Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › The JPS Labs: Abyss AB-1266 Impressions Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

The JPS Labs: Abyss AB-1266 Impressions Thread - Page 58

post #856 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by dub View Post

He. I also have a WA22 and a HD800. I'd like to know if the WA22 provides enough power with the Abyss

Best regards
dt880smile.png

Among my amps is a WA22. I do not own an Abyss AB-1266, so this response is strictly limited to the issue of the general ability of the WA22 to drive hard to drive headphones well.

I own an LCD3 and an HD800. I've owned the LCD2, both R1 and R2. I've also owned an HE6, I've sold all of these but the LCD3 and HD800. Therefore, I have some experience driving headphones that aren't among the easiest to drive, particularly the HE6.

When considering the WA22, one must appreciate that it's really two different amps, depending on the power tubes used. If the 6AS7/6080 tube family is used, then the WA22's power output is lower than it could otherwise be and the WA22 might be better used for easier to drive headphones. However, the use of the WE421a/5998/7236 tube family changes the WA22 into a very powerful amp capable of driving even the HE6 well (though how well is, like everything else, a matter of opinion). I was never as much a fan of the HE6 as some are others here and sold it after not very long. Therefore, my experience with it is much more limited than with some other headphones and I want to be careful expressing anything approaching authoritative opinions about driving the HE6.

I consider the WA22 perhaps one of the best bargains (for some people, that's a poisonous remark) available in fully balanced tube amps. It is wonderfully musical, if driven by the "right" tubes, and it has a huge choice of still reasonably priced and available tubes. If it has a weakness, it's its lack of pre-outputs but that's not a significant drawback for the large majority of people who would be interested in the WA22. It's fully balanced, in and out. It has both twin 3-pin and a single 4-pin output plus a single ended output. It also has switchable balanced and unbalanced inputs and a selectable high and low impedance power switch. Given its musicality, wide range of usable tubes, modest footprint (for a balanced tube amp), and cost of just under $2K, it's a great amp.

I recommend the 5998 over the 7236 simply because I find the 5998 more musical though it is less economical. However, as between the WE421a and the 7236, I think the 5998 hits the sweet spot of power, musicality, and economics. The ultimate is, of course, the WE421a, but these are much more costly than the 5998, which are much more costly than the 7236. All sound fine and few will be disappointed with, for example, the Sylvania 7236 (or, more especially the harder to find Tung Sol 7236), even though my preference is the 5998, as stated. Use your favorite drivers (generally, the 6SN7 class) and rectifiers (generally, the 274b and 5U4G classes) and you just can't go wrong with the WA22. With the higher power output tubes recommend here, the WA22 will be able to drive almost any headphone well, particularly the LCD2 or 3 and the HD800. Though I think the WA22 can drive the HE6 well, I don't want to stick my neck out quite so far for that claim and judgment is best left to personal audition at a meet or otherwise.

Good luck and keep this great amp high on your list unless you're among those for whom a $2K headphone amps would bring embarrassment to you or your family (to say nothing of the cost of its tube complement).
post #857 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric65 View Post
Responses abyss: yellow = pad pressed against measurement frame, blue = less sealed​, pink = even less sealed

 


The bass response (70-80 Hz) of the Abyss objectively varies by nearly 10 dB, depending on the seal or not of the pads.


According to several people who have tested the Abyss, sealing pads seems impossible.


Can we talk of true fidelity about this headphone with a response bass heightened by nearly 10 dB if sealing pads impossible ?
(as if we were to increase the bass of +10 dB with the bass potentiometer of an Hi-Fi amplifier to have more spectacular bass).
 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by purrin View Post
 

 

 

Finally I would ask you this: even if a less than perfect seal, do you actually hear a +10db increase at 70-80Hz with the Abyss. I certainly don't. +10db at 70-80Hz would be extremely noticeable and annoying with most of the music I listen to. If the Abyss did truly exhibit such behavior, I would most certainly throw it away in the garbage can.

 

 

 

 

Dub (french forumeur) which tested the Abyss says about this:

 

"And on this point at least, listening and measurements are fully compatible - by changing the placement of the Abyss on the head (cf. seeking the position in which the rear bearings best rests on the back of the ears), you can clearly hear a change in the bass (which, IMHO, also causes a change in the image which seems more credible).
For my part, besides, it is not so much the fact of "down low" that struck me listening, but the overall balance which is so to speak the "background" of the low register. However, I did not at all feel a brightness in the upper midrange supported - it is rather the opposite (eg, the first violin of a string quartet - even when it is Irvine Arditti that - I seemed softer than usual.)"

 

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/post177954178.html#p177954178


Edited by eric65 - 1/13/14 at 3:32am
post #858 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric65 View Post
 

Hello Purrin,

 

...

 

On the issue of the Abyss port for a perfect seal, even turning the pads, you acknowledge yourself that there may be a real problem for some people (depending on the anatomy of the head) making sealing sometimes impossible.

 

You said : “ I didn't have a problem with seal with the thick part of the pad toward the nape of my neck, though I can definitely see it as an issue with some people. With the above tweaks in place, I do prefer to run the Abyss fully sealed.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by purrin View Post
 

 

Because all humans beings are built slightly differently, in theory I can see some people not being able to get a good seal. In practice, this has not occurred with the half-dozen folks who have dropped by my house for a listen.

 

 

In practice, Pierre Paya (Shiva on Head-Fi), Superfred21 (Member Head-Fi) and Arnaud also have encountered problems getting a complete seal pads with the Abyss.

 

Links concerning recognized sealing pad problem.

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/post177890488.html#p177890488

"Abyss was used without sealing total pad / ear simply because it is not possible.
Even plating headphones against the skull, the seal is not complete.
We found an intermediate setting between a fully open headphones and maximum contact with high temples and jaw.
In this case, the sealing was nonexistent."

 

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/post177891911.html#p177891911

"The adjustment on the head is at first not very easy, there is no real seal between the pad and the pinna, the made ​​to rotate pads ovoid allows the slightly adjust the height of the headphone."


Edited by eric65 - 1/13/14 at 8:43am
post #859 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric65 View Post

 

"And on this point at least, listening and measurements are fully compatible - by changing the placement of the Abyss on the head (cf. seeking the position in which the rear bearings best rests on the back of the ears), you can clearly hear a change in the bass (which, IMHO, also causes a change in the image which seems more credible).

 

Yes, that is true. You can change the bass slightly based upon the position of the pads. 

post #860 of 1632
fwiw i got to hear this can and liked it a lot. this is one can where the photos do it justice. kinda looks like something you'd find in the tool shed. wasn't sure how to put it on at first coz the earcups aren't marked. the sales guy pointed out that the colored cables indicate L and R which wasn't obvious. he also said that the trick is to wear them with the earpads lightly pressing against the ears. even tho it's a heavy can, weight distribution was good and it felt comfy for the hour or so i spent with it.
post #861 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by up late View Post

fwiw i got to hear this can and liked it a lot. this is one can where the photos do it justice. kinda looks like something you'd find in the tool shed. wasn't sure how to put it on at first coz the earcups aren't marked. the sales guy pointed out that the colored cables indicate L and R which wasn't obvious. he also said that the trick is to wear them with the earpads lightly pressing against the ears. even tho it's a heavy can, weight distribution was good and it felt comfy for the hour or so i spent with it.

The Easy Way To Know about Left and Right from Abyss
Please hold on Your hand and see The ABYSS on Your head band , if you can read ABYSS than Your headphone Left and Right is correct .
You can see on The head band left and right , if you can read ABYSS , thats Mean Your left and right earcups are correct

I am sorry i can not upload photos at The morment , My Photo bhuket got limitation 10 GB
Edited by rudi0504 - 1/19/14 at 1:01am
post #862 of 1632
the easy way would be to mark the cups R and L wink.gif but no biggie.
post #863 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by up late View Post

the easy way would be to mark the cups R and L wink.gif but no biggie.

 



I kind of agree but I got used to it smily_headphones1.gif
post #864 of 1632

A headphone which costs 6000 euros, not adjustable in height, whose sealing of pads is not guaranteed for everyone (with harmful consequence a peak up to 10 dB in the average bass  in case of incomplete sealing pads (see above)) and which markings (right and left) is not insured ; it is amateurish, right? 

 

PS: look carefully at the photo of my avatar (my son) with the headphone Stax (adjustable height it) ; see you wear properly an Abyss? ;) Same for my wife with her ​​little head who is hardly bigger. 

post #865 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric65 View Post

A headphone which costs 6000 euros, not adjustable in height, whose sealing of pads is not guaranteed for everyone (with harmful consequence a peak up to 10 dB in the average bass  in case of incomplete sealing pads (see above)) and which markings (right and left) is not insured ; it is amateurish, right? 

PS: look carefully at the photo of my avatar (my son) with the headphone Stax (adjustable height it) ; see you wear properly an Abyss? wink.gif  Same for my wife with her ​​little head who is hardly bigger. 

I'm inclined to agree. I'm certain it won't cost all that much more to make it more (apparently) adjustable. One reservation i have over buying the abyss is the way it looks. Not that my lcd makes me look normal by any stretch but this might strain things a bit. Call me vain but I look ugly enough without a pair of these on my head. However I'll have to try it on before I decide (on comfort). Comfort is not something I can judge by looking at a pair of cans.
post #866 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric65 View Post

A headphone which costs 6000 euros, not adjustable in height, whose sealing of pads is not guaranteed for everyone (with harmful consequence a peak up to 10 dB in the average bass  in case of incomplete sealing pads (see above)) and which markings (right and left) is not insured ; it is amateurish, right? 

PS: look carefully at the photo of my avatar (my son) with the headphone Stax (adjustable height it) ; see you wear properly an Abyss? wink.gif  Same for my wife with her ​​little head who is hardly bigger. 

not sure if you've tried this can yourself but i wouldn't trash it without hearing it first. sure it's no looker but lots of high end gear is fugly and hardcore audiophiles buy it anyways. i had no problems with the fit, comfort or the sound. it's a good can. is it $6k good? for me no but this is for cashed up hardcore head-fier's and collectors i guess
post #867 of 1632

Hello,

 

What is the actual sensitivity of the headphone Abyss and its power handling ?

 

According to the manufacturer, the sensitivity of the Abyss would be 85 dB / 1 mW
No indication on the power handling of this headphone.
http://www.abyss-headphones.com/abyss_ab_1266.html

 

Thyll with his pre-series model of the Abyss have measured an sensitivity of 2.14 mW / 90 dB SPL, which corresponds to a measured sensitivity of 86.7 dB / mW.
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/JPSLabsAbyssAB1266.pdf

 

Agnostic on the production model of the Abyss, in France, have measured a very much lower sensitivity headphones, 8 dB lower than that measured by Thyll : 13.5 mW / 90 dB SPL (instead of 2.14 mW / 90 dB SPL) which corresponds to a measured sensitivity of 79 dB / 1 mW.

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/post177969019.html#p177969019

 

This level of sensitivity is low for a headphone. 
What is the maximum sound level can be reproduced by the Abyss?

 

For comparison, the maximum level SPL of 009 Stax headphones is 118 dB (at 400 Hz) http://www.stax.co.jp/Export/SR009e.html


To achieve the same volume level with the abyss (118 dB SPL), we should use a headphone amplifier of 2 x 8 Watts of power! (if the effective sensibility of the Abyss is well at 79 dB / 1 mW)


Does this headphone could withstand such a power level (118 dB) knowing that the sound level used in the test frequency of the abyss in France was limited to 95 dB SPL (instead of 100 dB) due to a moving of the membrane too pronounced at low frequencies (and high level SPL) during the test? (*)

" Harmonic distortion levels are also higher than other flagships, except that they do not hear to a reasonable level, they still show that we should not push too much sound (I do not have able to make a measurement at 100dB, the membrane began to frolic furiously low fréquences (maybe my amp not powerful enough, but I will not really believe) by the second magnet row certainly lacks, especially in relation to a HE500. "
http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/post177952159.html#p177952159

 

Distortion Abyss level at 95 dB SPL

 

(*) (NB : the headphone amplifier used in the test was able to get 1 Watt per channel before clipping).


Edited by eric65 - 1/20/14 at 11:46pm
post #868 of 1632

Stop spitting your venom on a headphone that you did not listen.:rolleyes:

post #869 of 1632

The French revolution has started again.

post #870 of 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by superfred21 View Post
 

Stop spitting your venom on a headphone that you did not listen.:rolleyes:

 

I am just wondering about the actual qualities (and objective) of the Abyss, especially for headphones sold 6,000 Euros in France and declaimed by you and your group of friends as the best headphones in the world! 
Owner of Stax 009 headphones (not a bad headphone, both subjectively and objectively) I like to understand (and analyze) the objective data. 
Not you?

 

PS : I asked Pierre Paya to lend me his Abyss for comparative listening with my Stax 009 used live on the mk2 RKV;  I received from him an flat refusal  ...


Edited by eric65 - 1/21/14 at 6:33am
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: High-end Audio Forum
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › The JPS Labs: Abyss AB-1266 Impressions Thread