[Xplo]

Merry Xmas to me

I'm upgrading from a Sennheiser HD-280. I wanted something with a similar tonal balance, only "better"; as much as I liked the Senns, I felt that they lacked a certain energy, and that occasionally the music had a certain dynamism that the phones implied, but could not faithfully reproduce.

My first impression is that the 880 is indeed a bit bright, airy, and sparkly, and perhaps slightly fatiguing. Hiss is slightly pronounced, but I haven't noticed unusual vocal sibilance so far. Detail is very good and vocals are really clear. (I can almost understand Dani Filth! Heh...) The soundstage hasn't blown me away, it has done some weird things.. at one point, REM's Michael Stipe was singing above my head. Eerie, to say the least.

(For those wondering at this point, I'm listening to mostly LAME --api (320 kbps) mp3s on a Power Mac with an AP192 connected to a Xin Supermacro v4 Lite. The amp seems to have no problem powering the phones and can drive them to painful levels, though there seems to be a little distortion at the upper end, and I had to turn up the volume a couple hours compared to the 280.

I'm sure someone will take me to task for listening to mp3s vs. lossless audio.

)

The mids don't quite have the honeyed richness that they sometimes have in the 280, but so far I haven't been able to figure out why. The bass hasn't impressed me particularly, but I haven't given it a proper test yet, and I probably won't until the phones have had time to burn in. That's not to say that the bass is bad, mind you; it's perfectly audible and feels tight. It just doesn't stand out. For the most part, I prefer this, but at some point I'll probably find myself boosting it slightly to give it a little oomph.. I had to do the same with the Senns.

These phones have the dynamic energy that the Senns lacked.

Physically, the phones look and feel a little flimsy, but I believe they are in fact solidly constructed; I wouldn't be surprised if the metal headband is as tank-like as that of the Sony V6, and the cups should withstand any normal abuse. They're very light, and the velour pads and semi-open design keep them somewhat cool (it's not like wearing an air conditioner vent, but what is? Well, maybe I can think of a couple things). There's a little bit of clamping force, but combined with the lightness of the phone, this makes it so that I have to shake my head pretty violently to dislodge them. You could definitely headbang in these if you wanted (I've tried). Aside from the edges of the pads pressing against my head and particularly my jaw (not painful, just noticibly present), I don't really notice I'm wearing them.

I do miss the isolation of the Senns.


So here are my questions. What sonic changes can I expect with burn-in, and how long will it take? Will the bass and mids warm up? Also, does anyone have any suggestions as far as mods or EQ tweaks? (Right now, I'm just going to let the phones do their own thing and get to know them, instead of trying to change their sound, but I'm curious what others have done.)


edit: I do have a cold, and my ears have a fair amount of fluid in them.. I can feel it. Maybe, to be really fair, I should keep using the 280 until I'm well. Hmm. That would give the 880 time to burn in, too. Tempting thought, although I already feel slightly spoiled...

 

[fewtch]

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The soundstage hasn't blown me away, it has done some weird things.. at one point, REM's Michael Stipe was singing above my head. Eerie, to say the least.

Strange. The soundstage was actually the first thing about them that blew me away.

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These phones have the dynamic energy that the Senns lacked.

Agreed... they convey aggression in music much more effectively than my HD580s.

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Physically, the phones look and feel a little flimsy

I know what you mean... in particular, the headband adjustment mechanism seems less than solid. I think you're right that they're more durable than they appear to be.

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Originally Posted by Xplo So here are my questions. What sonic changes can I expect with burn-in, and how long will it take?

Mine are still burning in, but I've noticed the highs have mellowed some and the presentation is more coherent than it was at first. Haven't noticed much change in the bass at this point. I've heard that it can increase as the earpads are compressed by having them on your head.

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Will the bass and mids warm up?

I wouldn't say warm up, but it does smooth out more... unless my pair has some warming to do (hope not, I like the accuracy of the presentation). IMO it's better to have accurate phones that you can warm up as desired with tubes or whatever, as opposed to a colored headphone that's always going to impart its sonic signature no matter what. The DT880 are amazing chameleons... they sound to me like a different pair of cans with every recording.

I suggest lots of live orchestral music, if you want to hear the DT880 where they're most at home

. But really, they're great for just about everything IMO, except metal/rock that's heavy on electric guitars (where they can just sound too airy to be convincing... not my idea of 'air guitar'

).

 

[GreatDane]

Congrats Xplo.

You made a wise choice indeed.

I think my 880's sound amazing with my Woo. I'm waiting for a Corda Cross-1 to arrive and become part of the family...any day now...so merry Christmas to me.

I let mine burn in for about 8 hours, then started listening and I've been in heaven ever since...I can't say that I noticed any big changes after the first day or so.

 

[fante7]

Congrats on the excellent purchase!

Nice initial observations. There may be some amount of burn-in, whether physical or psychological. Right out of the box, the highs on my DT880 were a bit more overbearing than they are now... this is probably from my ears adjusting to the sound, coming from the HD555. The bass on the DT880 is nice and linear/accurate, and it is not pronounced or exaggerated as you have noticed. The mids will always be a little less rich than the average Sennheiser headphone, that's not going to change.

Just wait until you hear them through a nicer source

 

[Xplo]

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Originally Posted by fewtch I know what you mean... in particular, the headband adjustment mechanism seems less than solid.

Agreed.. if there's a structural weak point, that might be it, and it does feel a bit rough.

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Mine are still burning in, but I've noticed the highs have mellowed some and the presentation is more coherent than it was at first.

One thing I noticed right at first was a great deal of frequency separation.. as though I were hearing superimposed recordings or something. I don't notice this as much as I did a couple hours ago, and I suspect that's due to acclimatization more than anything. Perhaps, with that airy upper treble, there's simply more frequencies worth listening to.

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I wouldn't say warm up, but it does smooth out more... unless my pair has some warming to do (hope not, I like the accuracy of the presentation). IMO it's better to have accurate phones that you can warm up as desired with tubes or whatever, as opposed to a colored headphone that's always going to impart its sonic signature no matter what.

Oh, I agree. Neutrality is where it's at. But the mids and bass are kind of a 68F room temperature, and I'd prefer them at 72F, if that makes any sense.

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But really, they're great for just about everything IMO, except metal/rock that's heavy on electric guitars (where they can just sound too airy to be convincing).

The Minibosses' new album sounds slightly "underproduced" - the instruments are very clear and raw - and the guitars do lack weight. On the other hand, listening to material like Cradle of Filth, the phone's energy keeps the guitars punchy, and the detail handles the more complex parts and rapid-fire blastbeats with consummate ease. It's kind of a mixed bag, but I'm not displeased.

 

[fante7]

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Originally Posted by Xplo But the mids and bass are kind of a 68F room temperature, and I'd prefer them at 72F, if that makes any sense. The Minibosses' new album sounds slightly "underproduced" - the instruments are very clear and raw - and the guitars do lack weight.

It sounds like you want a tube amp

 

[Xplo]

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Originally Posted by fante7 It sounds like you want a tube amp

SHUT UP, YOU! SHUT THE HELL UP!

*pulls out wallet and pets it*

It's okay, baby. The bad man didn't mean it...

 

[fewtch]

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Originally Posted by Xplo Oh, I agree. Neutrality is where it's at. But the mids and bass are kind of a 68F room temperature, and I'd prefer them at 72F, if that makes any sense.

I think so. Mine are still at a fairly early(?) stage (50 hours or so) and I haven't noticed any major changes in the 'temperature' of mids/highs, only that the frequency ranges blend more coherently. It may be one of those things that can be gotten used to even if it doesn't take on a warmer tonality (or you could toss your wallet at a tube amp

).

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One thing I noticed right at first was a great deal of frequency separation.. as though I were hearing superimposed recordings or something. I don't notice this as much as I did a couple hours ago, and I suspect that's due to acclimatization more than anything. Perhaps, with that airy upper treble, there's simply more frequencies worth listening to.

I wonder if it's related to the bass as well. People have noted how DT880's bass seems to "appear and disappear," and I think it's because it extends lower than on most other headphones... when you get a track with a lot of low bass, it tends to draw attention to itself. Also, between the excellent bass extension and slightly boosted treble, the midrange seems a bit lost at times... some people say it's recessed, but I think it's a misperception.

This is all nitpicky stuff though... they're slightly analytical headphones, but have great ability to draw me into the music as well -- excellent combination

.

 

[Xplo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch People have noted how DT880's bass seems to "appear and disappear," and I think it's because it extends lower than on most other headphones... when you get a track with a lot of low bass, it tends to draw attention to itself. Also, between the excellent bass extension and slightly boosted treble, the midrange seems a bit lost at times... some people say it's recessed, but I think it's a misperception.

As an experiment, I tried boosting the midrange, and it mostly sounds weird, although a very slight boost around 500Hz added a little warmth.

The Cheshire bass was the same way on the 280. It never really hit as hard as, say, the V6.. but sometimes it was downright anemic, and sometimes it had a very definite physical presence (especially when lower bass was involved.. the 280 has great bass extension). Obviously recording-dependent. It was also very sensitive to EQ, where the 880 is less so.

 

[Bill Ward]

The DT880 can sound a bit dry with some solid state amps in my experience. As has been said, tubes do make a difference--a big difference.

BW

 

[Jahn]

The HD280s are pretty sealed cans - it's going to take a bit until your ears are used to the open can sound. Folks going from sealed to open feel like there's too much air, and the open to sealed feel like there's a congestion. Once your ears settle down you'll get to enjoy the can for the can's sake.

 

[fewtch]

He's doing pretty well... some of the most astute initial comments I've ever read, actually. One thing I'm surprised about is finding DT880 slightly cold coming from the HD280 (if I remember right, it was about the iciest can I've ever heard).

I was disappointed at first that the DT880 sounded so much like my HD580! (goes to show you how misleading an initial impression can be). Took me a few hours of listening to start picking up the differences, even though most of them are pretty obvious. It's weird how sometimes everything sounds the same in a first impression/comparison.

 

[White Fox]

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Originally Posted by fewtch One thing I'm surprised about is finding DT880 slightly cold coming from the HD280 (if I remember right, it was about the iciest can I've ever heard).

Agreed. But if you really want to freeze your ass off, try some V6/7506s! They are great for picking out subtle details, though.

 

[iancraig10]

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Originally Posted by White Fox They are great for picking out subtle details, though.

Absolutely. Being a long time Senn user, I was really surprised when I first listened to my DT880's how they not just pick out the notes that are being played, but they almost accentuate HOW the notes are being played. A really good can for picking out the subtleties of performance. They have become my favourite can.

Ian

 

[Xplo]

I think he meant to say that the V6 is good for picking out details. I don't think the V6 resolves things as finely or naturally as the 880 does, but the grainy highs really do pick out the details it DOES resolve. If I were mastering an album, I'd grab a V6 first.

My ears are adjusting to the 880, I think; it's starting to sound a little warmer, although the first thing I notice when putting them on is still the treble. Soundstage still isn't jumping out at me.. but I have to admit that if I try, I can hear it, and it's definitely no "blob in the head" sound. Either I don't have the listening skill to appreciate it, or I'm just taking it for granted.

Every once in a while, I still hear something (or more usually, someone) floating around in the air.. go figure.

I've got to hunt down some binaural recordings to listen to on these.

I think these are fairly forward cans. I may not be chewing on the stage, but I can't be more than several rows back, I think. The treble energy probably has a lot to do with that, since IRL those high frequencies tend to get damped if you just look at them funny.

The clarity and detail of this phone continues to impress me. I haven't heard drums sound this good since the last time I heard a school marching band; toms and basses are firm, if not particularly impactful, and snares pop, even during drum rolls.

I think semi-open is a good description. They leak sound like mad, it's true, but with them on and nothing playing, there is some noticible attenuation of outside sound.

fewtch, I'm not one of the people who found the 280 to have anemic bass. I don't know if you are, but if so, that would probably account for your different impression of it. It's not what I'd call a warm phone, but it's not what I'd call icy either.