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IBasso DX50 vs Fiio X3 comparison thread - Page 6

post #76 of 289

I have heard rumors the x3 will be usable as amp/dac out of a computer (usb, I guess) in the future. Keep my fingers crossed.

post #77 of 289

Have you guys noticed how the amplifier section of the DX50 doesn't behave like most of the other daps? Fiio X3 vs DX50 comparison:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has a large advantage with 24 ohm and above headphones. Eg. Both used with 50 ohm headphones the DX50 can rack up 110mW at 2.5v, while the X3 only manages 30mW at 1.5v,

X3 has a large advantage with 16 ohm and below headphones. Eg. Both used with 10 ohm headphones the DX50 produces 40mW at 0.6v while the X3 produces 160mW at 1.5v.

 

Amp output impedance graphs DX50 vs X3:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has an output impedance closer to 3 ohm, despite the claimed <0.5 ohm from ibasso. DX50 also has an impedance spike in the 100-20hz region, this means headphones with lower impedance have progressively less bass response as shown in the next graph, EG. a 10 ohm headphone with the DX50 will have around -10db less 20hz bass. 

X3 has a low output impedance of 0.3 or lower ohms and isnt affected by the above, as such has a flat frequency response with all impedance phones.

 

Also there is the aspect of Line out implementation DX50 vs X3:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has WAY less distortion than X3 through the line out. This means the DAC implementation of the DX50 is a lot cleaner than the X3.

 

Total Summary of DX50:

 

The DX50 comes with a quadtriple whammy of LAME, if you want to use headphones with impedance lower than 16 ohms because:

  • Doesn't provide enough power, far less than the competition.
  • Doesnt provide enough voltage,  far less than the competition.
  • Has high ish output impedance,  far worse than the competition.
  • Bass is rolled of, more and more with lower and lower impedances.

 

The DX50 comes with a triple whammy of AWESOME, if you want to use headphones with impedance higher or at 24 ohms because:

  • WAY More power than all the competition.
  • WAY More voltage than the competition.
  • WAY less THD from Line out than the competition.

 

Original measurements from:

http://personalaudio.ru/review/portable-audio/

post #78 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by T.R.A.N.C.E. View Post
 

Summary:

DX50 has WAY less distortion than X3 through the line out. This means the DAC implementation of the DX50 is a lot cleaner than the X3.

 

Total Summary of DX50:

 

The DX50 comes with a quadtriple whammy of LAME, if you want to use headphones with impedance lower than 16 ohms because:

  • Doesn't provide enough power, far less than the competition.
  • Doesnt provide enough voltage,  far less than the competition.
  • Has high ish output impedance,  far worse than the competition.
  • Bass is rolled of, more and more with lower and lower impedances.

 

The DX50 comes with a triple whammy of AWESOME, if you want to use headphones with impedance higher or at 24 ohms because:

  • WAY More power than all the competition.
  • WAY More voltage than the competition.
  • WAY less THD from Line out than the competition.

 

Original measurements from:

http://personalaudio.ru/review/portable-audio/

Thanks for posting these graphs. Makes me glad I have both.

post #79 of 289
Thanks indeed
post #80 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vidmaven View Post

Thanks for posting these graphs. Makes me glad I have both.
What one are you using the most, what is your "go to".
post #81 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by howdy View Post


What one are you using the most, what is your "go to".

50/50

post #82 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vidmaven View Post

50/50
That's good to know, I'm anxiously awaiting my DX50.
post #83 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by T.R.A.N.C.E. View Post
 

Have you guys noticed how the amplifier section of the DX50 doesn't behave like most of the other daps? Fiio X3 vs DX50 comparison:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has a large advantage with 24 ohm and above headphones. Eg. Both used with 50 ohm headphones the DX50 can rack up 110mW at 2.5v, while the X3 only manages 30mW at 1.5v,

X3 has a large advantage with 16 ohm and below headphones. Eg. Both used with 10 ohm headphones the DX50 produces 40mW at 0.6v while the X3 produces 160mW at 1.5v.

 

Amp output impedance graphs DX50 vs X3:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has an output impedance closer to 3 ohm, despite the claimed <0.5 ohm from ibasso. DX50 also has an impedance spike in the 100-20hz region, this means headphones with lower impedance have progressively less bass response as shown in the next graph, EG. a 10 ohm headphone with the DX50 will have around -10db less 20hz bass. 

X3 has a low output impedance of 0.3 or lower ohms and isnt affected by the above, as such has a flat frequency response with all impedance phones.

 

Also there is the aspect of Line out implementation DX50 vs X3:

 

 

Summary:

DX50 has WAY less distortion than X3 through the line out. This means the DAC implementation of the DX50 is a lot cleaner than the X3.

 

Total Summary of DX50:

 

The DX50 comes with a quadtriple whammy of LAME, if you want to use headphones with impedance lower than 16 ohms because:

  • Doesn't provide enough power, far less than the competition.
  • Doesnt provide enough voltage,  far less than the competition.
  • Has high ish output impedance,  far worse than the competition.
  • Bass is rolled of, more and more with lower and lower impedances.

 

The DX50 comes with a triple whammy of AWESOME, if you want to use headphones with impedance higher or at 24 ohms because:

  • WAY More power than all the competition.
  • WAY More voltage than the competition.
  • WAY less THD from Line out than the competition.

 

Original measurements from:

http://personalaudio.ru/review/portable-audio/

 

A 2.8 output impedance doesn't give a 10db drop into 10 ohms at 20 hz. Max power graphs aren't frequency response graphs. Completely different parameter. It does supply enough power for any reasonable IEMs >15ohms unless you're doing damage to your ears and most of the roll and "impedance spike" (no spike, rising resistance) you see in the low bass is from the output coupling caps of 440uf which is actually very acceptable and larger than most that use them. 2.8 ohm is also perfectly acceptable in practice for any reasonable load. Considering that more DAPs are higher rather than lower in output impedance and use coupling caps, it's the 8-15 ohm earphones that are actually the problem in this market. I believe that the X3 is Direct Coupled so will not show roll. It will need to make other choices with PS and circuitry to do so. They are not always better choices even if they appear so. The line out distortion may be a function of a power supply designed for same.

 

From the same site when compared to the x3 and hm601.

 

 http://personalaudio.ru/detail/ibasso_dx50_v_sravnenii_s_fiio_x3_i_hifiman_hm601_slim/

 

HM601 - is a unique player, which thanks to a multibit DAC like a tube amp in solid state at an affordable price. This comparison does not apply to the sound of tube-transistor, it refers to its overall uniqueness of your handwriting and the sound should always be the choice of an alternative or complement other exclusive approach to the sound.FiiO X3 little in common with the AK100 as the first product on the one hand used good parts graphics and measurements indicate the absence of express or critical engineering errors, but the final version is inferior to other devices of this niche. Tutu can be said that the first pancake is often lumpy. One hopes that the X5 will be worked out at a higher level, like AK120. iBasso DX50 turned out very good option in its price segment and is probably the best solution from the standpoint of price / performance to date. You can also see and correct the mistakes made ​​in the iBasso DX100, destitute of the control key "forward", "back" and "Play / Pause". DX50 gives the impression of top players, who have not completed or a little, or not specifically disclosed the full potential that he was not directly competing models of a higher price range. Moreover, in his price range is the clear leader. 

 

Plenty of favored DAPs show some low frequency roll into lower impedances where it's barely noticeable and a more than fair trade for it's other qualities.

 

Lots of pseudo tech and generalizations on these boards. The DX50 isn't a HiEnd player and I haven't heard one but I suspect it's sonicly VG for it's intended use with portable IEMs of normal impedance. I'm not in the market for a DX50 because I like what I own but those measurements wouldn't dissuade me in the least.


Edited by goodvibes - 10/4/13 at 7:44pm
post #84 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodvibes View Post

A 2.8 output impedance doesn't give a 10db drop into 10 ohms at 20 hz. Max power graphs aren't frequency response graphs. Completely different parameter.

The dx50 has an impedance spike at 100-20hz, which goes up to 14 ohms at 20HZ, this does cause nearly 10db of bass loss at 20Hz with 10 ohm headphones, the problem isnt very severe with higher impedance phones, with 16 ohm phones there is about 2-3db loss at 20Hz, with 32 ohm there is 1-2db loss at 20hz.
post #85 of 289

Guess I'm still happy with having the x3 for my momentums and ety hf5 having impedances of 18 and 16 ohm from a technical pov.

post #86 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by T.R.A.N.C.E. View Post


The dx50 has an impedance spike at 100-20hz, which goes up to 14 ohms at 20HZ, this does cause nearly 10db of bass loss at 20Hz with 10 ohm headphones, the problem isnt very severe with higher impedance phones, with 16 ohm phones there is about 2-3db loss at 20Hz, with 32 ohm there is 1-2db loss at 20hz.

That's not a spike. Spikes are relatively narrow pointed aberrations with 2 sides to them. That's the ascending slope you'd expect from capacitor coupling used to block DC offset. You stated that 3 ohms is causing that sort of roll, not 14. The amount is incorrect either way.

 

The DX50 frequency response with impedance load graph that you supplied shows it only 3-4db down at 20hz with a 16 ohm load which is about what I'd expect from 440uf so a 10 ohm load would represent something closer to 6 or 7db, not 12. Why anybody would still manufacture anything below 16 ohms with todays parts options is beyond me.

 

<2db down at 40hz with a 16 ohm device is quite acceptable overall if it's VG otherwise.


Edited by goodvibes - 10/5/13 at 5:27am
post #87 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodvibes View Post

That's not a spike. Spikes are relatively narrow pointed aberrations with 2 sides to them. That's the ascending slope you'd expect from capacitor coupling used to block DC offset. You stated that 3 ohms is causing that sort of roll, not 14. The amount is incorrect either way.

The DX50 frequency response with impedance load graph that you supplied shows it only 3-4db down at 20hz with a 16 ohm load which is about what I'd expect from 440uf so a 10 ohm load would represent something closer to 6 or 7db, not 12. Why anybody would still manufacture anything below 16 ohms with todays parts options is beyond me.

<2db down at 40hz with a 16 ohm device is quite acceptable overall if it's VG otherwise.

Yea it is about 7db loss at 20 Hz with 10 ohms iems. This is very significant for a basshead and electronic music. Also the 3 ohm average impedance would also tilt the sound signature of iems with less than 16 ohms impedance towards treble. Added to these two facts, the dx50 cant supply 1 volt of power for impedances less than 16 ohm, which is not desirable.

All im trying to say is the dx50 is not so great for iems with impedance less than 16, I think you can agree that the Fiio x3 does much better in this aspect, as it has quadtripple the power, three times the voltage, 0.3 output impedance and no rise in impedance in lower frequencies from capacitor coupling.

I do however think the dx50 is the better overall player by a good margin, and i own one. The dx50 is fine for 16 ohm impedances and up, it really shines in the 30 ohm - 120 ohm area, simply out powering some players costing over twice as much.

I am just making sure people know the drawbacks of the player, some people would think the dx50 is a godsend for all iems, well its definately not for iems under 16 ohms. For example, the Sony xba-40 is an 8 ohm iem that would work very much better with the x3 than the dx50.
I still think its a great player.
Edited by T.R.A.N.C.E. - 10/5/13 at 3:44pm
post #88 of 289

The curve moves according to what the impedance is at a given frequency. The only IEM that I know of that drops in the treble is the TF10. Others are all relatively flat or rising in the treble. I know the Sony is 8 ohms and the new Shure 10 and I've called them both poor designs because of it.

 

The output impedance without the cap wouldn't show any bass roll into a 10 ohm load unless the IEMs impedance varied enough to do so. Power curve would vary but I doubt you could clip it at a comfortable volume into an IEM. Since even multi driver BAs tend to only go higher than their 500hz impedance, even a 16 om device would typically have a max deviation of under 2db other than what's cause by the coupling cap. That's actually pretty negligible in an IEM. Yes, I understand that some will object to a a couple of DB at 20hz but that's pretty much gone with a 24 ohm load.

 

I was very happy to know that My JH13fps are now 32 ohms and actually dropped a couple of DB in efficiency from the earlier model. Helps with the Anniversary 3 as well. Noise and load are quite usable with almost anything. I don't understand why anyone would design anything under 16 ohm in this day and age and 24+ would seem the prudent way to go. Coupling caps will always be here and there are size vs value limitations that can't be overcome.

 

Glad you like it and aren't to put off by the #s.:bigsmile_face:


Edited by goodvibes - 10/5/13 at 6:59pm
post #89 of 289

Hi there head-fiers!

 

My DX50 came in today and I've had the X3 for a few weeks so I'll drop a few words regarding SQ after an hour or so of A/Bing. 

 

X3:

 

- Slight warmth in sound

 

- No skip in first 1/2 second of song

 

- Gapless playback is finicky

 

DX50:

 

- Slightly more neutral

 

- 1/2 second of beginning gets cut off? (Did the 5 second fix!)

 

- (Slightly) larger soundstage

 

- Gapless works!

 

This is after listening to a dozen mp3 320 and ALAC songs of different genres and artists. 

 

Will post more thorough impressions as I get to em!


Edited by JoeDoe - 10/10/13 at 5:16am
post #90 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDoe View Post
 

Hi there head-fiers!

 

My DX50 came in today and I've had the X3 for a few weeks so I'll drop a few words regarding SQ after an hour or so of A/Bing. 

 

X3:

 

- Slight warmth in sound

 

- No skip in first 1/2 second of song

 

DX50:

 

- Slightly more neutral

 

- 1/2 second of beginning gets cut off?

 

- (Slightly) larger soundstage

 

This is after listening to a dozen mp3 320 and ALAC songs of different genres and artists. 

 

Will post more thorough impressions as I get to em!

in the gapless setting (DX50) turn it to 5 seconds then you can cross this off your list

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