The AKG K712 Pro Support and Impressions Thread

Jun 16, 2016 at 3:49 AM Post #4,441 of 6,363
  You really Need a amp to get the best out of the K712.
I own the 712 and have had the 7xx for a while and they are not the same headphones. As someone already said: Less bass, more refined mid and high, better vocals and a touch more Detail.
Again, without a good amp the AKGs wont Sound as good as they can

 
Thanks for the comment.  I have the o2+odac coming in the mail; I think it's a good choice for me, since I want a neutral sound, and am happy to have some harshness for precision.
 
When did you get your k712?  It seems they had some adjustment recently to become more like the k7xx?  I am not sure I can trust them any longer.  Open to suggestions for other headphones with tight, accurate response, particularly in the midrange.  Don't want to go over $600 though..
 
Also, is the k702 more neutral than the k712?  It seems a lot is changing in the past 2 years, and I can't trust many guides and lists..
 
Jun 16, 2016 at 4:04 AM Post #4,442 of 6,363
   
Thanks for the comment.  I have the o2+odac coming in the mail; I think it's a good choice for me, since I want a neutral sound, and am happy to have some harshness for precision.
 
When did you get your k712?  It seems they had some adjustment recently to become more like the k7xx?  I am not sure I can trust them any longer.  Open to suggestions for other headphones with tight, accurate response, particularly in the midrange.  Don't want to go over $600 though..
 
Also, is the k702 more neutral than the k712?  It seems a lot is changing in the past 2 years, and I can't trust many guides and lists..

I have both the Austrian and Slovakian Version and they Sound exactly the same to me...
 
You can always try the 400S for something different....
 
Jun 16, 2016 at 5:08 AM Post #4,443 of 6,363
 
I don't mean to derail the thread, but could you give a few other brief recommendations?  I primarily want a tight, clean sound, especially in mids, but would like to experiment with open headphones.  Based on things I read here and elsewhere, it seems I should consider the sennheiser hd600?  I tried them once and didn't like the sound?  iIt seems like the hifiman he-500 was once an option in this price range, but the he-400i is less neutral?

 
Headphones like the AKG K702 or the Sennheiser HD800 provide really tight bass with no added warmth in the midrange.
Although these are different headphones, both fall into the slightly dry side of things.
 
Headphones like the AKG K712, the Sennheiser HD700 and the Beyerdynamic Tesla T1 (first generation) are slightly warm sounding headphones. The mid-bass is slighty raised and there's a hint of added warmth that stands for a more 'musical' but still neutralish character.
 
Headphones like the HD650 and the K7XX dig further into the warm sound signature.
Depending on your recordings (and preferences) you might feel they sound bloomy or overly thick in the midrange.
 
Then there's the Fidelio X1 ................. Tons of bass.
 
Jun 16, 2016 at 5:29 PM Post #4,444 of 6,363
  I have both the Austrian and Slovakian Version and they Sound exactly the same to me...
 
You can always try the 400S for something different....

 
 
   
Headphones like the AKG K702 or the Sennheiser HD800 provide really tight bass with no added warmth in the midrange.
Although these are different headphones, both fall into the slightly dry side of things.
 
Headphones like the AKG K712, the Sennheiser HD700 and the Beyerdynamic Tesla T1 (first generation) are slightly warm sounding headphones. The mid-bass is slighty raised and there's a hint of added warmth that stands for a more 'musical' but still neutralish character.
 
Headphones like the HD650 and the K7XX dig further into the warm sound signature.
Depending on your recordings (and preferences) you might feel they sound bloomy or overly thick in the midrange.
 
Then there's the Fidelio X1 ................. Tons of bass.

 
Thanks very much for all the feedback!
 
I will take it slow choosing new headsets.  I heard the k702 is very neutral so I'll try that as well, also the he400i just to have something different.
 
Thanks again for all the quick and informative responses!
 
Jun 16, 2016 at 5:41 PM Post #4,445 of 6,363
   
 
 
Thanks very much for the suggestions.
 
kman1211, your comment is very concerning to me.  I'm also looking more and more into what is happening with the k7xx, and getting all sorts of information; it seems akg is experimenting heavily with the production process and tonal profile, but moreover slowly carrying some of these experiments over to other parts of the akg line (including the k712).
 
Thinking it over, not only do I want nice headphones I can enjoy for many years, but also I'm always happy for some more variety.  I'm therefore considering some other options now.  The T1 and T5p you recommend look very nice, though I'd like to see if there's something I like in the $300-$600 before pushing it quite so high.  I don't mean to derail the thread, but could you give a few other brief recommendations?  I primarily want a tight, clean sound, especially in mids, but would like to experiment with open headphones.  Based on things I read here and elsewhere, it seems I should consider the sennheiser hd600?  I tried them once and didn't like the sound?  iIt seems like the hifiman he-500 was once an option in this price range, but the he-400i is less neutral?

The K7XX was the only AKG I heard that didn't carry what I consider the AKG sound. The K712 was warmer than many AKGs but it's still obviously an AKG in sound. Some of the old AKGs are actually warmer than many modern ones. Brightness and lean bass doesn't always equal clarity. Sometimes it's the bassier and/or headphones that have clearer mids and treble, i.e. Nighthawks, DT 1770, Fostex THX00, Fostex TH900, DT 150, etc. Depends on the design of the headphone, the driver material, driver design, magnet strength, magnet design, etc.
 
The Teslas are worth trying quite euphoric and have pleasant and clean mids. I get the feeling you will particularly like the T1, but the T1 really shines on tube amps that can put good power into it. You will probably like orthos they tend to be quite fast. Though if you're willing to, getting the entry level Stax system, the SRS-2170 will really likely make you happy so clear, tight, and fast compared to most anything in it's price range. I'm not a huge fan of the HD 600 personally. If clarity is your goal I wouldn't suggest it. The HD 600 is kind of a slow headphone(the HD 650 is a faster headphone than the HD 600), gets confused quite easily in complex passages compared to most AKGs and Beyers so it has a problem getting a bit jumbled up and has a tendency to smear things a bit. Has good tuning and tonality though, it's on the warm side in terms of mids. I haven't spent the K612 more than the K7XX. Mid-tier Beyers such as the DT 880 and DT 150(darker but still exceptionally clear) are also worth looking into. 
 
Jun 18, 2016 at 2:31 PM Post #4,446 of 6,363
I am planning to buy k712 after lot of searching on internet.my current set up is fiio x5+e12a amp.There is no local stores carrying them(available online in india) so no chance for a demo.Any one using the above setup with k712?are these sufficient enough to altleast squeeze 90% of k712 potential.guys your advice will be a big help.
 
Jun 18, 2016 at 8:22 PM Post #4,447 of 6,363
Even though that amp is optimized for iems it will probably be enough to get you to around 80-90%.
I would recommend getting something stronger.
 
Jun 19, 2016 at 7:27 PM Post #4,448 of 6,363
If anyone is interested, i tried to rebuild the "flat" EQ-Curve(for K712) from a "nice HP-calibration-App", for systemwide EQ-APO:
 
Preamp: -10 dB
Stage: post-mix

# Filter: ON PK Fc 20 Hz Gain -1 dB BW Oct 0.2442
Filter: ON PK Fc 32 Hz Gain 6.37 dB BW Oct 1.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 104 Hz Gain 1.2 dB BW Oct 0.4442
Filter: ON PK Fc 119 Hz Gain -1 dB BW Oct 0.9442
Filter: ON PK Fc 282.4 Hz Gain -3.39 dB BW Oct 1.29
Filter: ON PK Fc 636.84 Hz Gain -1.7 dB BW Oct 0.7112
Filter: ON PK Fc 820 Hz Gain -1 dB BW Oct 0.2442
Filter: ON PK Fc 990 Hz Gain -1.5 dB BW Oct 0.3442
Filter: ON PK Fc 1285.3 Hz Gain 1 dB BW Oct 0.4112
Filter: ON PK Fc 1634.73 Hz Gain 1 dB BW Oct 0.5689
Filter: ON PK Fc 2230 Hz Gain -2.3 dB BW Oct 0.6
Filter: ON PK Fc 3231 Hz Gain 6.5 dB BW Oct 0.43
Filter: ON PK Fc 4446.47 Hz Gain 1.21 dB BW Oct 0.2741
Filter: ON PK Fc 5500 Hz Gain -1.2 dB BW Oct 0.2442
Filter: ON PK Fc 7378 Hz Gain -6.5 dB BW Oct 0.5267
Filter: ON PK Fc 9763 Hz Gain -4.5 dB BW Oct 0.42
Filter: ON PK Fc 8548 Hz Gain 2.5 dB BW Oct 0.2844
Filter: ON PK Fc 14782.1 Hz Gain -0.09 dB BW Oct 0.4741
Filter: ON PK Fc 11660 Hz Gain -1 dB BW Oct 0.1442
Filter: ON PK Fc 14141 Hz Gain 2 dB BW Oct 0.1442
Filter: ON PK Fc 16578 Hz Gain -1.5 dB BW Oct 0.25
Filter: ON PK Fc 20000 Hz Gain 8.67 dB BW Oct 0.2559
measured my results from HP-out to line-in too:
 


 
k701smile.gif

 
Jun 20, 2016 at 4:17 PM Post #4,451 of 6,363
would iBasso D14 bushmaster (DAC/AMP) be enough? specs say it delivers a maximum of 400mW/32Ω, high gain supposed, but not info about other loads (maybe near 200mw/64Ω?).
and iBasso DX90 (DAP) (245mW/32Ω)?
what about sound of pairing K712 with any of them? maybe Sabre ES9018 slight brightness is not appropriated; however, i've heard D14 implementation is a bit darker and smoother than DX90..
can anyone shed a light?
 
Jun 24, 2016 at 1:32 PM Post #4,452 of 6,363
 
Hi everyone,
 
I want to do a sort of review or assessment of the kind of sound(s) or outcome in my listening habits that happened to me in the very few first days of my ownership.
 
I was delighted with the sound of my beloved K501 so far. My only regret was why a couple of recording companies or very specific CDs sounded so laser defined, edged and hot mastered, aka, a bit too much on the treble band. But they are very few and far between. Some of them are very well known (too close-miked or/and distortion at 0dB) and some of them, strangely for me, very well praised around in reviews without taking into account how painful was the violin, brass instruments, trumpet, horns, etc.
 
With luck, the violin will just sound as right as the medium allows (CDs). With some body, warm wood sound when playing towards the bottom of the scale but, in the highest pitches, well, they will lose all the colour or timbre and only can render a pure pitch. It happened to me also with voices, chorus, bells, etc.
 
The trumpets and horns will sound interesting and not painful, more like stones in a metal can than subtle farting two metres away from you. But colour? Timbre? Forget about it.
 
My K501 usually helps the CD player (a Linn Akurate CD) in offering as much neutrality as they can but together they will process the sound in a very particular way: ancient recordings or hot ones will be painful without remorse. The sound in the CD should be neutral, not very hot, can be loud if it is warm. My own constraints apply here: boomy or syrupy, over-mastered or cloudy, very distant, etc, can cause rejection. But, successfully, I built a small library of wonderful recordings if I understand when the CD was made/mastered and when the recording happened. So far so good, there is a ton of performances to choose. My beloved Beethoven and some deeply moving Brahms concertos and symphonies help me to smooth my rough day at my work when everybody goes to sleep and the city around choose to stay silent for a very few hours. At night, with almost every device unplugged or switched off and no sound from outside, the sounds of an open headphone creates the experience I sought after.
 
So far, so good. Two ‘buts’: every good recording sound quite similar in a sense of triggering the same pleasure or emotional reaction. They shouldn’t I believe, but they do regularly. They sound similar albeit I can figure out differences if I want or pay extra attention. And, maybe, they should be a way or killing too much treble in those particular recordings that I know deserved to be enjoyed (I have one particular Beethoven Violin Concerto in mind but also modern HIP orchestras and Arvo Part recordings). I can do better or look elsewhere to ‘tame’ those laser etched CDs.
 
So I was prepared to do a bit of investment in a DAC of sorts. Some new source that I can enjoy without too much hassle. So I could carry on enjoying my current set up.
 
I can’t avoid the amp or the cables. The amp is a Lehmann Audio Linear. This unit has switches in the bottom to select the gain between 0dB-10dB-20dB. After trying for a while all of them, I settle in 0dB. The other two were or too bright (20dB gain) or not natural enough versus the zero setting (10dB). So I am using the pre-amp inside as a buffer stage I think. It’s fine, it works. Obviously, driving the K501 or the Beyer DT770-250Ohm I have to turn the volume almost all the way up. No problems.
 
So I was in the mood of doing a purchase with a clear objective.
 
And I waited. Before long, one day I pass in front of one of the nice small shops that survives in London that has many headphones to try. All the big boys there, I mean, not the biggest models, but the usual good ones from different brands. I can try my mobile phone with music on some of them or try the default demo device they provide with some samples. I tried both, just for fun.
 
A mistake. And a surprise.
 
The Senn HD600 was correct as usual, nice, polite, a bit distant, a bit ‘look at the good sound I can produce, pity you will never go around the corner and hear the real thing in front of you’. Underpowered? I don’t think so. It’s the best Senn signature sound that I witnessed many times before. Nice maybe but not for me. I need more expression and a headphone that helps with that. My Beyer can help, sometimes, if the music really really calls for it.
 
So I was enjoying my Beethoven and Brahms. But not so much Mahler. Or Bruckner, or other people afterwards. Bartok, Stravinsky. Hummm. Mellow, sweet sound or bombastic and funny with a controlled but an excess of vitality worked. Rimsky Korsakov, Orff, Holst, Rodrigo, Tchaikovsky. All of them worked.
 
But I was happy.
 
Then I tried the K712 Pro they had in Demo. Made in Austria unit, serial very low, seven hundred something only. Very clean and not very scratched or damaged. ‘good condition’ I will put if it were for sale. It wasn’t. They had another brand new sealed unit, made elsewhere and serial sixteen thousand something.
 
I could only test the demos, not a direct connection to my ugly device with my usual music on it (the same I was accustomed to listen in my main system described above). What a good luck I had.
 
The classical music piece (together with rock-pop-jazz-R&B-etc.) was simple and smooth. And then that orange sound arrives. Orange like cooper, orange like the metal ringing of an ugly dumped big bell, orange like the vibration to the infinite of the lips inside the echo chamber of a brass instrument. It was a trumpet. A trumpet that has the colour of a trumpet. First time in my life that I can hear that. And I saw myself in my comfy sofa and Mahlers, and Bruckners, and Wagners around me.
 
That day at home I was regretting my good luck. I found the money and asked for the specific unit I tried, the used demo one. ‘We don’t sell used!’ told me one person in the shop. I gave up. I went the next day. Full of people I asked and asked. I felt a bit embarrassed. I couldn’t explain what happened to me there before. “The new one is the same!” I play the card ‘the new ones are not made in Austria’ and ‘they have change the speakers and now the new units sound different’. I don’t care. I don’t know. I wanted that unit, just in case. They called a manager by phone. They sold me the unit in its original box, with a very small discount. The only new or ‘replaced’ item inside was one of the cables: the straight orange one. They were nice with me. I was the stupid man.
 
Until I reached home with my precioussss.
 
It took me two whole days to find the right time to try them with the recordings I hope now I will enjoy more. Long story short: It worked with Mahler and Bruckner as I suspected. Beethoven and Brahms remains the same or felt as ‘simplified’ versions of themselves.
 
The headphone does a kind of effervescence sound that enlightened and amplifies the pleasure in complex or very complex orchestral music as if they are having an easy job managing those sounds without constraints, free and with over confidence. The result is sort of a ‘resample’ or oversampling of the music. Also there is more info at the bottom without being showy or creating a boomy sound. But as a whole they are showy, they bring spectacular renditions out of massive orchestras. With ease. They have more or less the lovely mids of the K501. But everything is happening upper mids and low treble I think. There is a bit of too much energy, only a little bit, more ‘glare’ that painful bright sound. But how they manage many different timbres and some in the highest pitches with ease is wonderful. You hear more and the very low level is there too, even more than K501, no matter how low the sound is, so no luck with older recordings and noise. And no luck with hotter recordings either.
 
But now I have Mahler and Bruckner. And Wagner is fun as hell. I tried a little bit of my previous Beethoven and Brahms and so far they remain ‘untouched’ as an emotional experience. That’s very good. Maybe there is sadness in losing some excitement with some recordings/interpretations or even compositions as the headphones render them simpler. I don’t know how.
 
I hope my not very sort story/review will help somebody out there.
 
Oh, I forget: yes, clarinets, trumpets, brass... incredible. But no luck yet with violins at full range. Really they shall be the very limit of the CD medium. And I didn't try choral, Arvo Part, or other very high pitched performances.


good read
 
I try HD600 & K712 with my ibasso DX100.  Both are very very good.  Impressions:
 
K712 is 62 ohm, but it's obviously better using High gain on my Dx100.
 
Some said K712 provide on stage sound.  But the sound have rich resonance, things I hear in the back row of hall. But sound position are around listener. One weird thing is, tympani seems come beneath me, or from rear.  
 
HD600: quite clean, not much resonance, more intense (may has to do with shape of earcup I guess).
 
Both are very very good for my bruckner & mahler recording or broadcast files. But my DT990 pro is good enough.
 
Jun 27, 2016 at 1:44 PM Post #4,453 of 6,363
Hi!

I've had these for about 6 months and I'm very pleased with the clarity of the sound, but these are my first more expensive headphones so I guess that's expected.
 
I've been running these with focusrite scarlett 2i2 audio interface because I need the ASIO drivers for low latency. The interface has some headphone amp, but i'm wondering if that is enough to unleash at least near full potential of these? I do get easily enough volume out of scarlett, but people say these are very current hungry. I'd like to know how big of a difference is there if I add an amp between the scarlett and k712.
 
Some people are suggesting schiit vali or magni, but where I live it's impossible to test it myself without ordering one from internet. I just cannot be completely satisfied with the sound quality while I'm not sure if it could sound better :)
 
Jun 29, 2016 at 11:53 AM Post #4,454 of 6,363
  Hi!

I've had these for about 6 months and I'm very pleased with the clarity of the sound, but these are my first more expensive headphones so I guess that's expected.
 
I've been running these with focusrite scarlett 2i2 audio interface because I need the ASIO drivers for low latency. The interface has some headphone amp, but i'm wondering if that is enough to unleash at least near full potential of these? I do get easily enough volume out of scarlett, but people say these are very current hungry. I'd like to know how big of a difference is there if I add an amp between the scarlett and k712.
 
Some people are suggesting schiit vali or magni, but where I live it's impossible to test it myself without ordering one from internet. I just cannot be completely satisfied with the sound quality while I'm not sure if it could sound better :)

 
I find the K712 very boring when it comes to different amps(where i don't have that many to compare, but still).
I use a switchbox which let me compare on the fly, with maybe 1 second delay(at worst) within the same song:
 
I have a Soundblaster Z, SMSL SD-793-II, SMSL Sanskrit 6th + O2 and ALC892 onboardsound.
 
In A/B i could only tell the ALC892 "clearly" apart from the others(which sounds like 11 Khz compared to the rest, and has no headroom for EQ whatsoever).
 
So will i sell my external DAC/Amps?
No, i'm too weak...
 
Will i buy better DAC/Amps in the future?
I hope not!
 
But whatever, i know for the peace of mind, you will get an Amp anyway(i would, and i have - but what about the DAC?
eek.gif
).
 
K712 is kinda boring anyway.
I EQ'ed it close to the soundsignature of the Sennheiser HD600, but other than whats written about the HD600, the K712 still plays (way)"out of your head"(but with more depth with this EQ), so what is there to gain in the future... is this the end already?
 
HD800 + EQ maybe for ultimate sound heaven...
 
It's sad... the K712 is already so capable that with EQ, there isn't much to be desired anymore(unlike with other EQ'ed headphones, which still won't go deep and slam - still don't have the soundstage - still aren't as clear).
 
K712 - sad and boring.
 
frown.gif

 
Jun 29, 2016 at 12:58 PM Post #4,455 of 6,363
Not boring at all in my setup (Bifrost and Asgard 2). I get punchy and deep lows, thick mids, sparkling but not fatiguing highs and incredible soundstage and imaging. They are far from boring, clinical and 2D sound that studio phones produce.
 

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