DAC in Sony Walkmans?
Jan 15, 2010 at 12:54 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 12

a_recording

Member of the Trade: Lachlanlikesathing
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Posts
4,705
Likes
793
For fun, I took apart an old Sony A806 I had, since it had actual screws. Behold:

sony%20A.jpg


The DAC here appears to be a Cirrus Logic 42l51C, which the datasheet I read from Alldatasheet.com says is apparently both a 96kHz 24Bit oversampling DAC, and a headphone amp. (I thought it would actually be a Sony chip, but hey!
biggrin.gif
Next we'll find out that the Sony X shares DACs with the iPod nano)

CS42L51-CNZ datasheet pdf datenblatt - Cirrus Logic - Low Power, Stereo CODEC with Headphone Amp ::: ALLDATASHEET :::


The software chip is also a Xilinx chip, which is less interesting.

I'm a complete beginner when it comes to these kinds of things, but a couple of things from the data sheet caught my eye, which I'm trying to relate to the functions on the DAP:

1. The Cirrus chip notes that it has tone controls with 4 adjustment points. However, the actual EQ on the Sony walkman has 5 - four bands and the 'Clear Bass' band. Does this mean that the Sony EQ is actually software as opposed to hardware - or that the Clear Bass function is actually different from a standard EQ control?

2. Does the DAC actually perform oversampling to 96kHz/24? Is this related to DSEE - ie: Noise floor improvements? (I've read in RMAA tests that DSEE actually improves high frequency roll off on the Sony players.)

3. What does Clear Stereo actually do? Sony claims that "The Clear Stereo function enables individual left and right digital processing of the sound. This prevents audio signals leakage so that clear stereo sound of the original source can be reproduced." This almost sounds like dual DACs, but there only seems to be one to me.
biggrin.gif
I don't think Clear Stereo is as simple as a tone control - it does have the effect of increasing stereo seperation widening the sound stage, at the cost of recessing vocals slightly and reducing detail. Is it some kind of hardware control?

4. Every recent higher end Sony DAP has DSEE, Clear Stereo etc functions. If these are hardware functions, then does that mean that they all share very similar DACs? Perhaps the Sony X has the same DAC but bypasses the cirrus headphone amp to go to it's own S-Master?

5. If not, then what DAC is actually in the Sony X? Anyone want to take apart their insanely expensive DAP to enlighten us?
biggrin.gif


Anyway, I'm just curious if anyone knows or wants to explore.
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Jan 15, 2010 at 4:36 AM Post #3 of 12
Yep, while certain Head-Fiers berate everything from Cirrus Logic in favour of chips from Wolfson, our friends at Sony and Marantz (among others) are busy building kit with these DACs that gets rave reviews for SQ.

As Jason from Nuforce said in another thread, there is more to it than simply assembling a parts list and throwing it all together. That's paraphrasing him, but the message seems to be lost on many Head-Fiers. The part numbers are important, but they dont tell the whole story.
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 7:37 AM Post #4 of 12
This is a revealing site, which have the most up-to-date news and links. The perks are endless of this handy site. Thanks for giving out this info; it’s really precious for me.
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 7:47 AM Post #5 of 12
im glad i choose Sony
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 7:52 AM Post #6 of 12
Quote:

Originally Posted by heidy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
This is a revealing site, which have the most up-to-date news and links. The perks are endless of this handy site. Thanks for giving out this info; it’s really precious for me.


Welcome to the board!
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 12:58 PM Post #7 of 12
i somethings think that Wolfson is moving to a position like BOSE or Apple, overvalued products standing on brand value alone with no real characteristics to back its quality or real world value,

the poor standart EQ and the bass roll off and such make products from AKM and cirrus logic more desirable,

dont get me wrong, i own a Cowon D2 and a S9, which are both a slightly generic telechips+Wolfson combo, but it dosnt mean that they arent good daps, the S9 is one of the best daps on the market, as we all know, its not all in the chips, theres a big part of it in the construction, circuitry and fine tunning, im just saying, choosing a DAC from another manufacturer shouldnt be taboo just becuase everyone wants a wolfson, my Echo Audiofire 2 with its AKM sounds awesome,
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 1:02 PM Post #8 of 12
wolfson produce many series of DAC, they cater all kinds of budget.
From the high end to the low end just like Texas instrument Opamp - it depends on manufacturers to select which chip they wish to design the player on.

So thats not a fair assessment on wolfson per se, unless the highest end model is crappy.
 
Mar 19, 2010 at 1:15 PM Post #9 of 12
wolfson still makes good products, and some of the best daps on the market use it, as i said before,

but im worried about companies which have products which are just as good or better like AKM or Cirrus logic being shut out becuase clients would prefer any wolfson over a superior product from other companies just becuase its a wolfson, the cirrus logic dac in some Sony products was amazing, while the one in the 6th gen ipod was... "ok",

i would like to see more TI, AKM and Cirrus logic products (aslong as they are up to par and provide better quality) in DAPS and PMP´s, making DAC choice a matter of quality, not brand,
 
Mar 21, 2010 at 2:37 PM Post #10 of 12
Quote:

Originally Posted by a_recording /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I don't think Clear Stereo is as simple as a tone control - it does have the effect of increasing stereo seperation widening the sound stage, at the cost of recessing vocals slightly and reducing detail.


Thats strange because I use the Clear Stereo function on my Sony X1060 and it certainly doesn't wideing the stereo field like stereo widening does. Basically I hear no difference at all when I select Clear Stereo. The 3D stereo option on the Cowon and Samsung players have that effect though that you describe but not on Sony's Clear Stereo function which makes no difference to the sound.


Art
 
Mar 21, 2010 at 11:04 PM Post #11 of 12
Quote:

Originally Posted by Artmuzz /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Thats strange because I use the Clear Stereo function on my Sony X1060 and it certainly doesn't wideing the stereo field like stereo widening does. Basically I hear no difference at all when I select Clear Stereo. The 3D stereo option on the Cowon and Samsung players have that effect though that you describe but not on Sony's Clear Stereo function which makes no difference to the sound.


Art



It's an extremely small difference actually. I can only really hear it when I use a revealing IEM like the RE0, and then the overall effect is to slightly increase instrument seperation (less so stereo widening then the actual seperation of instruments) while the effect on the vocals is a little stronger - it pulls them back/ makes them a little quieter.

Since vocals are usually mixed between left/right channels there seems to be some sort of crossfeed trickery going on. I don't really like the result.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top