[mocenigo]

   
Thanks for clarifying the matter. If looking for a matching preamp, what kind of input sensitivity would be ideal (millivolts)?  Granted, you can use the x20 attenuation without any penalty but it's still nice to have decent range on the external preamp's volume control.

 
No idea, actually, sorry.  Anything starting with 1V I guess allows to have a good range while at the same time not forcing to reduce the volume of the Gustard too much.
 
 

You might like to check again at around the 130 hour mark because, for me at least, things started to settle properly at that point. YMMV though.

 
I am not sure what do you mean here. The Gustard's volume control can rotate indefinitely and the white dot can be at different "hours" for the same volume level if it has been rotated, say, while turned off.
 
 
 Roberto

 

[BrainFood]

I meant that SQ improved after five days or so of use from new

 

[mresseguie]

Hello, everyone.
 
As you can see this is my first post to Head-Fi. Over time, I've been an occasional lurker on this website, but I've been a nearly constant lurker since I began reading this thread recently. I wish to thank all of you for contributing and to a big thumbs up to stuartmc for getting this ball rolling.
 
I'm in the market for a DAC and prior to discovering this thread I had narrowed my list down to three DACS. These were Nuprime DAC-10, Schiit Gungir Multibit, and Audio-gd NFB-7. After reading this thread (and finally reading some impressions of the NFB-7), I have added the Gustard X20 to my list and removed the NFB-7.
 
The X20 seems to fit my wants as well or better than the other two except, perhaps, that it lacks analog input and has just a single optical input (though these are minor points). The Schiit DAC has just one of each as well. 
 
I recall one poster mentioning the DAC-10 very briefly as being inferior. Does anyone else have experience using the DAC-10/10H? If so, what were your impressions?
 
I also recall more than one poster preferring the X20 over the Gungir Multibit. Can anyone offer more input on this?
 
I'd estimate that I'm within one and a half months of purchasing a new DAC, so do not expect me to announce that I have joined the good ship Gustard until then. I'm currently overseas. 

 
I may be able to help you out a bit with the Chinese manual or various websites as I majored in Mandarin ages ago and I lived in Taiwan (same language) for nearly 20 years. Actually, I'm back in Taiwan now until mid-March. Normally (whatever that is) I live in Oregon. Just because I speak and read Mandarin do not think I'm a master of technical Chinese - it's much more difficult, so be patient, please.
 
Best regards,
 
Michael

 

[hyperdanny]

tonight (Euro time)  I am going to have a listening session..I will try -9,.....and I will try again the download of the manual ..

 

[mocenigo]

 
I meant that SQ improved after five days or so of use from new

AAAAAAH i though it was a typo for 13 or 1300 hour mark... So it was the close it gets to the 168 hours before it can be easily returned (7 days) the better it sounds

Roberto, whose Gustard is steadily improving as it closes to the 168 hours mark

 

[wwmhf]

  Hello, everyone.
 
As you can see this is my first post to Head-Fi. Over time, I've been an occasional lurker on this website, but I've been a nearly constant lurker since I began reading this thread recently. I wish to thank all of you for contributing and to a big thumbs up to stuartmc for getting this ball rolling.
 
I'm in the market for a DAC and prior to discovering this thread I had narrowed my list down to three DACS. These were Nuprime DAC-10, Schiit Gungir Multibit, and Audio-gd NFB-7. After reading this thread (and finally reading some impressions of the NFB-7), I have added the Gustard X20 to my list and removed the NFB-7.
 
The X20 seems to fit my wants as well or better than the other two except, perhaps, that it lacks analog input and has just a single optical input (though these are minor points). The Schiit DAC has just one of each as well. 
 
I recall one poster mentioning the DAC-10 very briefly as being inferior. Does anyone else have experience using the DAC-10/10H? If so, what were your impressions?
 
I also recall more than one poster preferring the X20 over the Gungir Multibit. Can anyone offer more input on this?
 
I'd estimate that I'm within one and a half months of purchasing a new DAC, so do not expect me to announce that I have joined the good ship Gustard until then. I'm currently overseas. 

 
I may be able to help you out a bit with the Chinese manual or various websites as I majored in Mandarin ages ago and I lived in Taiwan (same language) for nearly 20 years. Actually, I'm back in Taiwan now until mid-March. Normally (whatever that is) I live in Oregon. Just because I speak and read Mandarin do not think I'm a master of technical Chinese - it's much more difficult, so be patient, please.
 
Best regards,
 
Michael

 
Welcome to the discussions, Michael. Looking forward to your inputs. 

 

[otisbass]

  Hi Otisbass
 
Congratulations on the X20 purchase and welcome to the forum
 
If you are into upsampling (Foobar,JRiver,HQPlayer,JPlay) and your PC is powerful enough (2000+ on JRiver benchmark using Windows 10)  then use the WaveIO Thesycon XMOS 2.2 driver to upsample to DSD256 on the U12 and then use a standard HDMI cable to connect the U12 to the X20. The X20 will then process DSD256.
 
I used Chodi's Gustard modified Thesycon 2.23 XMOS driver http://www.speedyshare.com/RXMDH/Luckit-2.23-for-Gustard-U12.rar
And successfully installed on Windows 10 64bit using the 'unsigned driver' advanced setting mode. I have set the WaveIO driver buffer to 'extra safe'.
 
This produced a noticeable improvement on PCM and even DSD128 upsample.

 
Thanks for that. I hadn't discovered the JRiver benchmark tool. Unfortunately my aged Dell only managed a JR Mark of 1459 but this explains why it will produce DSD64 and 128 but not 256. I'll try the modded driver you've suggested.

 

[stuartmc]

   
Welcome to the discussions, Michael. Looking forward to your inputs. 

Yes Michael, welcome aboard.  Perhaps we can put those Mandarin skills to good use.

 

[stuartmc]

  hi - I'm a newbie to Headfi and I've been lurking on this thread for a few weeks. In fact, largely based on reviewers comments regarding the X20 on this forum I decided at Christmas to take the plunge and order one. It arrived yesterday.
 
I have been using a Weiss DAC2 which I'm sure many of you will be familiar with. It's a serious, pro DAC built in Switzerland and has a gorgeous sound. Lately, I had been using it with the Gustard U12 DDC as the Weiss had no USB input and the U12 allowed me to run SPDIF to the Weiss. I was hugely impressed with the U12, another reason why I was tempted by the X20.
 
I've had a couple of evenings with the X20 now and quite honestly I'm taken aback by the quality of this product at its price. To my ears, it comfortably performs as well if not better than the Weiss. In what ways better? - well, it seems to have a degree more clarity, acoustic tones are very natural, sound staging is pretty good too although I've not really focused too much on that so far. 
 
I'm running the X20 directly into a Conrad Johnson LP70S power amp which works just great. Overall, two days in, I'm really pleased with this product. I've still to work out whether I think it makes any difference running a USB connection directly into the X20 or whether I should keep the U12 in the chain and use its I2S connection. Folk may have views on that.
 
The other thing I should say is that I've got it working with both El Capitan OSX and Windows 10 - on Windows I'm using the Thesycon 2.23 driver. Would there be any benefit in trying a more up to date driver?    

Thanks for the report.  I'm familiar with the Weis Dac2, but have not had the pleasure of auditioning one, nonetheless, I'm not surprised that the X20 holds up well in comparison.  I know a price/performance over-achiever when I hear one! LOL. Give the X20 another four or five days of solid burn-in and please report back on your A/B comparisons with the Weiss.

 

[mocenigo]

By the way, if anybody has a DAC with a high output and no volume control, there are devices like the emotiva Control Freak http://emotiva.com/products/electronics/control-freak which may make a DAC like the X-Sabre better useable with flexibility (and the advantage is that the attenuation is variable)
 
Roberto

 

[gulakpi]

  By the way, if anybody has a DAC with a high output and no volume control, there are devices like the emotiva Control Freak http://emotiva.com/products/electronics/control-freak which may make a DAC like the X-Sabre better useable with flexibility (and the advantage is that the attenuation is variable)
 
Roberto

Thanks!  Looks pretty substantial!

 

[mocenigo]

Btw,it seems that the one I got is a bit different from the promo photos (those on page 1 of this thread): some components have a different color and a capacitor has been replaced by a couple of capacitors, and there are holes on the lid (also on the bottom) to guarantee some aeration of the DAC and analog output part - one can even see green LEDs through the holes (but not on my photo).
 

 

 

[SimonBromley]

That looks like mine does. I think there was an original 
batch of 200 made, which early adopters like stuartmc got.
Then I guess we got the final production run examples, with 
a few tweaks here and there eg:- power switch, cable routing 
and minor component changes. 

For the money, all the parts seem to be pretty decent quality.
 
With the AUTO function on, I think? the X20 references the clock 
of the source (DDC/USB/Transport). Therefore, a high quality clock 
in your source may prove to be particularly beneficial if you use this 
setting ...
 
I'm wondering if there's perhaps a bit of FIFO action going on in that 
big Altera Max chip. Then again, my knowledge of these things is 
pretty rudimentary, and I'm just guessing here.
 
However, the U12 has been around for a while now, and been very 
successful. They could easily keep that as an entry model, and 
make a more advanced version with better power and clocks. Given 
the growing market for DDC devices, this would make sense and 
particularly compliment the X20 in AUTO mode. Or, maybe that's just
wishful thinking from me. Lol ...
 
Anyway, beyond adding the WaveIO card, I can't see me doing any 
electrical modifications, as that side of things seems pretty well 
sorted. However, I've replaced the existing 2mm dividing panels with 
6mm aluminium panels, and added extra screening around the transformer 
compartment. ( read somewhere thick aluminium can help reduce EMI a bit )
Next will be screening off the more sensitive areas of the X20's pcbs 
(clocks/DAC chips etc) from their PSU sections, and see if it makes a 
difference. If it does, great. If not, no harm done and no cost to me 
as I've got all the necessary stuff lying round.
 
I'm still awaiting delivery of my PCIe riser card, to see if I can link 
the WaveIO direct into the X20's I2S lines. Hopefully I can make it 
work, but I'm sure there will be much head scratching and swearing
involved before I do. Lol ...
 
Anyway, hope everyone's enjoying their X20's
 
Cheers
 
Simon

 

[chrispiyux]

Hi,
 
mine looks also exactly the same you. I think Simon gave the good reason.
 
So, are you using Normal or Auto mode now ? Until now i was using Auto mode, but after reading the explanation of this mode, i was thinking : maybe the clock of my source (optimized Mac Mini) is not so good as the DAC clock (i don't know, really).
 
Then i switched in normal mode but i have an issue in this mode : my DAC is my central piece of my Hifi and TV system, so my TV is connected to my DAC using optical cable. In normal mode, with my TV, the DAC is always switching between LOCK and UNLOCK, so the sound is stopping, restarting and so on..
With my MAC no problem.
 
Do you have an idea ? I try changing the cable and the issure remains . In this mode i would have thought the clock would be independant from the quality of the source...
 
Thanks for your help.

 

[mocenigo]

  Hi,
 
mine looks also exactly the same you. I think Simon gave the good reason.
 
So, are you using Normal or Auto mode now ? Until now i was using Auto mode, but after reading the explanation of this mode, i was thinking : maybe the clock of my source (optimized Mac Mini) is not so good as the DAC clock (i don't know, really).

 
Thank you, this makes sense to me. Also, manufacturers sometimes DO change some specs in minor revisions which are not even advertised, so I do not think we have seen the last version.
 
I use the normal mode. Auto sounds a bit shrill to me. I have used only two coax cables - first an old interconnect (not meant for S/PDIF) and the DAC would unlock sometimes turning some lights on, then a Gotham GAC-1 S/PDIF-Pro with simple Neutral Rean RCA connectors, which seems to work nice.
 
 Roberto