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Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up

Apr 13, 2014 at 11:12 AM Post #737 of 190,789
umustbkidn said:
Everyone knows what a USB port is (including my son that likes to think he knows more than me, to my ex wife who really doesn't know much of anything), and most people (even non technical types) know that you plug things into your computer using USB ports. All of those lovely technical explanations aside, that's all they really need to know.
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Yeah, it's something about it being a Universal Serial Bus or something...

:D

I think the other big takeaway from the chapter is to have better USB audio standards, and for ALL software developers to support it. USB 3.0 can support speeds up to 5 Gb/s, which is blazingly fast as far as digital audio is concerned. It shouldn't be that hard to eliminate most of the issues we currently have with audio over USB.
 
Apr 13, 2014 at 11:54 AM Post #738 of 190,789
superjawes said:
Yeah, it's something about it being a Universal Serial Bus or something...

biggrin.gif


I think the other big takeaway from the chapter is to have better USB audio standards, and for ALL software developers to support it. USB 3.0 can support speeds up to 5 Gb/s, which is blazingly fast as far as digital audio is concerned. It shouldn't be that hard to eliminate most of the issues we currently have with audio over USB.
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Actually, speed isn't the problem. USB3.0 is needed for audio about as much as 64/1544 music is needed for great sound. And if you saw the PCB layout guides for a USB3 receiver, you wouldn't be asking for it in audio.
 
The vast majority of problems with audio over USB come about from:
 
1. Power-saving measures such as Windows' port power management and Mavericks' App Nap. Holy crap, do we really need this standards-destroying, arbitrary crap to save another minute or two of battery life? And it's not just USB DACs that are affected. Google "Windows USB Port Power Management" for more info. If the manufacturers simply made this draconian crap completely and easily defeatable, we'd have a lot less problems.
 
2. Audiophile cables. Many do not support USB 2.0 speeds. If it's hand-made, watch out.
 
3. Long cables. Cables over 3m are getting a bit iffy for audio streaming.
 
4. Crap cables. There are a lot of crappy $0.15 USB cables out there that got thrown in with a printer or whatever, and have been swapped from system to system over the years. They don't work so well, either.
 
5. USB port types. USB 3 ports aren't a problem with USB 2 DACs--except in a few cases: Some don't even provide full power to the USB port anymore. Some are broken (yes), and some are on controllers that are conflicting with the 18 hard drives, 3 other USB ports, and 53 other peripherals in your super-tweaked system. 
 
And that's the rant for today. We return you to your regularly scheduled programming...
 
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Apr 13, 2014 at 1:14 PM Post #739 of 190,789
jason stoddard said:
   
1. Power-saving measures such as Windows' port power management and Mavericks' App Nap. Holy crap, do we really need this standards-destroying, arbitrary crap to save another minute or two of battery life? And it's not just USB DACs that are affected. Google "Windows USB Port Power Management" for more info. If the manufacturers simply made this draconian crap completely and easily defeatable, we'd have a lot less problems.  
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 One way to avoid the power issue is to get a self-powered USB hub or other device.  I just added an iFi USB Power (http://www.ifi-audio.com/en/iusb.html) to my system which, while pricey, completely powers any USB DAC plugged into it as well as offering signal filtering.  I haven't noticed any real sound quality difference, but it makes me feel warm and fuzzy knowing it's there and that I know the output is fully powered separately from the computer.  :)
 
Apr 13, 2014 at 1:29 PM Post #740 of 190,789
Back when I was doing tech support for Apple, we had to help Windows users disable the USB port power management all day long; so their iPods/iPhones could sync. It is the biggest pain in the butt!

It's one of the main reasons Apple finally did wifi syncing.
 
Apr 14, 2014 at 2:10 AM Post #744 of 190,789
jason stoddard said:
 
3. Long cables. Cables over 3m are getting a bit iffy for audio streaming.
 
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The funny thing for me is, my 5m uber Oyaide cable seems to have less issues than all the other USB cables I have with high-res audio, even if it goes all the way around my desk past a crapload of other devices, power and other cables. This is one reason I want to own 'scope.
 
I think I might just chuck all my regular USB cables and buy a bunch of Belkin Gold ones.
 
don lehrer said:
  Sorry to ask, but are you preparing some portable schiit for us?? I will like to get some schiit!!
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I want to see Mike's reaction when Jason suggests they make a DAP. I would fly over there just to see that.
 
Apr 14, 2014 at 11:38 AM Post #746 of 190,789
jason stoddard said:
Actually, speed isn't the problem. USB3.0 is needed for audio about as much as 64/1544 music is needed for great sound. And if you saw the PCB layout guides for a USB3 receiver, you wouldn't be asking for it in audio.
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Well I wasn't thinking about "speed" so much as "bandwidth". The effective "speed" of the music can stay the same, but I figure that a good communication protocol should be able to use the extra bandwith to compensate for the shortcomings.

But of course, I say "should" because I don't have any experience on this front, I'm not writing the standards, and I'm probably a bit too much of an idealist. (I mean if we were able to put a man on the moon in 1969, surely we should be able to stream audio over USB without killing the quality, right?!)
 
Apr 14, 2014 at 1:02 PM Post #749 of 190,789
currawong said:
  I want to see Mike's reaction when Jason suggests they make a DAP. I would fly over there just to see that.
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Nah, I'm pretty sure you'd be able to hear the screams and profanities from here.
 
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