New Dragonfly Black and Red Discussion

Hey guys
 
Thought I would post my impressions of the Dragonfly red, oppo and chord mojo on a iphone 6plus. I've tested these on a pair of SE846's and B&W p5 headphones. I've owned all of these dacs before sending them back and have spent alot of time testing them against the headphone jack on the iphone.
 
The chord mojo is probably the best followed by the oppo and then the dragonfly red. The chord mojo was the most musical and most refined, with the oppo being the most neutral and the DF Red being the brightest. Here is the thing however, I found so little difference between any of these dacs and the headphone output that when I stopped looking for the difference and just enjoyed the music I didnt enjoy any of them more that the iphones internal dac (the dragon fly was a bit tiring on the ears for long sessions).
 
In terms of portability the chord mojo is the worst, the micro usb is not very secure and its pretty chunky plus when you take into account the camera adapter you need it becomes a real pain to drag around. The oppo is built beautifully and is a lot easier to carry about as well as not requiring the camera adapter to work. The dragon fly is the easiest to carry about but because it uses the volume control on the iphone and its alot louder than the head phone jack, setting a comfortable volume is hard with iphone buttons.
 
I'm a bit of a hi fi nerd and embarrassed to say I have a separates system that cost more than the deposit on a new house but I don't think any of these dacs are really worth it if you are using them on a phone.You can get some pretty cool computer speakers for the cost of the mojo (I bought some kef eggs when I sent the mojo back) or you could put that money towards a better pair of headphones or even get some custom fit ear plugs for them. You could buy 40 cds or an entry level turntable and some vinyl for that money.
 
I can completely understand why some audiophiles might want one of these in there desktop music system to replace the rubbish on board dac but for someone who loves music on the go and wants the best bang for there buck I would look else where.
 
This is just my personal experience and I understand everyone's ears are different. Hope this is helpful to anyone on the fence. As always the best thing do listen to them your self and come to your own conclusion.

Interesting - I had opposite conclusion on HA-2 vs DFR.

I agree on the portability issue. DACs/amps embedded in the cord is the way to go (for me). That's why Sine + Cipher was such an awesome discovery. I just use DFR with my laptop at home for couch listening -- I'm never near an outlet.

brent75 said:

Interesting - I had opposite conclusion on HA-2 vs DFR.

I agree on the portability issue. DACs/amps embedded in the cord is the way to go (for me). That's why Sine + Cipher was such an awesome discovery. I just use DFR with my laptop at home for couch listening -- I'm never near an outlet.

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can't wait for this tech to arrive from other companies down the road.
lighter, slimmer, less additional wires, and  so largely unnoticeable but still offering kick ass sound:
that is my meal ticket....imagine if the mojo came in a cipher and could hook into any gizmo
now that i'd gladly pay $1k for.

ive heard oppo ha2, df red except mojo, df red is easily the best dac, for mojo i didnt hear it. if df red is not enough there is fiio x7 dap, to claim that iphone is as good as df red oppo ha2 i have nothing to add your opinion. buy fiio x7 it is better than df red but expensive and perhaps doesnt play with iphone i havent used it for that.

I wouldn't say the iphone is as good as the dacs I mentioned but non of the dacs improved my enjoyment of the music over using the se846 headphones straight out of the iphone. On paper all those dacs would destroy the iphone, yet my personal experience of actually listening to them was different. Again this is just my personal opinion but as a bit of a hi fi anorak who used to get behind all the "mains cables make a difference" and "check out this £2000 interconnect" bollocks i'm really trying, on principle, to get as much bang for my buck from my audio gear.
 
I agree with you guys, Its an exciting time in terms of headphone tech and when the dac is neatly hidden in the cord I will probably be happier to rock an external dac (that cipher cable looks cool and damn right I would love the mojo in that with out all the bulk). Another note is the rumor of the removal of the headphone jack on the iphones as this will force people into using external dacs or some awful wireless beats headphones.
 
Only time will tell. 

thanks for your helpful review and comments. I've come to the same conclusion.....while I 
can hear some sound improvements with the Mojo over my iPhone 6S+'s headphone jack (listened
for a while at a retailer, fairly subtle differences),
it doesn't make much difference to me in musical enjoyment....as the iPhone sounds excellent with 
my Grado SR325e and SR80e's....listening at low to moderate volumes. Esp. with
the RS325e's on most music I listen to (prog rock, refined pop, jazz fusion, some classical).
 
Just because there is better or more refined sound out there doesn't mean it's worth
the price and inconvenience to every discerning music lover.
 
I'd rather wait until something comes along that's (for me) a real game changer...

headfry said:

thanks for your helpful review and comments. I've come to the same conclusion.....while I 
can hear some sound improvements with the Mojo over my iPhone 6S+'s headphone jack (listened
for a while at a retailer, fairly subtle differences),
it doesn't make much difference to me in musical enjoyment....as the iPhone sounds excellent with 
my Grado SR325e and SR80e's....listening at low to moderate volumes. Esp. with
the RS325e's on most music I listen to (prog rock, refined pop, jazz fusion, some classical).

Just because there is better or more refined sound out there doesn't mean it's worth
the price and inconvenience to every discerning music lover.

I'd rather wait until something comes along that's (for me) a real game changer...

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An amp/DAC can't really ever be a "real game changer" they can't make the music sound any better than it was recorded. The difference between the headphone out Jack and a mojo is larger than the difference between a theoretically perfect DAC/amp and the mojo.

Lots O stuff to chime in on. All the below comments are with an iphone6 plus running iAudiogate.
First, I dropped my DFR on concrete from 4 feet. And then one of my two feet kicked it sending it skittling across the garage floor onto the driveway. Not a mark. Not even a scuff.
I always use my Jitterbug with the DFR. Always! Bigger soundstage, more bass, better separation, additional buzzwords. My prediction is the next version of Dragonfly will have a built in Jitterbug. Don't tell Chord, but the Jitterbug improves my Mojo also.
The Dragonfly Red does not sound as good as my Bimby / lyr2 combo. Come on folks.
I think the Mojo sounds better than the DFR but not by a knockout. And it depends upon the application. The Mojo owes much of it's success to it's Moden Design, Fashion and it being a general fetish object. It's quite ergonomic in a real way, sounds great and is a pleasure to use. Cute little glowing cloored balls. They saw me coming. But my favorite setup for my ie800 IEM's is the dfr + jitterbug. I have a work desk that holds my Master 11, Bimby / microZOTL 2 combo. Sometimes i just use the ie800 / DFR combo. It sounds that good. In some ways the Mojo is neither fish nor fowl. I sometimes feed the microZOTL 2 with the Mojo. Sounds great. Bimby sounds better. The Mojo is not practical for the desktop as it is not meant to be plugged in all the time. And it's too big for truly portable and it,better be charged up. If I had to pick only one device, hands down I would take the DFR over the Mojo.

Fjrabon I think I understand what your saying. I think you could very well be right. If the jump from iphone dac to mojo isnt enough for me, no dac will be. Maybe great improvements will come in the amplifier sections of these products and maybe that will give me the jump im looking for. Then again if MQA becomes the standard I might find new value in the dac section of these products. You've given me food for thought. 

My experience is exactly the same. I was also curious about the Oppo Ha-2 and Mojo compared to my iphone 6. I found a dealer who had both, so took my Shure SE535 and my iphone 6 to hear for myself. I simply could not tell the difference between my iphone 6 headphone out and the 6 connected to the ha-2. Then I tried to compare the 6 with the mojo. The mojo was slightly better but I simply could not justify the $600 price tag plus the CCK. And both of these are hardly a portable solution. Imagine you have the ios device connected to the CCK cable to the usb cable to the mojo and you are walking around with it!
At home, I have the Grado GS1000e which I am currently using with the ipod classic 6th gen. The ipod classic sounds slightly better (musical) compared to my iphone 6. I am still on the look out for a portable solution that sounds noticeably (read justifiable) better then the iphone or ipod classic.
 
I think the best portable solution is a separate DAP. Or something like Arcam MusicBOOST. Not saying MusicBOOST is better sound wise but the form factor.

moonparty said:

  The dragon fly is the easiest to carry about but because it uses the volume control on the iphone and its alot louder than the head phone jack, setting a comfortable volume is hard with iphone buttons.
 
I'm a bit of a hi fi nerd and embarrassed to say I have a separates system that cost more than the deposit on a new house but I don't think any of these dacs are really worth it if you are using them on a phone.

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This is interesting...I don't find setting an appropriate volume level with the DF Red + iPhone is difficult at all.
 
IMO, the DF Red is the best portable DAC / amp combo currently available for the iPhone.

cfgamescape said:

This is interesting...I don't find setting an appropriate volume level with the DF Red + iPhone is difficult at all.

IMO, the DF Red is the best portable DAC / amp combo currently available for the iPhone.

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agreed re the point in bold, and no RF interference if you want to use your phone at the same time...

Even though I've only had my own DFR for a few weeks, I've already moved on, and am very happy, just a shame it is a bit of a taboo subject, where I've gone, as it isn't available in the US or Asia...

If I'm hearing (static? white? idk the right term) noise when I plug my earphones into my computer and phone, would getting a dragonfly and plugging my earphones through it solve the problem?

what jitterbug do you have?