Schiit Gungnir DAC
Aug 25, 2015 at 7:10 PM Post #2,161 of 7,049
I'm pretty certain I'll be joining the club soon. Question is which one. GMB or Audio GD Dac 19 or the coming Metrum Musette (though that's likely to cost as much as the Yggy which is out of my reach)

 
 
It's all speculation, but I think that the Musette will be designed to sound rather liquid (or put negatively: dynamically laid-back, unexciting). Cees Ruijtenberg deliberately aims for such a turntable sound. I had the Metrum Octave for a month but its character annoyed me so much that I considered switching DACs already. There was just no R2R stuff in this price range that would do better in this regard. Fortunately, the GMB came out. If you prefer liquidity, the Musette might be worth a shot though. Just one more month to wait...


Hmmm if that's the case Musette is off my list. I know what u mean. I had a Unico CD feeding a Audio Analogue Puccini via VDH IC for my speaker system once and while it's seductive it's also too sweet and restrained for me.

Anyone compared the GMB and Dac 19?
 
Aug 25, 2015 at 8:25 PM Post #2,162 of 7,049
What sort of differences are people noticing when upgrading to multibit? Is anyone else dissatisfied with the change? (For example, becoming brighter or warmer than they anticipated.)
 
Still deciding if it's worth shelling the extra $500 for a partial improvement to what's basically the least important part of my gear chain.
 
Aug 25, 2015 at 8:28 PM Post #2,163 of 7,049

Il est arrivée!

Fedex came through a day early.  My new Gungnir MB is now turned on and playing files.  I had to listen a bit to get the inputs/outputs right and make sure it was playing.  I didn't really listen at any length because the Cavalli LC it pairs with isn't here yet and it's connected to a Micro iDSD as a single-ended amp.  What I did hear sounded fine.  I'll give it overnight to warm up and break in but that's about all.  I don't really much believe in breaking in solid state devices.  A little warm-up maybe.  Haven't decided if I will keep it on.  Probably will....
 
More later.
 
Aug 25, 2015 at 11:46 PM Post #2,164 of 7,049
LOL, just got my GMB plugged in and warming started. $500 for a tiny sticker on the back that says "Multi Bit". Make sure you don't lose that sticker in case you decide to sell later! No other way to know except opening the GMB up. Even the USB ID in Mac OSX is the same.
 
Did a sound check and no issues with getting all the sampling rates to show up in Audirvana. Will have a real listen tomorrow.
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 12:42 AM Post #2,166 of 7,049
  LOL, just got my GMB plugged in and warming started. $500 for a tiny sticker on the back that says "Multi Bit". Make sure you don't lose that sticker in case you decide to sell later! No other way to know except opening the GMB up. Even the USB ID in Mac OSX is the same.
 
Did a sound check and no issues with getting all the sampling rates to show up in Audirvana. Will have a real listen tomorrow.

hahaha thats an expensive sticker
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 12:46 AM Post #2,167 of 7,049
  LOL, just got my GMB plugged in and warming started. $500 for a tiny sticker on the back that says "Multi Bit". Make sure you don't lose that sticker in case you decide to sell later! No other way to know except opening the GMB up. Even the USB ID in Mac OSX is the same.
 

 
 
  hahaha thats an expensive sticker

 
Maybe they're not actually any different inside.  
basshead.gif

 
Aug 26, 2015 at 12:53 AM Post #2,168 of 7,049
   
 
 
Maybe they're not actually any different inside.  
basshead.gif

 
If you can't tell the difference between R2R and DS right away, you may be using 96k MP3's...
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 2:21 AM Post #2,170 of 7,049
  What sort of differences are people noticing when upgrading to multibit? Is anyone else dissatisfied with the change? (For example, becoming brighter or warmer than they anticipated.)
 
Still deciding if it's worth shelling the extra $500 for a partial improvement to what's basically the least important part of my gear chain.

Me too! I have only had my DS-Gungnir for about a month now and sound is still improving. I much prefer it over a Stello DA 220 Mk2 i have on loan. Hard to believe the GMB is that much better.....but maybe it is.
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 2:59 AM Post #2,171 of 7,049
     I heard the DISTINCT difference between the DS-Gungnir (which had probably 700 + hours on it)  and the new multibit (brand-new right out of the box)  on the very first note to the very first song I played through it. That was actually Jean Michelle Jarr and it was Oxygene 7 part 1. The first note had a much more palpable and extended treble that was much more cohesive and started from back behind the plane of the speakers, to decaying back behind the listening position to the far left. The DS Gungnir did NOT do that. I WAS HOOKED! So yes, you SHOULD be able to hear a difference right away.
 
   I am also using the new multibit Gungnir on the tweeters only for now, until I get the other Gungnir D-S DACs upgraded. So I suspect I am in for a real treat.  I use an all-active digital crossover, MiniDSP Nano-Digi 2x8 feeding four other Gungnirs.  The signal path is as follows: PC (using JPlay with a dual-PC setup) -USB-Wyrd 1-WYRD 2-WYRD 3- Peachtree USB/SPDF 24/192 converter -Behringer SRC 24/96 (used as a digital input patch bay because it accepts three digital inputs via AES/EBU, SPDIF, and TOSLINK), MiniDSP 2x8 - Gungnir Multibit 1 from 1kHz and up, Gungnir 2 D/S from 900Hz to 544 Hz, Gungnir 3 D/S from 544Hz to 100 Hz, Gungnir 4 D/S from 100Hz to 40Hz, then a Behringer DCX 24/96 feeding sealed stereo subs from 40Hz down  (and I actually am getting some room gain and a spike at 16Hz because of room gain.) My room is not very big though, so that really cool 16Hz wave does not even have a chance to fully crest, so you really don't "feel" it, but it shows up in Room EQ Wizard when I do measurements with the Dayton Audio UMM 6 measurement microphone at the listening position.
 
   Yes, it's a LOT of work, but I enjoy it. On a side note, I was seduced into listening to music yesterday when I was doing a few things online and the system  was playing in the background. I was listening to some Patrick O'Hearn and 3rd Force, and there was some really cool high frequency details and harmonics that were just GORGEOUS coming through that I hadn't so easily and readily noticed before, so I had to stop what I was doing and listen to music for about 30 minutes. I was IMMERSED in a 3-dimensional soundscape that was just addicting. Nuances of music were POPPING out to the side of the listening position and it seems ( now I'm at about the 175 hour mark for the Gungnir multibit burn-in) that it is opening up a bit more. I suspect there is still more room for improvement. You have to consider that being new, the multibit has all those capacitors, resistors, regulators, the transformers, the DAC chips, etc. All of that needs burned-in so I suspect the upgraded units I will be getting will have less burn-in time because the motherboard components will have already been burned-in, and the only thing needed to be burned in would be the actual upgrade multibit board itself.
 
   Aint this hobby FUN!!??
 
Cheers!
-TRQ
 
P.S. My setup is entirely open-baffle, except for the sealed stereo subs. It is all DIY by me. I cannot listen to box speakers anymore. They all seem to sound closed-in. I really like the simplicity and openness of open-baffle speakers. Together with all active line-level crossovers in the digital domain, you can have a VERY revealing system without all the phase-shift that power-robbing passive crossover parts bring with it.  I had a lot of inspiration from my friend Monte. His website is www.mfk-projects.com . And of course to speaker designer Siegfried Linkwitz of linkwitzlab.com for his Orion open baffle design. Monte has a home theater with custom full reclining leather chairs, AND all active digital crossovers, with 12, YES 12, 15" woofers PER SIDE in open-baffle configuration. So that's 24 15" woofers in open-baffle in a stereo configuration fro his home theater. I have never heard (felt) such amazing bone-ratlling low frequency, yet it doesn't hurt your ears.
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 3:13 AM Post #2,172 of 7,049
       I heard the DISTINCT difference between the DS-Gungnir (which had probably 700 + hours on it)  and the new multibit (brand-new right out of the box)  on the very first note to the very first song I played through it. That was actually Jean Michelle Jarr and it was Oxygene 7 part 1. The first note had a much more palpable and extended treble that was much more cohesive and started from back behind the plane of the speakers, to decaying back behind the listening position to the far left. The DS Gungnir did NOT do that. I WAS HOOKED! So yes, you SHOULD be able to hear a difference right away.
 
   I am also using the new multibit Gungnir on the tweeters only for now, until I get the other Gungnir D-S DACs upgraded. So I suspect I am in for a real treat.  I use an all-active digital crossover, MiniDSP Nano-Digi 2x8 feeding four other Gungnirs.  The signal path is as follows: PC (using JPlay with a dual-PC setup) -USB-Wyrd 1-WYRD 2-WYRD 3- Peachtree USB/SPDF 24/192 converter -Behringer SRC 24/96 (used as a digital input patch bay because it accepts three digital inputs via AES/EBU, SPDIF, and TOSLINK), MiniDSP 2x8 - Gungnir Multibit 1 from 1kHz and up, Gungnir 2 D/S from 900Hz to 544 Hz, Gungnir 3 D/S from 544Hz to 100 Hz, Gungnir 4 D/S from 100Hz to 40Hz, then a Behringer DCX 24/96 feeding sealed stereo subs from 40Hz down  (and I actually am getting some room gain and a spike at 16Hz because of room gain.) My room is not very big though, so that really cool 16Hz wave does not even have a chance to fully crest, so you really don't "feel" it, but it shows up in Room EQ Wizard when I do measurements with the Dayton Audio UMM 6 measurement microphone at the listening position.
 
   Yes, it's a LOT of work, but I enjoy it. On a side note, I was seduced into listening to music yesterday when I was doing a few things online and the system  was playing in the background. I was listening to some Patrick O'Hearn and 3rd Force, and there was some really cool high frequency details and harmonics that were just GORGEOUS coming through that I hadn't so easily and readily noticed before, so I had to stop what I was doing and listen to music for about 30 minutes. I was IMMERSED in a 3-dimensional soundscape that was just addicting. Nuances of music were POPPING out to the side of the listening position and it seems ( now I'm at about the 175 hour mark for the Gungnir multibit burn-in) that it is opening up a bit more. I suspect there is still more room for improvement. You have to consider that being new, the multibit has all those capacitors, resistors, regulators, the transformers, the DAC chips, etc. All of that needs burned-in so I suspect the upgraded units I will be getting will have less burn-in time because the motherboard components will have already been burned-in, and the only thing needed to be burned in would be the actual upgrade multibit board itself.
 
   Aint this hobby FUN!!??
 
Cheers!
-Randy
 
P.S. My setup is entirely open-baffle, except for the sealed stereo subs. It is all DIY by me. I cannot listen to box speakers anymore. They all seem to sound closed-in. I really like the simplicity and openness of open-baffle speakers. Together with all active line-level crossovers in the digital domain, you can have a VERY revealing system without all the phase-shift that power-robbing passive crossover parts bring with it.  I had a lot of inspiration from my friend Monte. His website is www.mfk-projects.com . And of course to speaker designer Siegfried Linkwitz of linkwitzlab.com for his Orion open baffle design. Monte has a home theater with custom full reclining leather chairs, AND all active digital crossovers, with 12, YES 12, 15" woofers PER SIDE in open-baffle configuration. So that's 24 15" woofers in open-baffle in a stereo configuration fro his home theater. I have never heard (felt) such amazing bone-ratlling low frequency, yet it doesn't hurt your ears.

Please post a picture of your set up if you don't mind. 
 
Thanks! 
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 8:11 AM Post #2,173 of 7,049
   
... my Wyrd got here today, ... It did make a difference with the TEAC, blacker background on needle drop FLAC's, slighlty improved the overall clarity. 

Are you saying you used the Wyrd on the input side of an A/D to improve a needledrop?  Or just on playback of needledrops?
 
Anyone tried the Wyrd to improve A/D performance?  If so, and it makes a difference, that would be a 2fer for me.
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 1:24 PM Post #2,174 of 7,049
Tubemanrq - you're describing the difference I heard the first time I auditioned the Yggy. It was crazy discovering how much musical information was always hidden, and then being presented. Notes coming from a much different place, with much more detailed textures... They also seemed to last longer, as if they'd been cut off abruptly without me even knowing so in the past.

If you're hearing the same experience on Gumby, sounds like the multibit magic is definitely in full swing.
 
Aug 26, 2015 at 2:05 PM Post #2,175 of 7,049
Not sure where to really post this... For give my ignorance: What does it mean that there are 19 bits in terms of hi-res audio files? I have a lot of hi-res audio, so do DS dacs in reality give the full 24 bit experience or are all DACs limited to less than full 24 bit reproduction? WHat is the implication for digitally recorded music, if they also use DACs that aren't truly 24 effective bits?  Does my question make any sense?
 

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