[scannon18]

Well, I'm about to make another outrageous headphone related purchase, but before doing so I naturally did a lot of research.  People seem to have very different opinions about the Audio-gd NFB 12.1. 
 
With dual Wolfson 8741 chips, is this thing too good to be true at $215?  Has anybody had a problem with their unit?  Does anybody think that it is a bad idea to buy from this company?  While it was easy to find negative opinions of Audio-gd, none of the opinions were explicated to the extent that I could understand the problem.

 

[liamstrain]

Many people feel that Audio_Gd (especially lower end) add coloration to the DAC/Amps... the NFB-12, in particular comes under this criticism (moreso than the NFB-3 or 5, or Fun). With that said, many people also really enjoy them. They are a great bargain, IMO. 

 

[knowhatimean]

I think you may need to be a very patient person should you decide to purchase something from this company! To be fair though, you will most likely have to play "the waiting game"(like many of us, who have ordered something from Schiit) if you go with anything not from a brand name product that has been around many years & sells through any number of dealer networks. I only mention this about this Company, because I seem to recall seeing it mentioned in these forums several times that posters had been waiting substantial amounts of time for something they had ordered from them.

 

[fabio-fi]

Opinions are mixed. 
I'd go to a head-fi meet to try gear (audio gd stuff) before pulling the trigger. 

 

[khaine1711]

I'd say few things can beat nfb12/12.1 at ~200 for Dac/amp combo. If you just need a dac or an amp, there may be better choices.
 
The 2 problems I have with mine are:
 
- If you open the thing when it get warm from running; there's the smell of ... well I don't know the name of the smell; but it is similar to the smell of the plastic/gum piece people use to clean their solder point.
- The USB cable doesn't fit in completely/firmly. I'm using mostly USB at the moment with no problem (no "drop-out" or reduce sound quality vs spdif); however the thought of the connector not fitting in "perfectly" bugs me sometimes 

 
Quote:

Well, I'm about to make another outrageous headphone related purchase, but before doing so I naturally did a lot of research.  People seem to have very different opinions about the Audio-gd NFB 12.1. 
 
With dual Wolfson 8741 chips, is this thing too good to be true at $215?  Has anybody had a problem with their unit?  Does anybody think that it is a bad idea to buy from this company?  While it was easy to find negative opinions of Audio-gd, none of the opinions were explicated to the extent that I could understand the problem.

 

 

[scannon18]

I'd say few things can beat nfb12/12.1 at ~200 for Dac/amp combo. If you just need a dac or an amp, there may be better choices.

The 2 problems I have with mine are:

- If you open the thing when it get warm from running; there's the smell of ... well I don't know the name of the smell; but it is similar to the smell of the plastic/gum piece people use to clean their solder point.
- The USB cable doesn't fit in completely/firmly. I'm using mostly USB at the moment with no problem (no "drop-out" or reduce sound quality vs spdif); however the thought of the connector not fitting in "perfectly" bugs me sometimes 

Which other dac/amps can you think of? And how do you feel about the 12.1 from an sq standpoint?

 

[khaine1711]

Please note that my comparison is vs other dac/amp in the $200 price range. I don't buy (and tested for myself) the whole "blow dac/amp 2/3/4/whatever their cost out of water" thing
 
About the 12/12.1
 
DAC
-Lots of details,on the analytical side
-Deep, tight and impressive bass
-Treble rolls off a tard bit
-Soundstage is not very impressive
 
The amp section is hard to explain; it's like a mini-dynalo/c2.2; basically wire-with-gains. Doesnt add/fix anything.
 
 
$200 for a dac/amp, you can choose between audinst mx1; musiland 02 us; emu 0404 and the Asus Xonar ST/STX soundcard; also FiiO e10 or e7/e9 combo (too many to list them all). The dac part is preference; however I feel the dac part of the nfb12 surpasses all of its competitors (my opinion); and the Amp part is definitely better than all, unless you prefer some specific coloration.
 
For the DAC part alone, I've heard better DACs in the $200 price range. Amp is hard to compare since it's also depends a lot on the DAC you're using in your chain.
 
Overall I'm pleased with my nfb12. And it's hard to find better p/p for a Dac/amp combo. Also makes my next upgrade much harder; dunno if I should go for the Nfb3 + C2.2 or straight to DAC19 and C2.2 

 
Quote:

Which other dac/amps can you think of? And how do you feel about the 12.1 from an sq standpoint?

 

 

[scannon18]

Yea i already own the fiio e7/e9 but the output impedance is too high so I need to switch amps and may as well go for a new dac. So its probably going to be the nfb 12.1, unless i decide to pay double for a Yulong D100

Edit: headphones are denon d2000 if that matters

 

[Head Injury]

Quote:

Yea i already own the fiio e7/e9 but the output impedance is too high so I need to switch amps and may as well go for a new dac. So its probably going to be the nfb 12.1, unless i decide to pay double for a Yulong D100
Edit: headphones are denon d2000 if that matters

Why not just use the E7? It's a decent amp on its own, and has low output impedance. You don't need very much power at all for those headphones.

 

[khaine1711]

I want a d2000/d7000; too bad I cant live with closed-can =p. I have also listened to the markl-modded d2000; very alluring for their price at that time (~$250). However the denon price in my location has been sky-rocketting for a few months lol.
 
If you get the nfb12; burn it in for 50-100 hours. The bass is ear-shattering at first; but sort itself out after 50 hours or so. 
 
Quote:

Yea i already own the fiio e7/e9 but the output impedance is too high so I need to switch amps and may as well go for a new dac. So its probably going to be the nfb 12.1, unless i decide to pay double for a Yulong D100
Edit: headphones are denon d2000 if that matters

 

 

[scannon18]

Why not just use the E7? It's a decent amp on its own, and has low output impedance. You don't need very much power at all for those headphones.

The e7 is not nearly powerful enough, though it is a better impedance match. It sounds more natural but less hi fi. With the e7 the denons are prone to the v shaped response curve and sibilance that everyone talks about. The denons are misleading in the perception that they are easy to drive, imo

 

[bellsprout]

Some dubious things about them. The dude was banned here for making some false claims on competitors' gear.
 
Most other criticisms are engineering related. Don't know about DACs but their amps have increased levels of distortion due to their non-feedback design. their discrete opamps earth and moon also measure badly. However, they don't claim to make products that are reference level, as their methodology is design by ear, and listening impressions here are mostly favorable, as they have an enjoyable sound rather than an analytical one.

 

[scannon18]

Some dubious things about them. The dude was banned here for making some false claims on competitors' gear.

Most other criticisms are engineering related. Don't know about DACs but their amps have increased levels of distortion due to their non-feedback design. their discrete opamps earth and moon also measure badly. However, they don't claim to make products that are reference level, as their methodology is design by ear, and listening impressions here are mostly favorable, as they have an enjoyable sound rather than an analytical one.

So does criticism of Audio-gd boil down to an objectivity v. Subjectivity argument? I'll have to do more research on the non feedback design

 

[eugenius]

Reasons not to buy AudioGD.

Reason 1: Build quality and by consequence questionable long-term reliability.
Reason 2: Short warranty and high cost of service post-warranty.
Reason 3: Design.

 

[Brooko]

Quote:

Reasons not to buy AudioGD.
Reason 1: Build quality and by consequence questionable long-term reliability.
Reason 2: Short warranty and high cost of service post-warranty.
Reason 3: Design.

 
Care to elaborate specifically?  Which models?  Assume from above this is coming from direct experience with a particular Audio-gd product?
 
Scannon18 - I own the NFB-12.  I really like it.  Build quality on my unit is very good - it's nicely laid out, and I've had no issues at all.  It's warm - but not a cooker.  For my ears - it was quite a bit better than the E7/E9 that I used to own - which I found a little dry and thin in comparison.  The only thing it should have come with was 'feet' - but easy enough to add your own.
 
 The filter options are quite handy - and have had no issues with any of my music library, including the few hi-res albums I own.  It definitely has a warm signature - but it goes nicely with my HD600s and my MS1is.  For the features - I see it as a real bargain.  I have had no regrets since I purchased it - except that it would have been nice to have the filter/flavour external switches (like the new 12.1) - but at least I can still change the filters easily within a couple of minutes.
 
I had no problems at all with Audi-gd's communication - but have not had any issues, so cannot comment on post service.
 
I don't see too many (if any) combo amp/dacs with the same features and inputs for close to this money at the moment.