[Ashirgo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ /img/forum/go_quote.gif While I prefer a 0 ohm output with all headphones I've auditioned, it can't be called the only correct way of listening. Different people have different ears (and gear) and moreover individual sonic ideals. .

Ideally, a low output impedance means better control & tight bass, but indeed, if one prefers warm and "vibrant" bass and little to no control, it is up to them. But they should not claim to "hear" additional details, it is just another colouration. I do not question the fact that HD 800 may be more pleasant that way, though.

 

[subtle]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericj /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thank you for confirming my suspicion that this headphone has no bass slam.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pearljam5000 /img/forum/go_quote.gif No bass=

Where do people keep coming up with these ridiculous assessments based on what they read in HD800 threads?

They have plenty of bass and more than you can handle depending on what tracks, and at what quality, you feed them.

Stop the nonsense already. Try hearing them for yourself instead of doing nothing but speculating. That would make logical sense after all.

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashirgo /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ideally, a low output impedance means better control & tight bass, but indeed, if one prefers warm and "vibrant" bass and little to no control, it is up to them. But they should not claim to "hear" additional details, it is just another colouration. I do not question the fact that HD 800 may be more pleasant that way, though.

I would agree that the frequency response ist flatter at 0 ohm. But given the often reported treble emphasis (which my pair also [still] has, although to an acceptable degree), the sonic balance may be more even with higher serial impedance to some ears.


Quote:

Originally Posted by subtle /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where do people keep coming up with these ridiculous assessments based on what they read in HD800 threads? They have plenty of bass and more than you can handle depending on what tracks, and at what quality, you feed them. Stop the nonsense already. Try hearing them for yourself instead of doing nothing but speculating. That would make logical sense after all.

I agree. But sometimes an emotive keyword popping up suffices to see the own preconception confirmed, irrespective of the parallel positive voices.
.

 

[rhythmdevils]

seems to me that if they had enough bass, we wouldn't have so many people thinking that they didn't. Ideally a headphone wouldn't have to sacrifice bass for clarity. It's kind of a cheap and dirty way to find it, IMO. JH13pro manages to pull it off quite gracefully...

 

[KingStyles]

In some music the bass is just fine. In pop and some rock though, the bass is too tight and dosent have enough reverb to do it the song justice.

 

[kelvinz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by subtle /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where do people keep coming up with these ridiculous assessments based on what they read in HD800 threads? They have plenty of bass and more than you can handle depending on what tracks, and at what quality, you feed them. Stop the nonsense already. Try hearing them for yourself instead of doing nothing but speculating. That would make logical sense after all.

Here's how I'd rate bass quantity based on my ownership/auditions

K701<K1000<HD800<HF2<HD650<ESW9A<L3000<O2<D7000

 

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhythmdevils /img/forum/go_quote.gif seems to me that if they had enough bass, we wouldn't have so many people thinking that they didn't. Ideally a headphone wouldn't have to sacrifice bass for clarity. It's kind of a cheap and dirty way to find it, IMO. JH13pro manages to pull it off quite gracefully...

People have unreasonable and unrealistic expectations of bass.

Have you heard about the various studies where people have come to enjoy the hot, sizzling sound of a lossy MP3?

Do you know why so much compression is put into CDs? That's because people enjoy the sound of compression.

Can you see where this is going?

People also love the sound of overemphasized, sloppy, fuzzy and horrible bass. You can find that everywhere. All cheapo (and many expensive) subwoofers are designed to produce their own thick sound with lots of "feel" and sub cabinets are designed with lots of resonances and other tricks to make the bass more palpable.

Well, how does the MP3 sizzle, compression and sloppy, overemphasized bass relate to the real world of sound?

It doesn't.

If you listen to an upright bass at jazz club it sounds like a HD-800. Really, it does. It also sounds a lot like the K-501, a DT 48 or an electrostat.

But there's no slam!

Duh. There isn't any slam in real life. Go listen for yourself.

You only get that kind of slam in real life when you're at a rock concert where they are using fuzzy, wooly, resonant woofers that are in colored cabinets being driven into distortion fed by amps that are driven into distortion.

If you want to hear what bass sounds like in the real world, the HD-800 nails it.

If you want a bloated, sloppy and offensive mess, go get yourself a Darth Beyer.

Complaining about the HD-800 bass is exactly the same as moaning about how turntable makes everything sound richer than a MP3 or a SACD makes everything "too quiet."

Or another way to put it, you might prefer chocolate milk to regular milk. That's fine. But don't rail against regular milk because it doesn't naturally taste like chocolate.

 

[feifan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've noticed, by the way, that not everyone has quite the same degree of upper-mids and treble peaks as those with early serial numbers. It has made me wonder about people's different impressions of them.

The "treble peaks" are actually an optical illusion. If you take a straight edge to the graphs that have been posted for the HD800, you'll notice that the apparent "peak" at 6kHz actually lines up with the flat that runs though the entire spectrum. In fact, there is no peak. The illusion of a peak is caused by the dip at 3kHz -- and 3kHz is precisely the range where fatigue becomes a factor. My guess is that the Sennheiser engineers have consciously de-emphasized the 3kHz range to reduce the fatigue factor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by subtle /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where do people keep coming up with these ridiculous assessments based on what they read in HD800 threads? They have plenty of bass and more than you can handle depending on what tracks, and at what quality, you feed them. Stop the nonsense already. Try hearing them for yourself instead of doing nothing but speculating. That would make logical sense after all.

x2! It's amazing how certain some people can be about a piece of equipment that they've never tested themselves.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xoton /img/forum/go_quote.gif It sounds like the 800s might be the perfect can for me. 'Cept for the ridiculous price. So, for now, I'll continue on with the Ety's for balance and detail and the 650s for gorgeous bass and overall sound. Both can be had two times over, for the price of the 800s.

I respect your decision. I think we each must place a price tag on quality and at some point draw a line in the sand and say, "This is it. I won't cross that line even if it might mean settling for less."

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Its a free country,you are welcome to your views,as am I.

Having opinions and stating them in a public forum are two different things. In the latter, expect supporters as well as detractors. In both cases, the common currency is logic and evidence. In public forums, words aren't "free." There can be consequences for insensitive or thoughtless words.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I did not mention Grado's price fixing because this thread is about the HD800.

You're avoiding the question.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Am still waiting for Senn to explain WHY in Australia they cost $2000us against $1400us in the USA.

Why don't you ask them? Or do some research? There might be a very simple answer that has more to do with business costs than a conspiracy to cheat Aussies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif And by the way you do not make much of a profit selling limited numbers of expensive phones.

What makes you think profit in HD800 sales is Sennheiser's primary motivation for developing and offering these 'phones? I don't know if they're making a profit or not. But they may have some very good reasons that have nothing to do with HD800 sales. R&D and statement products are often a means to better or advance the field, and they may not represent direct profits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif And have you ever thought how much it actually costs to make them,you would be in for a big surprise.

OK, surprise us, big time, by telling us "how much it actually costs to make them."

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I will stand by my post,if Senn wish these phones to be a big long term seller then they should LOWER the price.

This statement ignores the possibility that quality comes with a price tag. Lowering the price just might mean lowering the quality. One of the cost factors is the hands-on testing that's done on each HD800. Each, individually, is tested and fine tuned by not one but a bunch of engineers to achieve the desired sonic quality. This step alone is labor intensive and pretty much guarantees that the cost won't go down.

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhythmdevils /img/forum/go_quote.gif seems to me that if they had enough bass, we wouldn't have so many people thinking that they didn't.

A neutral sounding headphone won't please all people – many will complain: «Where's the bass?» The same goes for speakers. But I won't make a dogmatic statement out of it. Some like enhanced bass and some like a neutral response, others will perceive the bass as too thin although metrologically it isn't... Ears are different, and so are sonic ideals. Personally I don't want more bass than the HD 800 delivers.
.

 

[rhythmdevils]

or maybe you just prefer anemic bass

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhythmdevils /img/forum/go_quote.gif or maybe you just prefer anemic bass

Not that I know of.

But as said, sonic ideals and ears are different, moreover listening to music through headphones is an unnatural way of listening to music.

So there are different ways of psychoacoustic compensations for the artificialness (particularly in view of visceral impact, but also early bass drop-offs), and one of it is a bass emphasis. Personally I don't need it. I prefer low-frequency extension instead.
.

 

[Geek]

All right, guys.

I have heard the HD800s sound bassless on some equipment which I will not name out of respect.

I currently listen to them on headroom amps and DACs. They have earth shattering lows on this equipment. All of my friends, audiophile and non audiophile, disagree about different aspects of the HD800 (the high end is respectably something still of debate on my gear) but EVERYONE has concluded that the 800s have awe-inspiring lows. Period.

Don't shoot the messenger!!!

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you listen to an upright bass at jazz club it sounds like a HD-800. Really, it does. It also sounds a lot like the K-501, a DT 48 or an electrostat. But there's no slam! Duh. There isn't any slam in real life. Go listen for yourself.

I have done further listening and I was going to say that the HD800 has no bass or treble. It does let through the lower registers and delicate upper overtones of instruments and/or voices. But the HD800 is not producing bass or treble itself via resonances or distortion. It is not "attaching" bass and treble to everything.

I have been using music with known deep bass information and it is there, listening through the HD800. But I don't think about bass, treble et al. When something that contains those elements comes on, I hear it properly, or in proper form. But there is no constant parade line of omnipresent bass and treble. If you want that try something else.

I really like the hear-through aspect of the HD800. I can follow rhythmic lines from start to finish. Nothing clutters up or collides with each other. This is something else that you hear with live music.

I have some more stuff to listen to and I'll get back later.

 

[ford2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by feifan /img/forum/go_quote.gif This statement ignores the possibility that quality comes with a price tag. Lowering the price just might mean lowering the quality. One of the cost factors is the hands-on testing that's done on each HD800. Each, individually, is tested and fine tuned by not one but a bunch of engineers to achieve the desired sonic quality. This step alone is labor intensive and pretty much guarantees that the cost won't go down.

You have spent far to much time reading Senn's marketing blurbs,still coming from a country where marketing blurbs are gospel it does not surprise me.
There seem to be a lot of HD800 owners that that set out to justify there purchase by jumping on anyone that dares to say that the product is not the ultimate in headphones.

If you have to justify it then there is doubt,whilst there is doubt you will not be content,but you can console yourself with the fact that its the amp not the phones,just needs a $2000 upgrade and all will be revealed.

I am out of here,will leave all you fb's to congratulate each other on your astute purchases.

 

[Blackmore]

Are there anyone who can put some TRANCE using HD800 please, like OceanLab, ATB or AIRWAVE please. Actually would like to know where these are good for at most. I always thought that GS1000 were shining with TRIO JAZZ, TRANCE, CLASSIC and very good recorded ROCK music, which is a lot for one headphone to cover, imo...

Personally, I prefer natural instead of neutral sound, to me neutral=boring. Not sure why, but seems that NEUTRAL become some special thing, which to my understanding is nothing else than other creation of sound sig. Its been done before and for way less money, K501, so, whats so special about that. Another thing, is how you combine the neutral sig with some fun, is it possible, dont know, maybe HD800 does such thing, but than again, using high quality, which often arent cheap, components only. But most of the time all that thing are not important, cos when you put the music on you like, but dont hear what you like, boom, neutral or not...