shop..so I gave him my list and he picked them out.."hmm..no IE8 for you to test I'm afraid, and the UM2's are all out'. Damn, I wasn't too bothered about the IE8 but I was hoping to hear the UM2's. Then I spotted one I wasn't expecting..a UM3x, I'll listen to that one too please Bari. Bari then made me a cuppa and left me alone, licking my lips, with well over £1000 worth of IEM's. First up is the group photo:
1255724909.jpg

from 12 o'clock clockwise - Westone UM3x, Westone 3, Ultimate Ears triple.fi 10, Shure se530

So I fired up the Cowon D2+ which I so very luckily received this morning and tried the first pair. Before I go any further I want to stop and say something very important. The purpose of this test primarily was to find me an IEM that is suitable for me, therefore my views will be biased towards the music I like and the sound I'm looking for, I have tried to be subjective where possible but I am going to slate some popular choices around here and please don't think I am calling them bad IEM's, of the four main IEM's I tested none of them were bad at all, each had their own merits and positive characteristics just some were unsuitable entirely for my tastes. I would also like to point out that I will make no mention to isolation in these reviews, firstly because I was sitting in a quiet room by myself and secondly all of the IEM's on test I believe isolated sufficiently enough.

All tests were done with medium Shure flex sleeves apart from the TF10's, see below. D2+ EQ and BBE+ settings were all 0 with one exception, again see below.

So without further ado we first listen to..

Westone UM3x

1255725330.jpg


design-wise these are quite ordinary, nothing flash, casing is reminicent of the shure e2c's. The cable is very nice, indeed my favorite.
Comfort and fit is second to none, infact for me exemplary and the most comfortable on test, they felt so very right in my ears.
I pressed play on Arizona..and immediately it felt wrong. Bass was punchy enough but the mids felt out of place entirely and the whole sound seemed very thin, treble recessed. Other songs confirmed this so I cast them aside. However, I revisited these after listening to the other IEM's and I'm glad I did, I reckon the first time I didn't give my ears enough time to get used to three BA's because the second time around was a whole different story..again the bass was tight and punchy, and there was enough but not too much, not the deepest though. Mids were sweet but smack bang in your face but I was immediately taken with this. Add the fact that the mid-highs and highs were slightly recessed and these were the least sibilant on test I at this point thought..this is exactly the sound I'm looking for. They sounded very detailed in the mid-range, soundstage was good, less than the TF10 and W3 but more than the se530. Male and Female vocals were pleasant.
All in all I liked these helluva lot, oh and minimal hiss too. But pricey @ £279.99 cheapest from reputable UK dealer

next up..

Ultimate Ears triple.fi 10

1255726521.jpg


first impression, these are big mothers. They also look fairly 'kitsch'. Nice thick cable with memory wire at the earpieces just like the SF3's. I was already wary of the fit and moreso the comfort, I used my own tips from my SF3's, medium on the left, large on the right. To my great suprise these fitted superbly..not awkward like the SF3's, no discomfort, and the best seal of all the IEM's tried. I would say they were the least comfortable because of their inherant design but still comfortable. I was ready for something good here..
sadly, these were the second biggest disappointment of the day. Firstly they hissed more than any other IEM, I thought this odd since the se530's are supposed to be the hissmeisters but there we go. Highs were extremely good, near harsh but not quite, clarity and detail was fantastic, mids were balanced and worked well with the highs. Soundstage and instrument seperation was fantastic. So why the disappointment? bass. I checked and checked again that I had a good seal but mid bass just seemed so very noticibly absent..ok so it was balanced and neutral but I was taken aback at just how much punch it lacked, and not just on bassy tracks. And then we get to low and sub-bass..I've often read the TF10's do sub-bass well..ok so they do sub-bass and got lower than any other IEM, but I found this firstly odd, a big gap between the mids and sub-bass where the mid bass should be, and secondly on the really deep bass tracks, Aundy, Shake It and Dontgetit, this bass reverberated extremely badly reducing the rest of the range to mush, I compared it to having a 15" sub in your car with inadequate sound dampening so every bit of plastic in the cockpit shakes and produced that horrible noise. I can see why people like these phones, they were wonderful in reproducing Keyshia Cole's voice that calls for mids and high mids, but sadly for the majority of my test songs they were unsuitable. My advice is if you like hip hop, rap, drum n bass or any other bassy genre, give these a wide berth. I would say Jazz, easy listening, acoustic and classical would do well on these. Nice price if you think these will suit you, handheldaudio are a UE dealer and sell them for £214.99

Westone 3:

1255727317.jpg


ever since I took an interest in IEM's I have lusted after these. I thought yes if I had these I would have the ultimate IEM and I would never need another. These were the biggest disappointment. Lookswise these look cool..they look like a pair of black widow spiders, they look like they will kill you - I liked the look the best. Again the wire is great, but a complaint not aparent on the UM3x..I felt like I was wearing a chin strap! What Westone? why put the Y splitter so high? Anyway comfort overall was good, less than the UM3x but slightly more than the se530. A slight hiss but nothing detracting. So on comes the music..
immediately I hated it..the U shaped sound-sig was so badly aparent, the mid bass hump was to me (although suitably punchy) boomy and overpowering of the already recessed mids, and the highs were unbelieveably harsh, I thought the FX500's had harsh highs but these fatiguiged my ears after 5 minutes. I could perhaps live with the bass and whilst the mids were recessed the detail still existed nicely, but the treble just killed my ears completely (on one song I don't remember, probably metallica, I wrote on my notepad 'treble is so screwing harsh..oww!'. Keyshia Cole's high notes were screeching into my ears, I found the W3's also extremely sibilant and infact the most of the day. Lets talk about the mids - the guitar introduction to Arizona requires..no, demands mids. My sr60's and SF3's make my hairs stand on end it is so wonderful..on the W3's it felt flat, unexciting and I actually hardly noticed the guitar at all they were than recessed, on a mid centric IEM its the centerpiece of the intro. This trend continued. Soundstage is very exciting though, a big full sound that with eyes closed filled the room, instrument seperation was nice and when I got past the treble and bass there was some nice detail in there. However I just couldn't get on with these, perhaps there is no synergy with the D2 and it needs a warmer player like the Sony X, but based on the aural assault I received plus the fact that these were the priciest on test @ £300 from a reputable UK dealer, sadly my wanton need to have the phones has completely disappeared. As a side note, I did enjoy drum n bass on these.

fag break

Shure se530

1255732320.jpg


I had already penned these as my IEM of choice based on my good experice with Shure in the past. Design feels cheap though, I don't really like the colour, cable from the IEM feels thin but past the Y splitter its thicker and nicer. Comfort was just below the W3, still good and more than acceptable, I had these in my ears the longest and forgot they were there after a while.
So on goes the music and yes the mids as always described on these phones are lush, full rich and detailed. However the whole signature feels flat, highs are rolled off and the bass just needs that bit of extra punch. In a pub scienario I would call the W3's the loudmouth annoying everyone and looking for a fight, the UM3x's the popular one who everyone talks to and is loud but never offensive, the TF10 the clever saurve dazzilingly smart one who is good to have on the pub quiz team, and these the timid boy sitting in the corner who doesn't talk much, however with a few jagerbombs becomes the life and soul of the party. So I decided to give these a few Jager and Red Bulls and alive they did come. Luckily I got my D2+ before leaving work and had an hour to play, and I googled 'se530 D2+ BBE+ settings' and the following settings were recommended to me:
Quote:

BBE 2
M3B 3 (Sometimes 10 if I am listening to Trance/Hiphop/Reggae)
3DS 0 (Not a bad feature when I want the concert hall effect, when its on, I put it on 5)
Stereo Enhance 0 (Took a board member's advice, it made things worse than better)
MPE OFF (Brightens the overall sound a bit, but also introduces extra noise)

EQ:

80HZ 3
230 1
850 -1
3.2k 4
11.7k 6


well I settled on these:
BBE 2
M3B 3
3DS 0
Stereo Enhance 0
MPE OFF

EQ:

80HZ 3
230 1
850 0
3.2k 2
11.7k 4

and everything changed. They were more alive, the mids were still lush and extremely detailed but now the bass hit with a knockout punch. Not as much as the W3's but onced EQ'd more than the UM3x. It doesn't however extend well no matter the EQing. The treble that was hiding come out to play, bordering on harshness and indeed harsh with the original EQ settings hence me knocking them down a tad. Slightly sibilant but acceptable, much less than the W3's but more than the UM3x. Treble still not comparable with the excellent TF10's but acceptable to my ears. Warm sound. I liked these very muchly. Soundstage was hemmed in and the narrowest of them all but instrument seperation was great especially in the mids and made up for this. Yes I gave these more time than the others and I worked out the kinks with EQ, I tried shure olives (didn't like em, but then I don't like foamies full stop) and perhaps I gave them an unfair advantage but once these were given a kick up the backside these became the phones they should be..exciting and aggressive. Oddly with the change of settings hiss became much more aparent, there was minimal hiss at default settings but just slightly less than the TF10's with.

So when all is said and done the TF10's and the W3's were out of the running and it was left to the UM3x and the se530 to fight it out for my money. In the end the decision was easy..@ £219.99 I couldn't ignore the se530's and their potential. Were the UM3x's lower in price I would have had a harder choice but I'm not paying £60 more for phones with similar characteristics (regional prices mean YMMV). And besides I wanted the Shure's, the UM3x I feel will be one for the future, I didn't immediately desire them, the mids were perhaps a bit too bish bash bosh.
So there we go, I had great fun with all four IEM's, they all have their own strengths and weaknesses and each is a compromise down to what musical style you like and for me the best compromise is the se530's.

So that was the end of my...oh wait..remember what I said about there being various IEM's on the shelf? I couldn't resist. I spent about 5 minutes just having a quick listen of each and making a quick note..some I got a better feel for the sound, some the fit, some were just plain silly. Here's some quick thoughts for you on the various IEM's I tried:
  1. Futuresonics Atrio M5 - beautiful textured bass, deep, strong, rolls royce of the bass department. Mids recessed and coloured by the bass, highs slightly more aparent but still bass takes centerstage
  2. Audio Technica ANC 3 - couldn't get a good fit with these but they seemed fairly pleasing to me, bit harsh but that could have been the fit. Not much more to say because reduced seal couldn't really give me a good idea of what they were really like.
  3. Ultimate Ears Super.fi 5EB - The bass on these phones is friggin I.N.S.A.N.E, the EB is there for a reason, I've never heard more bass quantity from any phone, I was shocked. Mids and highs might as well just not exist tbh. They put my AKG 518DJ's to shame. If you want a rolls royce bass, get the M5's. If you want a Chevy Corvette bass, get these. They also look incredibly weird.
  4. Westone UM1 - I liked these, less comfortable then the UM3x but still comfortable, UM3x characteristics but just less of the same, less detail, soundstage, bass etc. But I will one day own these, they are a good little phone.
  5. Ultimate Ears 700 - didn't really have a view on the sound signature, it was just average. I don't think I was really paying attention tbh because I was taken aback by these things size..they are TINY. Tincy wincy little housings and for the size they do produce a nice full sound, quite balanced. I want to say this again though..these are the smallest IEM's I've ever seen
  6. Shure se310 - a direct competitor to the SF3's, both single BA phones. less bass and highs but mids are sweeter fuller and more detailed. Comfortable as anything, looks pretty cool too. But at a premium over the SF3's if comfort weren't an issue I would take the SF3's, more clarity and balance all round.
  7. Shure se210 - these IEM's have 2 things going for them, they are fairly comfortable and they look pretty sexy. Thats it, end of. Everything else is quite frankly disgusting. The sound is flat, thin, hollow, nothing stands out at all, every range is recessed and I have never heard a worse IEM..skullcandy Ink'd sounds 10x better than these and they are almost 3x cheaper. Not that this means much but they were exceptionally bad for metal. My advice is steer clear, there is much better for the money (hell..the stock fuze buds are better than these).
  8. Ultimate Ears 4 Pro custom - after my listenings Bari came back and we talked briefly about customs, he said he had a generic UE4 and did I want a try. Why not. It was fashioned with a comply on the end but still I couldn't get a decent fit so I ended up holding them in my ears. I couldn't get a proper impression due to limited time and poor fit but I feel they are something special..when I pushed in there was a very balanced neutral and sweet sound there, but I couldn't really determine since the fit was not happening

Thankyou for reading. I realise what I have said may not be as fully as informative as it could be and others could describe the sound better..I'm learning and yet to discover the true meaning of things such attack speed, and I also realise I didn't do much comparison based on the songs used..I could be here all night doing that. But I sincerely hope some of you may have a bit of a read and take at least something from it. And remember, these views are what my ears heard, your mileage may very much vary

timmyGCSE
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 3:02 PM Post #4 of 47
Quote:

Originally Posted by HONEYBOY /img/forum/go_quote.gif
That's some feat you're trying to accomplish haha. May the best IEM win!


well I have a good idea already of what to expect after doing extensive reading on all the IEM's on test, and handheld audio who are allowing me to listen to all these seem very accommodating..I phoned yesterday and said I was coming to listen and do they price match because the SE530 is £40 cheaper elsewhere and 'Barry' said no we don't but you are welcome to come listen and then buy elsewhere so they're obviously not just looking for sales. On the other hand they are an UE dealer and the TF10's from them are around the cheapest available in the UK so its a shame that I reckon the TF10's won't suit me
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 3:15 PM Post #5 of 47
Lets make this interesting haha!! Although I'm quite doubtful that you'll walk away with one of these tomorrow I say IE8 or triple fi 10 or perhaps W3 will take the prize hahaha
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 3:37 PM Post #7 of 47
well like I say there are 2 elements..perhaps 3.

first is the sound signature - mark2410 reckons the W3's will suit me and I think I agree. I was taken aback just how much I enjoyed the sf3's though - I think my taste for IEM's is changing since owning Grado's and I'm learning to especially appreciate mids and clarity, mids is so I am to understand the W3's weakest point.

Second is fit comfort and isolation, the tf10 will lose here since they are the same design as the sf3's, just bigger (although isolation is great..which is where the IE8's will lose). I'm confident the UM2's and SE530's will take the crown

third is price and availability. Cheapest reputable place in the UK for W3's is £300..thats £70 more than the next most expensive, the SE530 @ £230. I'm aware I can get the W3 from the states for £220 shipped but..I'm really loathed to go down that road.
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 7:19 PM Post #9 of 47
Overall I would take SE530 from that bunch. Not exceptional is any one area (although some may say midrange) but does everything very well.

I think W3 is grossly over-rated IEM. We look forward to your review(s).
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 8:40 PM Post #11 of 47
Quote:

Originally Posted by mark2410 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
so come on, what did you make of everything?


I'm going along tomorrow around 2pm
smily_headphones1.gif


I would also like to try the UM3x but hand held audio doesn't stock them
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 9:33 PM Post #13 of 47
Something I've noticed through my own reviews and time with a variety of headphones is that it is hard to wrap one's head around a holistic concept of a headphone with just a short listen.

You will notice immediate behaviors of specific headphones and immediate differences between the headphones.

You will have a much harder time appreciating the subtleties though. That tends to take time unfortunately. I'll say good luck attempting this though. It really does require you to view the headphone from many angles.

I would also suggest that you try to be as minimally biased as possible. I know this is a very, very hard thing to do. We all have our personal preferences, so it's very hard to understand our own preferences and dial them out of the experience. Try to view each headphone from the engineer's standpoint. What was the headphone geared for? Why might it sound a certain way? Is the headphone actually flawed or simply geared towards a purpose that doesn't necessarily match your own preferences?

Also, don't blame fixable functional error. For example:
-poor fit, lack of bass : tip choice
-muddy bass, lack of dynamics/energy : amping
-uneven response : EQing
Label what's fixable and what's not. It's good to know that X IEM really requires an amp, Y IEM needs some EQing work in the midrange, and the stock tips on Z suck. Just be aware of what can be fixed and improved readily. Depending on a person's limitation, some of these aspects may be critcal flaws and some not.

All but one are ones I still want to listen to myself.
tongue.gif
I've got the Triple.Fis and UM3X so far but would love to grab a pair of everything else on your list (plus more, <cough> CK100 <cough>) and give each and every one of them a thorough listen (weeks).
 
Oct 15, 2009 at 10:42 PM Post #15 of 47
Quote:

Originally Posted by mvw2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Something I've noticed through my own reviews and time with a variety of headphones is that it is hard to wrap one's head around a holistic concept of a headphone with just a short listen.

You will notice immediate behaviors of specific headphones and immediate differences between the headphones.

You will have a much harder time appreciating the subtleties though. That tends to take time unfortunately. I'll say good luck attempting this though. It really does require you to view the headphone from many angles.

I would also suggest that you try to be as minimally biased as possible. I know this is a very, very hard thing to do. We all have our personal preferences, so it's very hard to understand our own preferences and dial them out of the experience. Try to view each headphone from the engineer's standpoint. What was the headphone geared for? Why might it sound a certain way? Is the headphone actually flawed or simply geared towards a purpose that doesn't necessarily match your own preferences?

Also, don't blame fixable functional error. For example:
-poor fit, lack of bass : tip choice
-muddy bass, lack of dynamics/energy : amping
-uneven response : EQing
Label what's fixable and what's not. It's good to know that X IEM really requires an amp, Y IEM needs some EQing work in the midrange, and the stock tips on Z suck. Just be aware of what can be fixed and improved readily. Depending on a person's limitation, some of these aspects may be critcal flaws and some not.

All but one are ones I still want to listen to myself.
tongue.gif
I've got the Triple.Fis and UM3X so far but would love to grab a pair of everything else on your list (plus more, <cough> CK100 <cough>) and give each and every one of them a thorough listen (weeks).



Excellent advice and thankyou very much. I agree I won't have enough time to really appreciate each earphone, the main thing I will be looking for is fit which is something that can be determined in a fairly short period of time. I will also get the chance to just have a short time with each phone just to say I have listened to the top tier iems (part of me thinks the seemingly need to buy earphones is just to see what they sound like out of curiosity and once I have listened to all the top drawers I will be able to settle on one, otherwise I will always be thinking hmm I wonder what the w3 sounds like etc.), get a feel for their sound signatures and pick the one that I think will serve me well in the long run. For example as soon as I put the RE0s in my ears I knew they weren't for me, too neutral. Don't expect a full breakdown of each phone lol, just some impressions of the different sounds, comfort and isolation. The below quote should be above btw I'm on my phone so can't change it lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by scrane /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Seems too much like work to me. Having to listen to all of those in a short period of time I think I would lose all sense of reference and perspective. Good luck!


 

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