[DanAwesome]

I just ordered some AKG 702s.
My current headphones are Sennheiser HD 280 Pros, but they are kind of uncomfortable, and I felt like upgrading sound quality as well.
So since I have to wait for them to ship to me, does anybody want to offer input on how big of an improvement my new headphones will be? Will it be night and day better, or just a small improvement?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[Kukuk]

Never heard the HD280's, but I felt the K702's were a huge improvement over just about any other headphones I've ever heard, including ones that cost more, like the HD600's.
 
That being said some people take issue with the sound signature. I'm sure if certain people see this thread you'll hear all about it.

 

[1Time]

Welcome to Head-Fi. 
 
What equipment are you plugging your headphones into? 
 
Quote:

Will it be night and day better, or just a small improvement?

 

[DanAwesome]

Yes, when I was researching them it seemed like there were a small percentage of people who absolutely hated them, and everyone else loved them, but nobody really indifferent to them lol.
 
Well it sounds promising if you feel they beat higher end Sennheisers than the ones I have. 
 
Anybody own or listen to both the HD 280s and the AKG 702s for a direct comparison?

 

[DanAwesome]

I don't have an amp since the 280s didn't really need one. I'll plug into my PC headphone out and my iPhone, but also I listen to CDs on my PS3 hooked by HDMI to my Yamaha RX-V463BL AV receiver. 

 

[1Time]

I used to own the HD280, but not the K702. I'm guessing you'll notice a significant difference. However most who praise the K701 / K702, use additional amplification for it. So you'll only be getting a part of what it can sound like. If you do a Google search of "K701 amp", you may see what I mean. 

 

[DanAwesome]

I would eventually like to get a good amp, but I just don't have the money since I used it all on the headphones. I figured that it would be better to get the best headphones I could afford and get an amp later rather than getting a lesser set of cans with an OK amp. It seems like this way I will be able to eventually have a pretty good rig instead of just buying a complete but lesser rig.
 
Plus I will use them from time to time mixing some songs in protools in my home studio, and I was having trouble getting good mixes with the 280s. They sounded good on the 280s but would't necessarily sound that great elsewhere. I'm hoping the clarity and more defined soundstage will be an improvement for mixing.

 

[renlute]

I've never listed to an HD280, but I can speak to the K702 on a couple different systems. I don't yet have a good amp for my K702, but they sound noticeably better on my cheap amp (Presonus hp4) and my Yamaha receiver than the K240S and K240DF which I replaced with the new 702. I only had to listen to one piece, classical, and it was Out You Go with the DF, which is a classic professional studio phone. The highs were too shrill. The 240S, which price-wise is about in the same range as the HD280, is also not on the same quality level as the K702 so I sold that one as well.
 
Then yesterday, in response to another thread, I tried the K702 on my old Dell laptop which has only an onboard audio chip, the Sigmatel STAC 9750, apparently a DAC. Judging from what I've read at head-fi about the difficulty of amping the 702 I expected not to hear anything at all, but it sounded respectable and easily loud enough, even the bass. I have an ultra-low-distortion DIY desktop amp in progress and am anxious to compare the good amp with the unamped phone. On the laptop I also tried my low-end Koss i50 headset which wasn't created for serious music listening, and it didn't sound too bad, though clearly not like a pro phone.
 
The high-end AKGs, both K702 and especially the retired K240DF, were engineered to be more neutral than a consumer phone for precisely the reason that you note. My use is mainly orchestration monitoring so like you I don't want the phone to alter the sound. The Senn HD800 also sounded neutral to me when I compared at a couple different head-fi meets, an excellent headphone, but it's not in your budget.
 
Regarding comfort, I have a significant complaint about the K702, namely the bumps on the underside of the headband which hurt my scalp. I rigged up a sock wrapped around a foam strip which solves the comfort problem but is an obvious kludge. AKG corrected the prob with the newer version of the K701 but curiously not the K702. Search on "K702 headband" and you'll see gripes from others, and a pic or two of my kludge solution.

 

[1Time]

@ DanAwesome - you're on the right track. 
 
@ renlute - nice post, good info.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

I would eventually like to get a good amp, but I just don't have the money since I used it all on the headphones. I figured that it would be better to get the best headphones I could afford and get an amp later rather than getting a lesser set of cans with an OK amp. It seems like this way I will be able to eventually have a pretty good rig instead of just buying a complete but lesser rig.
 
Plus I will use them from time to time mixing some songs in protools in my home studio, and I was having trouble getting good mixes with the 280s. They sounded good on the 280s but would't necessarily sound that great elsewhere. I'm hoping the clarity and more defined soundstage will be an improvement for mixing.

Yes, for mixing /mastering the K-702 will be a huge improvement over the 280's, some of sound cards can drive them okay, and some can drive them much better (like the Apooges mini DAT/Duet). In some point hps amp will be necessary if you want to get the maximum out of 702's. The HD-280 can sounds a little louder with few db's even if they are almost the same ohm (HD-280-64ohm---K-702-62ohm), the 280's will be a little easier to drive.
 
Here more info: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/393139/k702-in-the-studio
 
BTW, what sound card / interface are you working with?

 

[storrgie]

I have both the HD280s and the K701/2s. I have used them in my Logitech Z5500 system and through my Mini3 amplifier and occasionally when I'm lucky an Antham D2. Recently I purchased an Audio-GD FUN but have not had the chance to listen to the cans on this as it has not shipped yet.
 
The differences I notice between the cans:
 
HD280s
 - More passive noise dampening
 - Tighter fit, can make ears warm
 - Easily transportable
 - Sound balanced and acceptable on almost any source
 
K701/2s
 - Truly open ear, little to no noise dampening
 - Light coupling to the head, incredibly comfortable (will be a huge advantage over the HD280s)
 - Very analytical sound, excellent reproduction of string and brass instruments
 - Very noticeable selective change when used with good source
 - First experience I had with sound stage
 
Subjectively I would say that my biggest issue with the HD280s is that their strap constantly works its way apart, I have yet to source another style of strap for the top of the phones... I may try to use my DT 880 Pro strap on them tonight to see if it fits. The HD280s were a great entry set for me as I travelled quite a bit and they are easy to stash and relatively cheap to replace.
 
As for the K70x (I have the 701 and 702) I would say that they are much more enjoyable to listen to, especially when paired with the right instrumentation and a recording that tried to preserve sound stage (I would recommend some Chesky Records jazz samplers) They are truly a comfortable set to wear, however the environment will leak into your listening so don't plan on taking these things to the office for the full experience. 
 
I think all in all, you have made the right choice. I recently purchased the DT 880 and HD650 to compare all of them using my Antham D2 and I think I will stick to the K70x and HD650s.
 
Enjoy these, now start spending money on a good DAC and Amplification unit, I have been itching to source the parts for a Millet MOSFET Max, I really hope that using a Tube amplifier will warm up the K70x and bring an analytical yet rich sound that I crave. Something between the overly warm HD650 and overly bright/analytical K70x would be ideal for my tastes.

 

[DanAwesome]

Thanks everyone! Good info renlute.
 
And Storrgie, it is nice to hear impressions from someone who owns both.
 
It sounds like I made a good choice, since my only major complaints with the 280s was lack of much soundstage and comfort due to them being much too tight. Of course more clarity will also be nice.
 
It sounds like the 702s will be an improvement in all major areas I wanted! (For comfort, its easier to fix a couple bumps on the headband, then the horrible squeezing of the 280s)
 
I still absolutely love the 280s for tracking guitar in the studio. Good natural isolation from their closed design and tight fit, and I really like how electric guitar sounds on them. But it will be nice to use them for tracking and the 702s for mixing.
 
Now I just wish they would ship :/
 
Oh and Acix, I am not near my studio stuff right now but I believe I have a digidesign rack 002 or something like that. I am bad at remembering specific names of things. I know it can drive my 280s way past where I need them to go, so I am assuming it is at least OK for the 702s, but I really don't know much about its specific technical stuff.

 

[bwhsh8r]

I honestly find the k702 comfortable after they have been worn for a couple months, but they squeeze for a little bit.  If you have a friend with a fat head then let them borrow them for a week or two then you'll be okay.  One word of warning, they may be 62 ohm but they are far from easy to drive, so have a good amp.  If you underamp them it will have really rolled off bass.  They seem to be harder to drive than my new hd800s (which, aren't that big of an improvement to be honest.) I like them better than my hd515/595, but it depends on what you are looking for.  The 595s out of alot of sources are more "pleasant" to listen to but less accurate.  Once I listened to the AKG I noticed alot of veil that I had not previously on the 595.
 
I also think that breaking in helped quite a bit, but that may have just been me getting used to their sound profile.   The sound stage is pretty darn good, close to the best I have heard for positioning purposes.
 
sorry, after reading what you said again, A good amp will be what really reveals these as great headphones, but until you get one I am not sure if they will really impress you or not, but they wont sound bad, per se. I don't know  how good of a job that I did on this, but hey I'm new on this forum. 


(my setups, AMB Gamma 2 dac / Devilsound dac    :     little dot mkIII/indeed/iBasso amps     :      short recable, pretty good, but not botique, it was like $80)
 
p.s. if you are comfortable with soldering then I would recommend that you solder your own dac/amp.  You will save quite alot of money.

 

[storrgie]

Quote:

p.s. if you are comfortable with soldering then I would recommend that you solder your own dac/amp.  You will save quite alot of money.

I would agree except for possibly some difficulty on the DAC design like gamma 1 or gamma 2, it will be difficult to troubleshoot if you run into trouble... troubleshooting is beyond basic soldering skills.
 
AMB has many good designs, I would recommend you contact TomB who runs (http://www.beezar.com/), hopefully this isn't against the rules to plug someone... I know he's personally active in these forums and last time I contact him I was very happy with our discussion. He sells the pretty simple to assemble AlienDAC if I remember right.
 
I myself plan to be very happy with Audio-GD from what I read on these forums, I have yet to make up my mind yet.

 

[dxanex]

I own both as well. There's absolutely no comparison. To me at least the K702 sounds vastly superior. The HD280s sound muddy and bloated to me now. It's hard for me to even go back to them.