[Akabeth]

I bought a 160gb Latest-gen iPod classic last weekend, and never actually got to synchronize it until today.

I had all my 256/192/320 kpbs mp3/AAC/everything ripped from CD/DVD's/etc [you get the point, everything I had] into Apple Lossless. So I put into the starting 1000 as starters into the iPod and then I had a listen with my Sony SA-5000's.

I aLmOst had a heart attack!

ATTN: I don't have my RSA Predator here yet

SQ is HORRENDOUS!
I plucked my headphones out. I then tried it out with my AKG 701's and it sounded EVEN WORSE. So I went through my shoeboxes and found a couple of cheap earbuds and one Sony isolating earbuds [no idea of model #]. It sounded 'better'!... I also had one of my friends listen to a few songs from the iPod and he said the same thing and trust me, its really noticable.

I have no idea what's going on but when I plugged all those phones back into my laptop's headphone jack and had a listen through BOTH iTunes and Winamp Pro, the music sounded MUCH better; in fact a bit better than the original source (MP3's, AAC's, etc, before I converted it into Apple Lossless)

Is this really how bad iPod unamped sounds? or is it just my iPod??
Forgive me when I say this but, is there such a thing as iPod burn-in time?

EDIT: I can't think of good terms to describe SQ, but in my english it sounds 'scratchy' and 'distorted' during bass, percussion/vocal heavy sections across ALL music

Regards,
Akabeth

 

[goober-george]

It's because you need an amp to sufficiently drive AKG 701's and the Sony's. Those headphones can't be listened to out of an ipod by itself.

 

[TheMarchingMule]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akabeth /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have no idea what's going on but when I plugged all those phones back into my laptop's headphone jack and had a listen through BOTH iTunes and Winamp Pro, the music sounded MUCH better; in fact a bit better than the original source (MP3's, AAC's, etc, before I converted it into Apple Lossless)

If I'm reading that right (you converted lossy into lossless), I found your problem. Well, one of them at least.

 

[Akabeth]

goober-george :It's because you need an amp to sufficiently drive AKG 701's and the Sony's. Those headphones can't be listened to out of an ipod by itself.

That was my initial impression when listening [and after reading all over this forum]

TheMarchingMule : If I'm reading that right (you converted lossy into lossless), I found your problem. Well, one of them at least.

You're stating the obvious

But really though, I don't think my system [even after my RSA Predator comes in] is good enough to bring out THAT much distortion in the recording

. I mean, when I listened the Lossless vs Old file through Winamp Pro and iTunes the lossless sounds SLIGHTLY better through me and my friend's ears [even without amp].

 

[elrod-tom]

The headphone out is nowhere near capable of driving the K701. I can only imagine how awful the SA-5000.

No soundstage, no bass to speak of, probably even clipping...yep, that's awful allright.

Your amp will help, to be sure. So might another pair of cans for unamped use. I use the AKG K81-DJ with mine, and much of the time I don't even bother with an amp...but they do sound better amped.

Good luck...

 

[triggerc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akabeth /img/forum/go_quote.gif I had all my 256/192/320 kpbs mp3/AAC/everything ripped from CD/DVD's/etc [you get the point, everything I had] into Apple Lossless.

Problem #1, you just transcoded lossy formats to lossless, bad bad bad idea.
Problem #2, you just listened to transcoded files with headphones with a lot of resolution, so the bad quality of the files sound even worse.
Problem #3, kinda obvious, you need an amp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akabeth /img/forum/go_quote.gif I mean, when I listened the Lossless vs Old file through Winamp Pro and iTunes the lossless sounds SLIGHTLY better through me and my friend's ears [even without amp].

You and your friends were probably imagining things, it is impossible for lossless converted from lossy files to sound better than the original source.

 

[Akabeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by goober-george /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's because you need an amp to sufficiently drive AKG 701's and the Sony's. Those headphones can't be listened to out of an ipod by itself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elrod-tom /img/forum/go_quote.gif The headphone out is nowhere near capable of driving the K701. I can only imagine how awful the SA-5000. No soundstage, no bass to speak of, probably even clipping...yep, that's awful allright. Your amp will help, to be sure. So might another pair of cans for unamped use. I use the AKG K81-DJ with mine, and much of the time I don't even bother with an amp...but they do sound better amped. Good luck...

Your statement is true in every sense of the word to me.
1)I jacked up the volume knob to the max but I could barely hear anything with my AKG-701's, and it sounded BAD.

2)I can hear music at a good volume [for me] with my SA-5000's at 80% knob so it drive it. But, as you pointed out, this headphone is ruthless on the source and is VERY detailed, atleast compared to many dynamic headphones I've heard 'till now. The distortion and annoying ambient noises across the sound stage is blatantly obvious... >_>"


To those who read this thread:
Now I know why a good amp is needed to go along with any good headphones, or in fact let me say, required?

 

[Akabeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerc /img/forum/go_quote.gif You and your friends were probably imagining things, it is impossible for lossless converted from lossy files to sound better than the original source.

I am currently trying to look for every CD I have within my stockpile. Problem is some of the albums I have, I know for a fact, I've lost the CDs for it.

I'm not sure if it was a SQ issue with the old vs. Lossless thing.
But we did identify 'slightly' more treble?

Or actually you may be right :| I may be imagining things

EDIT: Should I just synchronize my songs into my iPod using the OLD file format instead? rather than the Lossless, as you say it makes no difference

 

[triggerc]

yeah just stick with the original lossy formats until you get the chance to rip them properly.

 

[vranswer]

What's wrong with converting them to lossless, as far as SQ is concerned? Would generate bigger files than necessary, but no further degredation in sound quality - just 'freeze' them at the current quality.

 

[Spiritboxer]

Are the lossy files being converted to lossless or are the original CD's being re-ripped to lossless? Not quite sure what's been done here..

 

[triggerc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vranswer /img/forum/go_quote.gif What's wrong with converting them to lossless, as far as SQ is concerned? Would generate bigger files than necessary, but no further degredation in sound quality - just 'freeze' them at the current quality.

I guess there might not be any SQ loss, but since transcoding from a lower bit rate mp3 to a higher bit rate mp3 still results in generational loss, it kinda makes sense that converting from a lower bit rate mp3 to a higher bit rate lossless format would also result in SQ loss. I'm not sure on this, obviously, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was audio quality loss involved.

 

[Covenant]

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerc /img/forum/go_quote.gif but since transcoding from a lower bit rate mp3 to a higher bit rate mp3 still results in generational loss, it kinda makes sense that converting from a lower bit rate mp3 to a higher bit rate lossless format would also result in SQ loss.

There wouldnt be. Lossless compression is exactly that - what goes in, is exactly what comes out. Think of zipping a folder with WinZip or WinRAR, same sort of thing.

So it wouldnt further degrade sound quality, it just wouldnt make sense, if the files were lossy to begin with. To the OP, your best bet would be to re-rip the tracks using a good ripping program (like EAC) and then convert them to Lossless.

I'm curious about the SQ of the 6th gen Classic as well, so if/when you've got your music reripped and can listen with some amplification, let us know what it sounds like then!

 

[chadbang]

If you are using any of the ipod's eq settings that boost the bass, you will get distortion - even if you're using easy to drive phones. The bass boost settings distort the bass and AN AMP WILL NOT GET RID OF THE DISTORTION. You need to turn off all eq settings and find an amp with bass boost if you want to add more bass without distortion. I personally cannot stand the ipod without using eq, and I use the deep setting to roll the highs and boost the bass. It's a compromise, as I then have to suffer distorted bass-heavy material.

 

[Akabeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Covenant /img/forum/go_quote.gif There wouldnt be. Lossless compression is exactly that - what goes in, is exactly what comes out. Think of zipping a folder with WinZip or WinRAR, same sort of thing. So it wouldnt further degrade sound quality, it just wouldnt make sense, if the files were lossy to begin with. To the OP, your best bet would be to re-rip the tracks using a good ripping program (like EAC) and then convert them to Lossless. I'm curious about the SQ of the 6th gen Classic as well, so if/when you've got your music reripped and can listen with some amplification, let us know what it sounds like then!

I will, that's my obligation

Just waiting for my RSA Predator to arrive. The Ultrasone Edition 9 and recablings can wait I guess