[Sonic Defender]

I can use them quite easily with my Hugo 2 in my backyard (or anywhere around the house) or with my FiiO M11Pro. Heck, even the iDSD hip-dad did a fine job.

Really? Do you listen at lower volumes typically?

 

[MacedonianHero]

Really? Do you listen at lower volumes typically?

Nope (up to 85dB-ish peaks)...I can get them plenty loud on high gain. The Hugo2 especially doesn't break a sweat driving them too.

 

[jlbrach]

I find the hugo 2 ok but not really up to the job...I do not mean they dont sound good but I do think thery need more power...for a portable source you cannot beat the ifi signature or new diablo in terms of power

 

[Sonic Defender]

Nope (up to 85dB-ish peaks)...I can get them plenty loud on high gain. The Hugo2 especially doesn't break a sweat driving them too.

See, for me that is lowish level listening. My average would be about 85dB, peaking around 100dB. Mind you I don't have or like long listening sessions so I can tolerate and rather enjoy louder playback volumes because of the shorter listening sessions.

 

[bikutoru]

Occasionally I do use them with my Chord Mojo and not for short listening sessions either.
It is up to the job! How would I know? I do use them with TT2 daily.

 

[MSA1133]

Quiet night on Head-Fi, browsing and listening

 

[up late]

Most definitely measurements can be subjective. Anyone just has to google the term: Gage R&R. Performed on measuring devices to help reduce human error (be it inadvertently or with purpose).

I run an engineering department for a MIL/aerospace manufacturer and for "Bring your kids to work day", I always perform a quick mini-gage R&R on measuring the length of a table with 3 devices (a 30cm ruler, 1m ruler and a 25ft measuring tape) between 3 groups of kids. Funny, they ALL get different measurements of the table length in our boardroom...even when using the same device. In the end, all of the kids have a major sense of disappointment when they see that I'm not able to smash through the table with my bare hand even though I have a Black Belt and I have to tell them that it's the nerdy Lean Six Sigma Black Belt variant.

That said, as I've said many times, for portable headphones where "price is no object", the Diana headphones (both V2 and Phi) are at the top of the list for me.

at the risk of getting into semantics, it may be worth revisiting what subjective and objective means:
"Subjective:
1. based on or influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions.
"his views are highly subjective""

"Objective:
1. (of a person or their judgement) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.
"historians try to be objective and impartial"
not dependent on the mind for existence; actual.
"a matter of objective fact""

your example shows that three groups of kids all measured the table differently with the measurement tools provided. some of the measurements may have been accurate or perhaps none of them were. either way, it can be shown which of the kids table measurements came closest to the actual length of the table by measuring it more accurately. that is the objective part of the exercise. the subjective part is their disappointment.

if this 'passionate' debate over asr's review and measurements of the diana v2 shows anything, it is that the headphone community doesn't seem to be any closer to agreeing on a methodology for measuring a headphone's performance than when tyll hertsen was taking them for innerfidelity. until then, the debate will most likely continue along partisan lines. it'll probably rage on regardless.

 

[491838]

Instead of looking at a graph and worrying about it, why don't you call up a dealer close to you and try to audition the headphones? If they sound bad, let us know why you think it sounds bad. If it sounds good, let us know why you think it sounds good. If you don't want to listen to them, I'm not sure why you're in this thread.

If the graph is actually accurate (and Tyll's measurement of the old 1266 produced similar results with abysmal distortion which hopefully was fixed in the newer designs) it would sounds pretty aggressive in the mids at the very least (I've heard it in Audeze planars before, but less severe than this graph). Yes, I would be interested in the 1266 personally but I am unable to try them anywhere near my location and a blind buy would be a bad idea based on the data that exists on this headphone. No, I do not really care about "good" reviews because a lot of reviewers are full of crap.

 

[MacedonianHero]

at the risk of getting into semantics, it may be worth revisiting what subjective and objective means:
"Subjective:
1. based on or influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions.
"his views are highly subjective""

"Objective:
1. (of a person or their judgement) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.
"historians try to be objective and impartial"
not dependent on the mind for existence; actual.
"a matter of objective fact""

your example shows that three groups of kids all measured the table differently with the measurement tools provided. some of the measurements may have been accurate or perhaps none of them were. either way, it can be shown which of the kids table measurements came closest to the actual length of the table by measuring it more accurately. that is the objective part of the exercise. the subjective part is their disappointment.

if this 'passionate' debate over asr's review and measurements of the diana v2 shows anything, it is that the headphone community doesn't seem to be any closer to agreeing on a methodology for measuring a headphone's performance than when tyll hertsen was taking them for innerfidelity. until then, the debate will most likely continue along partisan lines. it'll probably rage on regardless.

Here is the thing, as I mentioned, google Gage R&R. It is our best statistical tool to eliminate these issues and biases with a measurement system.

I actually did a mini one for an article on innerfidelity.com with Tyll and it showed that measuring headphones wasn’t black and white.

 

[Joe Skubinski]

@Dealiux Back then, Tyll's measurements had a higher amount of distortion than our own. I tried to work with him on the problem for months afterward, but he had no interest in looking at his own rig for potential issues, he didn't think it was him. At some point in the future he mentioned that he found many of his cable connections were intermittent, his home was introducing crap into the measurements, etc. Next thing you know, he retired.
Keep in mind that rig was assembled in the 90's. Time flies...

 

[up late]

Here is the thing, as I mentioned, google Gage R&R. It is our best tool to eliminate these issues and biases with a measurement system.

I actually did a mini one for an article on innerfidelity.com with Tull and it showed that measuring headphones wasn’t black and white.

i read that article and agree that measuring headphones is subject to variables - not the least of which are the different measuring methodologies and headphone measurement rigs being used

 

[Northern]

I tried to work with him on the problem for months afterward, but he had no interest in looking at his own rig for potential issues, he didn't think it was him.

Perhaps it was your design all along that was the culprit?
Straight question, do you guys measure your headphones in a scientific manner in the R&D stage? If you do, what hardware do you use?

 

[julien-hifi]

a blind buy would be a bad idea based on the data that exists on this headphone.

If you choose a headphone based on a graph, you’re missing something for me. What i realize is you’re not the only one thinking this way based on what i read, number of asr’s readers and followers. A graph will say it all... hmmm, I really wish it was that simple, so we could trash tubes amps, expensive cables, etc.
After all, it’s your well earned money you’re using, so if you don’t trust your ears, what’s the point? You better save your money and get the best cheap nice graph headphone...until you realize this is not your what you hoped for and wonder: am i missing something? Yes most probably...
And i don’t especially support Abyss btw, i have my part of criticism with the v2, the first one being the quite easy paint chip or the lack of headband (easly fixed with a 15$ budget i know but...), but the sound signature is just the best i have heard so far, to my taste of course, and this is and always will be, very subjective.

 

[491838]

If you choose a headphone based on a graph, you’re missing something for me. What i realize is you’re not the only one thinking this way based on what i read, number of asr’s readers and followers. A graph will say it all... hmmm, I really wish it was that simple, so we could trash tubes amps, expensive cables, etc.
After all, it’s your well earned money you’re using, so if you don’t trust your ears, what’s the point? You better save your money and get the best cheap nice graph headphone...until you realize this is not your what you hoped for and wonder: am i missing something? Yes most probably...
And i don’t especially support Abyss btw, i have my part of criticism with the v2, the first one being the quite easy paint chip or the lack of headband (easly fixed with a 15$ budget i know but...), but the sound signature is just the best i have heard so far, to my taste of course, and this is and always will be, very subjective.

Well, the Susvara measures a lot better and would likely sound better too given the more balanced response but it doesn't have any sort of elevation in the bass to increase bass impact and presence (which is a minus).

I said IF the graphs are accurate that 2K honk looks fairly menacing and I would honestly not be able to deal with it because I'm really picky when it comes to tuning and don't want to hear any resonances like that.

 

[HiFiGuy528]

the product measurements ASR puts out reminds me of the Netflix show "Exhibit A" where dubious forensic techniques and tools are used to convict innocent people. Worth watching if you haven't seen it.