[]eep]

Here in France you have to add 540$ for Duties/Tax...
The final price is 3240$

How do you know this?

But that’s just your standard 20% VAT right - realistically LAiV were never going to take a 20% (or more, or less.. 15% GST here) hit on a globally fixed USD2,700 sales price vs other jurisdictions that have no sales tax/import duties. Free lunches, death and taxes etc. The free shipping though, that’s a nice touch.

Sandu got the taxes/duties bit quite wrong so hopefully corrects his written review otherwise this thread is going to see a constant stream of folk whose expectations were raised then reality checked.. (@tassardar thanks for creating this thread — maybe worth adding a clarification in a sticky update to your first post)

Sounds like a really well conceived and implemented DAC, looking forward to more owner reviews to supplement the initial flurry of pro reviews.

Yes. That's all true in theory. But somehow that only applies to common people. Others can print free money at the detriment of others peoples savings. So even if there is no such thing as a free lunch, money is free? As on death and taxes, you'd think you don't pay taxes after you're dead? Not so. And taxes unavoidable? Just ask Bill, Jeff, Elon and Charlie sausage fingers.

So strange how the prices of Chinese goods sold in Europe in € are the same price as the standard price in $. Unlike US goods that are twice the price (like my Magnepans) in Europe. And prices on AliExpress are including VAT since a few years but then there is an exception for >€150. On Amazon it's the same price but then including VAT... So... How come Amazon (same shop!) is cheaper than AliExpress? Or doesn't seem to pay VAT.

I just bought a pair of Fosi ZA3's that costs €160 on Amazon, €165 on AliExpress, yet I payed about €290 in total (2 shipments, Fosi Audio official Store). Go figure.

So in real life things are not that clear cut. The world of finance is as transparent as a black hole. Even light twists around it's gravity.

What I'm saying is: when there's a European distribution point (like denafrips.eu) it could be different.

 

[Weissenborn]

...when LAiV changing the gold apllications to silver / aluminium the will be selling one Harmony DAC more

 

[nickv]

I'm going to wait until European or UK distribution is sorted which I believe they are looking into. The taxes added at checkout are too much for my wallet unfortunately

 

[jamezdk]

I'm going to wait until European or UK distribution is sorted which I believe they are looking into. The taxes added at checkout are too much for my wallet unfortunately

For sure, that also gives the hype a little time to settle down, bought too many DACs in FOMO lol

 

[]eep]

I'm going to wait until European or UK distribution is sorted which I believe they are looking into. The taxes added at checkout are too much for my wallet unfortunately

I just had to made a call with the repo hounds trying to make me pay FedEx for 'paying my VAT in advance' when I already payed including tax on AliExpress a year ago. I don't need the grievance, it gets my blood boiling. The injustice, bureaucracy and passive aggressiveness is infuriating. And keep on filibustering me without listening. Aaargh!. Just deliver the package.
Yes, this bureaucracy is killing business, but parasites never care about the host. They just keep sucking blood.

 

[wengfai]

I am sorry for the delayed response as I just returned from a Hifi show in Malaysia.

Thank you all for sharing the concern about taxation, I appreciate all bringing this to my attention. I apologize for any confusion caused by the information on our website. We're currently working to clarify this with all our reviewers. In the meantime, you can find more information about taxes in our shopping help section:

https://www.laiv.audio/shopping-help

Currently, we are shipping your order directly by air via FedEx to your country and we incorporate all import duties, taxes, and VAT into the total price displayed at checkout, designated as 'Tax'. It follows the VAT % for each of the countries in the EU rather than the same for all. We're in the process of setting up a fulfilment centre in Europe to simplify your shopping experience. This will include handling customs clearance, import duties, taxes, and VAT, ensuring hassle-free delivery for EU customers. However, please note that taxes like VAT are still required to be paid to your country's government. Therefore, the price with VAT included will still be higher than $2,700 even after the fulfilment centre in Europe is operational.

Hope this helps.

Thank you all for your understanding, and please feel free to reach out if you have any further questions or concerns.

 

[jamezdk]

Please choose the country with the lowest sales tax in EU for your warehouse, then all EU customers will pay this low sales tax

 

[]eep]

I am sorry for the delayed response as I just returned from a Hifi show in Malaysia.

Thank you all for sharing the concern about taxation, I appreciate all bringing this to my attention. I apologize for any confusion caused by the information on our website. We're currently working to clarify this with all our reviewers. In the meantime, you can find more information about taxes in our shopping help section:

https://www.laiv.audio/shopping-help

Currently, we are shipping your order directly by air via FedEx to your country and we incorporate all import duties, taxes, and VAT into the total price displayed at checkout, designated as 'Tax'. It follows the VAT % for each of the countries in the EU rather than the same for all. We're in the process of setting up a fulfilment centre in Europe to simplify your shopping experience. This will include handling customs clearance, import duties, taxes, and VAT, ensuring hassle-free delivery for EU customers. However, please note that taxes like VAT are still required to be paid to your country's government. Therefore, the price with VAT included will still be higher than $2,700 even after the fulfilment centre in Europe is operational.

Hope this helps.

Thank you all for your understanding, and please feel free to reach out if you have any further questions or concerns.

If I may comment... I ALWAYS het grief from FedEx. Just read my story above. They don't handle duty disputes gracefully. In fact, they don't react at all and just send their invoice on to a collection agency and the fee increase to the customer. China mail, never a problem goes to PostNL with proper customer service.

 

[Jake2]

Please choose the country with the lowest sales tax in EU for your warehouse, then all EU customers will pay this low sales tax

That sounded a little too good to be true to me - I’m not even from the EU and sure enough a quick google shows it’s not that simple. As soon as the annual supplies from a company/distribution centre in one EU country exceed the threshold of the recipient EU country (typically a mere €10k, which just 4-5 DAC sales would exceed, let alone other future products) the VAT rate of the recipient county must be applied.

https://taxation-customs.ec.europa.eu/where-tax_en

If I were LAiV I would be confident about their EU sales being well in excess of this threshold for most countries so would elect to apply a simple model of destination country VAT rates from the get-go. The alternative would be a compliance nightmare of monitoring sales volumes per jurisdiction vs local thresholds to initially apply source VAT rate… likely just for a brief period before the threshold was exceeded for a given country so a switch to destination rate had to be applied.

Personally I’d rather LAiV devote their finite resources to product R&D and support than EU tax compliance just to save a few VAT % points on the first few sales per EU country.

I look forward to putting this tax talk behind us and hearing some more owner impressions!

 

[kumar402]

perfect size for desktop use.
looking forward to reviews from users here.
I don't trust these Youtube reviews TBH

 

[sawindra]

perfect size for desktop use.
looking forward to reviews from users here.
I don't trust these Youtube reviews TBH

especially the reviews where the thumbnail has a dude with his mouth open..like? i mean why are the mouths open ..they hungry? or a freudian slip?

 

[GoldenSound]

especially the reviews where the thumbnail has a dude with his mouth open..like? i mean why are the mouths open ..they hungry? or a freudian slip?

Unfortunately just a bit of an effect of the YouTube game.
There's a lot of stuff like those types of thumbnails, leading titles etc that no one really likes, including the creators, but really do work :/
As a creator you don't enjoy doing that stuff but you sort of have to else your video just gets absolutely buried due to having a lower click-through rate than others

 

[OhmsClaw]

Thank you very much. Is it believable that a $2,700 R2R Dac beats a $6,000 cen.grand deluxe? If so, I guess Laiv Harmony best DAC of the year in 2024

Ask yourself, what do all of these luxury products actually cost have you seen Total DAC's insides and then price tag

 

[OhmsClaw]

Some say it can compete with the May KTE???

I mean... watch is it worth it's almost 48 hour difference in uploads it does not for him. But he is saying the May KTE is all any reasonable person who doesn't believe in cables and quantum fuses could ever need.

 

[OhmsClaw]

I'm going to wait until European or UK distribution is sorted which I believe they are looking into. The taxes added at checkout are too much for my wallet unfortunately

There's supposed to be a French distributor if 6Moons' and Darko's pod is to be accurate.