[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by coco Personnally, I loved your comparison. It's about time we had some fresh ideas here. You go girl! Thanks for your impressions!

Thanks for your appreciation

but... I'M A MAN! Andrea is a male name here in Italy!

bye
Andrew (maybe it's more clear...

)

 

[coco]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Thanks for your appreciation but... I'M A MAN! Andrea is a male name here in Italy! bye Andrew (maybe it's more clear... )

Dude, I am sorry about that. You go you big burly man you!

 

[fewtch]

LOL... feel the testosterone love flow freely...

 

[sacd lover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch We all know that the HD650 has a damped-down mid-treble region, which is a good thing in terms of preventing brightness/sibilance, but it also directly affects perception of the sonic signature of the headphone. I'm not claiming it good or bad, only going by my experiences with live music and how real it sounds... if a headphone can fool me (or come close) into believing that I'm listening to live music, I can forgive it everything else. To me, the real measure of performance is: Is it a chameleon that takes on the character of the music, or does it strongly impart its own signature to everything you play through it?

Thats why I cant handle the dt880. I find the 880 imparts to much of its signature on the music. The treble sounds to tipped up in comparison to the mids and bass and consequently makes the sound to etched and brittle. The 880's treble peak is especially noticeable on any music with lots of high frequency content. I seem to be able to tolerate the senn 650's omission of treble far more than I can tolerate the 880's additions. In the end I still believe the senn 600 bests both of them. The 600 is the most like the live music I use as my referance. I have some akg 701's coming .... maybe this headphone can best the 600??

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by coco Dude, I am sorry about that. You go you big burly man you!

LOL!

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sacd lover Thats why I cant handle the dt880. I find the 880 imparts to much of its signature on the music. The treble sounds to tipped up in comparison to the mids and bass

Not nearly as tipped up as the HD600 is "tipped down" IMO.

Quote:

and consequently makes the sound to etched and brittle.

I only have this problem with poor recordings (of which there are many, but that's nothing I haven't always been aware of). Well recorded material sounds perfect to my ears, with the treble merely lending a lively, energetic character -- not a coloration per-se, more a style of presentation. Advice: Avoid Grados!!!

Quote:

The 880's treble peak is especially noticeable on any music with lots of high frequency content. I seem to be able to tolerate the senn 650's omission of treble far more than I can tolerate the 880's additions.

I can only assume you listen to lots of music with more than usual high frequency content. Listening to well recorded classical, there's no real treble peak in evidence (particularly after burn-in of the headphones). But to each their own ears.

P.S. not to say DT880 is perfect. Occasionally I could do with a bit less peakiness in the treble, but it's not enough of an issue to bother me, more a preference with certain recordings. Usually I'll just throw on the AKG K501, which is mellower up top.

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Man, stop it. It's you that have tried to offend my posts, not me.

Actually, I hadn't cared to read the text of your post with the two images. It's purely the images themselves that irritated me -- as a matter of principle, one of acceptable and inacceptable mental associations. And it's the second time I've seen those two images, you know...

And that's what brought me over the edge. It's not about you strictly, it's about this trivial (in my personal opinion) idea that those images were trying to pass as worthy and useful, while in fact it's quite misleading in my opinion, not to say in sharp contrast with my own experiences (for the Senn side of it).

 

[Towert7]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Actually, I hadn't cared to read the text of your post with the two images. It's purely the images themselves that irritated me -- as a matter of principle, one of acceptable and inacceptable mental associations. And it's the second time I've seen those two images, you know... And that's what brought me over the edge. It's not about you strictly, it's about this trivial (in my personal opinion) idea that those images were trying to pass as worthy and useful, while in fact it's quite misleading in my opinion, not to say in sharp contrast with my own experiences (for the Senn side of it).

I think I speak for a few people when I say ... give it a rest... please for the love of all that is good and holy.

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano I've found the DT880 more "luminous" and warm than HD650. Not better, just different in colors and brightness. I try to explane with two images: DT880 (more warm and "luminous") HD650 (more cold and "dark")

I for one find this sort of analogies very helpful and illustrative. I really like analogies between aural and visual perceptions. Also the implementation in this concrete case isn't too implausible IMO: The HD 650's smoothness can absolutely be perceived as coolish sleekness; so despite the dark signature it may appear as somewhat cool in comparison with the «sunnier» DT 880. Maybe it's because I like the slight coolness in the HD 650 (after all originating from its low distortion and lack of resonances!) that I don't feel offended at all by this characterization -- which overall is quite adequate to my eyes and ears.

On the other hand the DT 880 has a fair amount of this sleekness as well, just paired with a less smooth sonic balance. A treble hump is generally considered more harmful than a treble dip, so I felt the HD 650 to be more enjoyable and more even. And there's also the more fundamental bass. It didn't help that the DT 880 had the greater bass extension -- there was always a slight treble dominance which prevented the bass from being full and black and thumping (or is it due to the just semi-open design?) with music dependent on this feature, such as e.g. triphop (Archive's wonderful «Londinium» comes to mind). On the other hand the treble hump never made it sound harsh or sharp or sibilant; it's a high-quality, highly resolving treble nonetheless, which shines with cymbals and brass and also does violins passably justice. But still the HD 650's smoother treble sounded more refined and finally more realistic to me. However, I can absolutely understand the preference for the DT 880, and the HD 650 was sort of a «dark version» of the DT 880 when it came out -- although today I consider the differences a bit larger.
.

 

[Xplo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Which image is more real? We don't know.

As a Photoshop nerd, I vote for the first one; the second picture is noticibly clipped in the shadows. It was obvious that both had been edited though.








(offtopic? what?)

 

[Ervinos]

I liked the pictures as well - & find it hard to understand how they could be construed as in any way 'unintelligent' or some such thing. We can't describe the sensation of hearing music literally - by necessity we need to draw upon analogies, metaphors and images. So headphones can be 'dark', or 'bright', etc, etc. These are not literal, objective descriptions because that is always beyond us. So with the pictures - I'm sure almost everybody that looked at them 'got' what was being communicated.

And I am not sticking up for you just because you are a girl Andrea (only joking big man)!

 

[MrJoshua]

Me again!

My DT990 Pro's arrived (again lol) today.

Just listening to them now... Initial thoughts are they sound fine, but I'm only listening at low volume for now until they've broken in a little more.

Good service from Studiocare Professional Audio Ltd. from Liverpool. I'm impressed they turned these around so quickly. I got a brand new pair in the end.

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ However, I can absolutely understand the preference for the DT 880, and the HD 650 was sort of a «dark version» of the DT 880 when it came out -- although today I consider the differences a bit larger. .

Thanks Jazz, I'm very happy you understood what I'm trying to say.

In the same way, I can absolutely understand the preference for the HD650. I bought the DT880 because I found in it a "clear version" of the HD650 (with also a slightly different "color balance", you know what I'm meaning now...

), which was what I was looking for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ervinos I liked the pictures as well - & find it hard to understand how they could be construed as in any way 'unintelligent' or some such thing. We can't describe the sensation of hearing music literally - by necessity we need to draw upon analogies, metaphors and images. So headphones can be 'dark', or 'bright', etc, etc. These are not literal, objective descriptions because that is always beyond us. So with the pictures - I'm sure almost everybody that looked at them 'got' what was being communicated.

Yup Ervinos

exactly what I intended with this "picture play".
With those two cans it was "easy" (maybe because both are balanced)... with other headphones it would be probably impossible to try to "summarize" with images (but with words we use anyway terms taken by visual sense...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ervinos And I am not sticking up for you just because you are a girl Andrea (only joking big man)!

Andrew

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrJoshua My DT990 Pro's arrived (again lol) today.

Good Music, man! I like my DT990 very much.

Andrew

 

[imported_t_s]

nice going josh. glad to hear things worked out.


question - am I the only one who thinks violins sound really unrealistic with the senns? That's probably the main thing that bugs me about them.