[Peti]

I just got ahold of a digital version of an album produced by a very respectable "native DSD" label. The initial format is DSD256 which my DAC cannot handle so I have downconverted the files to 24/192 to experience "TRUE DSD Recordings" at 24/192. I did the downconversion with Foobar 2k. After that, I went to Spek to see the spectrogram of that 24/192, and most shockingly, I saw  buzzcut at 22.05 KHz! I did downconvert them to 24/96, 24/48, 16/44.1 (always from the original DSD file) and always got the same result: a buzzcut at 22.05 KHz.
 
This is the album I'm talking about: https://yarlungrecords.nativedsd.com/albums/mahler-symphony-no-5#
 
"Yarlung recorded this album directly to two tracks of RMGI 468 analog tape running at 15 ips, with no mixer.  We used the Hapi converter and Pyramix software from Merging Technologies in Switzerland to make these transfers to DSD.  Our sincere thanks to George Klissarov and exaSound for making these releases possible."
 
I think it's impossible for a record like that to have a buzzcut at 22.05 KHz so I assume that Foobar screwed up the downconversion?

 

[RRod]

  I just got ahold of a digital version of an album produced by a very respectable "native DSD" label. The initial format is DSD256 which my DAC cannot handle so I have downconverted the files to 24/192 to experience "TRUE DSD Recordings" at 24/192. I did the downconversion with Foobar 2k. After that, I went to Spek to see the spectrogram of that 24/192, and most shockingly, I saw  buzzcut at 22.05 KHz! I did downconvert them to 24/96, 24/48, 16/44.1 (always from the original DSD file) and always got the same result: a buzzcut at 22.05 KHz.
 
This is the album I'm talking about: https://yarlungrecords.nativedsd.com/albums/mahler-symphony-no-5#
 
"Yarlung recorded this album directly to two tracks of RMGI 468 analog tape running at 15 ips, with no mixer.  We used the Hapi converter and Pyramix software from Merging Technologies in Switzerland to make these transfers to DSD.  Our sincere thanks to George Klissarov and exaSound for making these releases possible."
 
I think it's impossible for a record like that to have a buzzcut at 22.05 KHz so I assume that Foobar screwed up the downconversion?

 
 
Can you upload a small clip (<10s) of the original DSD somewhere so we can take a look? Since it's Mahler 5, make sure it's not the first 10s :3

 

[VNandor]

I've just downloaded a DSD64 file  here: https://www.oppodigital.com/hra/dsd-by-davidelias.aspx
 
According to foobar2000 its sample rate is 44100Hz and it takes up 5645kbit of space/sec so in my case the 22.05kHz cutoff makes sense.
 
I don't know much about DSD, having high sample rate is a must for them?

 

[Peti]

Unfortunately I can't clip the DSD file for a teaser. It's a big a** DSD 256 file, like 10 gigs big.

   
 
Can you upload a small clip (<10s) of the original DSD somewhere so we can take a look? Since it's Mahler 5, make sure it's not the first 10s :3

Unfortunately I can't clip the DSD file for a teaser. It's a big a** DSD 256 file, like 10 gigs big.

 

[Peti]

  I've just downloaded a DSD64 file  here: https://www.oppodigital.com/hra/dsd-by-davidelias.aspx
 
According to foobar2000 its sample rate is 44100Hz and it takes up 5645kbit of space/sec so in my case the 22.05kHz cutoff makes sense.
 
I don't know much about DSD, having high sample rate is a must for them?

The whole theory about native DSD is that it, supposedly, makes a difference if the record process was made DSD as well. In that case, you can be able to hear the difference, they say. As my DAC won't support DSD stuff, I figured I downsample some native DSD recordings to see if it indeed makes any difference. Or I might be just plain wrong here. Hope someone can help me out as I'm just getting into this subject...

 

[RRod]

  I've just downloaded a DSD64 file  here: https://www.oppodigital.com/hra/dsd-by-davidelias.aspx
 
According to foobar2000 its sample rate is 44100Hz and it takes up 5645kbit of space/sec so in my case the 22.05kHz cutoff makes sense.
 
I don't know much about DSD, having high sample rate is a must for them?

 
DSD64 has a sampling rate 64x the CD (64x44100=2822400). Since it's a 1-bit format, it needs all that extra frequency range for shaping the huge amounts of distortion/noise. If I run that file through my haxed version of SoX that supports DSD, I get:

 
 
That little green area at the bottom is the actual musical content. If we convert it to CD format we get:

 
If we went to 24/192 instead, we'd get:

 
Note that much of the content above 20kHz is still noise.
 

  Unfortunately I can't clip the DSD file for a teaser. It's a big a** DSD 256 file, like 10 gigs big.

 
Yeah, that's the problem with this format.

 

[Peti]

Yeah, that's all true and thanks for the images. But I still can't figure why the 24/192 sample of my DSD256 is buzzcut on the spectrogram at 22.05KHz. Is there a better way to downsample the DSD256 file to 24/192 or 24/96?

 

[RRod]

  Yeah, that's all true and thanks for the images. But I still can't figure why the 24/192 sample of my DSD256 is buzzcut on the spectrogram at 22.05KHz. Is there a better way to downsample the DSD256 file to 24/192 or 24/96?

 
I have no experience with foobar's DSD conversion. The contributed SoX support for DSD works like a champ, but you'd have to compile it yourself. Anyone else have a favorite DSD conversion tool?

 

[Peti]

Yep, I've been using the SoX DSP with the Foobar2k.

 

[VNandor]

 DSD64 has a sampling rate 64x the CD (64x44100=2822400). Since it's a 1-bit format, it needs all that extra frequency range for shaping the huge amounts of distortion/noise. If I run that file through my haxed version of SoX that supports DSD, I get:

 

So why does foobar say it's only 44.1kHz? Is it because my DAC doesn't support DSD and downconverts it to 44.1kHz despite being set to 96kHz?

 

[RRod]

 
 

So why does foobar say it's only 44.1kHz? Is it because my DAC doesn't support DSD and downconverts it to 44.1kHz despite being set to 96kHz?

 
No idea. The data rate is spot on and the format is listed correctly. That could indeed be indicated that foobar converts it to 44100, but you'd have to ask someone who uses it for confirmation.

  Yep, I've been using the SoX DSP with the Foobar2k.

 
The standard SoX doesn't have DSD support, so foobar probably isn't using SoX for the conversion.

 

[limpidglitch]

I was about to suggest downloading one of the DSD256 samples from 2L and see if the problem persists, but do anyone else have trouble reaching their server? 

 

[RRod]

  I was about to suggest downloading one of the DSD256 samples from 2L and see if the problem persists, but do anyone else have trouble reaching their server? 

 
No problems from 'murka!

 

[Peti]

 
 

So why does foobar say it's only 44.1kHz? Is it because my DAC doesn't support DSD and downconverts it to 44.1kHz despite being set to 96kHz?

Now that's interesting!

 

[Peti]

Just got ahold of another digital copy of the same album, and here is track No1: