Denon AH-D9200 - 2018 Flagship - Impressions Thread
Feb 12, 2024 at 10:47 AM Post #4,306 of 4,413
u pay the "closed back extra" bounty, but literally they sound like a 500$ open back, without the soundstage.
I beg to differ. I own the Clear MG as well as the 9200s. If I had to sell one to finance another purchase it would be the Focals that would go. That's not to say the Focals as poor, they are on a par with the 9200s but lack the excitement. The Denons are also better than the Focal Radiance that I owned for a short time. Going to have to be a good closed back for me to purchase another one, may be the DCA E3, Ether C Flow or Meze Liric. They will be bought to compliment the Denons not beat them.
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 11:20 AM Post #4,307 of 4,413
Every product worth as much as their retail price or less, but never more.

Hi Rakyan,

While everyone is entitled to their subjective opinion, as yrstruly kindly added, there are market and economic dynamics that are undeniably more objective.

Without getting into complicated marketing and economics, for example, it is a simple fact that products in the market retail for a price.
Prices are determined by many factors, and then are considered fair, high or low by consumers depending on the subjective impressions of the consumers asked to pay those prices. The economic fact is that a price is just a number until someone actually pays it.

Items in a market also have what I will call "cost", meaning their cost of production, knowhow, profits, etc.
There are many items priced "highly", expected to perform "highly", whatever highly means depending on the category because they are of high cost (most times) and considered high "value", the received enjoyment let's say.. Caviar is priced "highly" because many people pay the money to have it, considering their experience with caviar of "high value".

Coming back to your quote, it can be inaccurate, simply because there are many instances in the market where you can find items that perform objectively and subjectively "higher" or "lower" their expected standard and asked price, what you called "worth". And then what happens is that people find themselves willing to pay more or less for those items than the original asked price.

How many times have you been disappointed by something you bought? How many times have you bought something, for which you payed what you thought was good money, and found you got what you considered crap?
I bet many, just like all of us.

In the same way, it does happen that we buy things or even hunt for deals that surpass our expectations, and those of the market. Well made products, priced fairly by the producer, which then find themselves competing in quality and objective and subjective appreciation by the consumer with items of maybe higher cost and higher price. What we call good values, good deals.
This does happen as well. Small champagne producers that price their limited production jewels at far less than their bigger-name and reputation competition, which sells lower-quality product at a higher price.

SO you see, my saying the 9200s play above their league, is because they are a fairly priced item, which competes in objective and subjective appreciation and value with items that are priced way above them. This is what this statement means. A good example is what yrstruly reminds us of when quoting the still ongoing debate-clash between the 9200s and the Stellias.
I definitely stand by my statement, and will continue to consider the 9200s a "high value" product, in the face of many items priced above them.

Lui

PS Sorry for the lesson-type answer, don't mean to go professor-mode on you, just wanted to be a bit thorough on a complicated topic!
 
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Feb 12, 2024 at 11:26 AM Post #4,308 of 4,413
Stop this kind of hype train, its not 100% true, especially for everyone taste.
- Its nothing short of relaxed, for me relaxed is a totally different meaning, its like the fiio FT5, ibasso SR2, HD660s they are relaxed, the D9200 not.
- I agree its musical and fun to listen to
- But again, these "they are well above their price and league" comments, just nonono. Every product worth as much as their retail price or less, but never more. Their 1500$ price is quite hefty, and okey u pay the "closed back extra" bounty, but literally they sound like a 500$ open back, without the soundstage. The remaining price is for the closed back enclosure and build quality. I tell u, the ibasso SR2 sounds as good overall (different strenghts and weaknesses), but its leak a little although not much, if u dont need 100% seal, its a better deal for 500$.

I agree that D9200 is exciting and quite opposite to relaxed presentation, but we need to remember that this is a closed back, hence it's not logical to compete with openback staging for them.

1500$ is hefty, but there are qualities that really stands out on this headphone. One of the better bass presentation within dynamic headphones, doesn't get fuzzy or lost with complex music. Has very good timbre especially with vocals. All of this accompanied with wooden cups and nice build. Today market is going crazy with pricing. I've just recently audition headphone costing nearly twice as D9200 with a build that looks suitable for 150$ price. Hyped to lalalaland when reality is different.

Need to learn to filter through the hype as otherwise head-fi can become irritating place
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 2:50 PM Post #4,309 of 4,413
I agree that D9200 is exciting and quite opposite to relaxed presentation, but we need to remember that this is a closed back, hence it's not logical to compete with openback staging for them.

1500$ is hefty, but there are qualities that really stands out on this headphone. One of the better bass presentation within dynamic headphones, doesn't get fuzzy or lost with complex music. Has very good timbre especially with vocals. All of this accompanied with wooden cups and nice build. Today market is going crazy with pricing. I've just recently audition headphone costing nearly twice as D9200 with a build that looks suitable for 150$ price. Hyped to lalalaland when reality is different.

Need to learn to filter through the hype as otherwise head-fi can become irritating place
When I found some albums which I absolutely loved with the 9200s (specially with melodic death metal, some heavy metal and power metal albums, but also with classic rock), I wish I wouldn't be as sensitive as I'm at the treble region with other albums that I couldn't stand with them...
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 2:57 PM Post #4,310 of 4,413
What each person hears is unique to that person, as is what each person finds good or bad.

Reviews, professional in magazines etc or amateur on here, are general guides but again based only on one set of unique ears and one person’s view of good and bad.

I paid about the same (usd 1200 equivalent) for my new 9200 as I paid for my original Clears.

ATM I am leaning towards saying that for me, the 9200 is the superior headphone.

There might be 101 reasons I feel that way: my specific sources, environment, ears, hearing ability and so on.

At the end of the day none of that matters if I’m enjoying what I hear.

It’s exactly the same with conventional hifi. My US$30,000 Linn system sounds excellent to me. To someone else, it may well not. That’s just the way it is with such things. I’ve heard systems that cost four times as much and not been especially impressed.
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 3:00 PM Post #4,311 of 4,413
When I found some albums which I absolutely loved with the 9200s (specially with melodic death metal, some heavy metal and power metal albums, but also with classic rock), I wish I wouldn't be as sensitive as I'm at the treble region with other albums that I couldn't stand with them...
Did you really just use the word “melodic” in connection with Death Metal? 🤣🤣🤣

Only kidding. 😎
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 3:08 PM Post #4,312 of 4,413
I beg to differ. I own the Clear MG as well as the 9200s. If I had to sell one to finance another purchase it would be the Focals that would go. That's not to say the Focals as poor, they are on a par with the 9200s but lack the excitement. The Denons are also better than the Focal Radiance that I owned for a short time. Going to have to be a good closed back for me to purchase another one, may be the DCA E3, Ether C Flow or Meze Liric. They will be bought to compliment the Denons not beat them.
Not sure if you've heard the Liric yet but just a heads up in case you haven't - the D9200 is much better imo. When it comes to sound, the only thing the Liric does better is staging and imaging, otherwise it lags behind the Denon big time in terms of emotional engagement and sounding natural. The Liric is cool but the mids are tuned v weirdly. That said, the design and aesthetic of the Liric is brilliant!
 
Feb 12, 2024 at 3:09 PM Post #4,313 of 4,413
Did you really just use the word “melodic” in connection with Death Metal? 🤣🤣🤣

Only kidding. 😎
Yes, it's absolutely true :relieved: I dislike Brutal death variant :wink:

Regarding 9200s, I remember I listened this Norah Jones performance with the 9200s and the only thing I could enjoy was the bass notes, with the HD 800 I feel like I'm there with Norah, I feel it so real...

 
Feb 12, 2024 at 6:34 PM Post #4,314 of 4,413
Yes, it's absolutely true :relieved: I dislike Brutal death variant :wink:

Regarding 9200s, I remember I listened this Norah Jones performance with the 9200s and the only thing I could enjoy was the bass notes, with the HD 800 I feel like I'm there with Norah, I feel it so real...


Is that available in any form of HD audio only?

It would be a fabulous album.
 
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Feb 13, 2024 at 3:02 AM Post #4,315 of 4,413
I dont mean offensively or anything, but hype is a thing and if there is no opposite opinion it could be very one sided and misleading. I think i know where the hype is rooted, as u all compare the D9200 to focals or badly priced high end mezes, like those i saw in recent comments: Focal Clear Og/MG, Stellias, Liric

I think focals are just good for a "better than "xy focal" comparsions" - whatever the focals get compared the other headphone just always better, better value, better sounding etc. So in my opinion focals are just worse than a lot of competitor at a given price. Its not a validate thing that something is better than an equally priced focal.
Many say even the edition XS is better than the focal MG, especially in soundstage, some prefer the HD600 more to say. Stellias and other way too overpriced HPs are not good for examples as they not even close to worth the price they asking for them. Its too easy to say that xy is better then Stellias or Lyrics because their price which is counerproductive, but u rarely hear so easily that xy is much better than edition XS or meze 109pro or HD600. What i wanted to say, its very important what you compare to, and it could determine you whole conclusion. If you compare downside, not upside, it could be a very different story, like i AB tested the 9200 with the 5200, what less than half the price, and the 9200 was not that much better at all.
 
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Feb 13, 2024 at 6:45 AM Post #4,318 of 4,413
When I found some albums which I absolutely loved with the 9200s (specially with melodic death metal, some heavy metal and power metal albums, but also with classic rock), I wish I wouldn't be as sensitive as I'm at the treble region with other albums that I couldn't stand with them...

Hotness in treble was one of the main reasons why I sold D9200. It didn't occur for me at the beginning but later as excitement went down fatigue started to kick during longer listening sessions. This is easily fixable with EQ, but I've decided to go back to open-back flagship and use D7200 when I need isolation.
D7200 gets fairly close to D9200 if you boost 1-20khz area by few db's.

I think i know where the hype is rooted, as u all compare the D9200 to focals or badly priced high end mezes, like those i saw in recent comments: Focal Clear Og/MG, Stellias, Liric
Focals are very overpriced, but I adore the sound of OG Utopia and sometimes i just chuck it up if finances allows it.

HD600 as you mentioned can not match D9200 build quality. Bass is superior on D9200, staging and the rest of technicalities are trading blows while D9200 being more lively/engaging...All the hifimans that I've heard including XS up to He1000v2 had artificial timbre. It's a no go for my tastes as I can't stand unnatural voices with some planars. Haven't heard Meze 109 Pro, but the biggest gripe is you mainly compare open-backs to a closed back and these should not fall into the same category.

D9200 is expensive, but nowhere near as some recently released "flagships". Top tier closed back sound without any major faults accompanied with good build quality which will last many years.

Denons did not grabbed my attention before, but they went on the right track with their D5200/d7200/d9200 models. Fostex does similar stuff with closed back range, but I haven't heard them and their older TH900mk2 release is already more expensive than denons flagship.
 
Feb 13, 2024 at 7:04 AM Post #4,319 of 4,413
I dont mean offensively or anything, but hype is a thing and if there is no opposite opinion it could be very one sided and misleading. I think i know where the hype is rooted, as u all compare the D9200 to focals or badly priced high end mezes, like those i saw in recent comments: Focal Clear Og/MG, Stellias, Liric

I think focals are just good for a "better than "xy focal" comparsions" - whatever the focals get compared the other headphone just always better, better value, better sounding etc. So in my opinion focals are just worse than a lot of competitor at a given price. Its not a validate thing that something is better than an equally priced focal.
Many say even the edition XS is better than the focal MG, especially in soundstage, some prefer the HD600 more to say. Stellias and other way too overpriced HPs are not good for examples as they not even close to worth the price they asking for them. Its too easy to say that xy is better then Stellias or Lyrics because their price which is counerproductive, but u rarely hear so easily that xy is much better than edition XS or meze 109pro or HD600. What i wanted to say, its very important what you compare to, and it could determine you whole conclusion. If you compare downside, not upside, it could be a very different story, like i AB tested the 9200 with the 5200, what less than half the price, and the 9200 was not that much better at all.
If denons are bad, focals are also bad value, meze is also not good then whats good?
Edition xs qc issues are worse than any other brand and they sound soulless. They just have good detail retrieval because of planar, hd 600 is only capable of producing great vocals.
 

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