Quote:

bigshot said:

No. They will last indefinitely if the equipment is in proper align.

Click to expand...

I disagree with you, because any surface that rubs along another surface and produces friction will deteriorate eventually.  That's just a law of nature.  But let's assume for a second you were correct and absolutely no wear occurred.  What percentage of vinyl users will be ensuring that their "equipment is in proper align" exactly?  2%?  5%?
 
And then of course there's the issue that you can't jump to any exact point in the song you want to with repeatable accuracy.
 
CDs are almost obsolete, too, and yes they will also eventually deteriorate on the inside (but I am not talking about the disc format, I'm talking about the data).  There is no need for CDs anymore.  Of course you'll have the purists that argue a high-end standalone CD player will always sound better than a computer-based system, but that just isn't true if the system is done properly.  There will always be some group that wants to hang on to the past and forgo technological progress.
 
With storage getting cheaper by the day, MP3s will eventually become obsolete too.  They won't become completely obsolete though, until broadband speeds are fast enough to be able to transmit lossless formats and play them on the fly.  More and more online stores are selling FLAC files, and even the biggest audio stores like iTunes and Amazon have upgraded their library from the horrible 128kbps MP3 to 256kbps.  iTunes apparently is making preparations to sell high-res audio soon.  I think eventually 16/44.1 will be replaced as well, with 24/96 or 24/192 becoming the standard.  With more and more people using headphones instead of speakers, you're likely to see albums released in dual formats: standard and binaural.
 

High quality binaural recordings of music, released in parallel with the standard release, would be great, but I somehow doubt that's going to happen for a very long time, if at all.

willakan said:

High quality binaural recordings of music, released in parallel with the standard release, would be great, but I somehow doubt that's going to happen for a very long time, if at all.

Click to expand...

 
Several mainstream artists had semi-binaural albums being released, but the new toy syndrom has worn out...now you're lucky if you don't get +10dB clipped mastering so let's not be too demanding.
 
Lou Reed has a few of them: Street Hassle, Live: Take No Prisoners, and The Bells.

Yeah, and there was that binaural percussion album which did the rounds around here a while ago.

ipodpj said:

I disagree with you, because any surface that rubs along another surface and produces friction will deteriorate eventually.  That's just a law of nature.  But let's assume for a second you were correct and absolutely no wear occurred.  What percentage of vinyl users will be ensuring that their "equipment is in proper align" exactly?  2%?  5%?

Click to expand...

You're speaking of record wear in the abstract with no practical experience. Anyone who owns records will tell you that record wear is so minimal, you would have to play the same record several times a day for most of your life to wear it out. Records are designed to be played. Even 78s, which are playedwith a steel needle don't wear out if the needle is fresh.

Back in the 50s and 60s, there were toy phonographs, cheap record players and very old, badly aligned equipment. Records became damaged. Today, vinyl is a specialty and all collectors have turntables that don't cause record wear. It just isn't an issue.

I'm not arguing that LPs are supefrior to CDs. I'm just saying playing records doesn't wear them out. Abuse does. It's exactly the same with scratched or daaged CDs.

bigshot said:

You're speaking of record wear in the abstract with no practical experience. Anyone who owns records will tell you that record wear is so minimal, you would have to play the same record several times a day for most of your life to wear it out.

Click to expand...

There's a japanese DJ that likes to dig old rare music and make mixes w/ them, the pops and clicks are so darn annoying it's unbelievable: http://blogcritics.org/music/article/cd-review-kon-amir-dj-muro/
 
He always makes sure to never tell the names of the bands/songs so he won't have to pay royalties to them...in his idea, he owns this music because it's more or less forgotten and he dug it up himself. I'm OK'ish w/ clean vinyl rips but this guy goes too far: he's selling garbage material, nothing more.

 
Quote:

willakan said:

Yeah, and there was that binaural percussion album which did the rounds around here a while ago.

Click to expand...

Pearl Jam has an Album that's actually titled Binaural, but not every track on it is recorded that way.
 

I only read the first few postings.
I've a question regarding the opening post:
Quote:

leeperry said:

 
The Vinyl drawbacks are IMHO:
-low crosstalk, you'll be lucky if you reach >30dB

Click to expand...

 
isn't the advantage of digital media to have low crosstalk? And one would be lucky to reach someting < ... dB
 
i'd say
 
Vinyl drawbacks are IMHO:
-high crosstalk, you'll be lucky if you reach  <...dB
 
no offence intended, just curious.
 

Quote:

orby said:

I only read the first few postings.
I've a question regarding the opening post:
 
isn't the advantage of digital media to have low crosstalk? And one would be lucky to reach someting < ... dB
 
i'd say
 
Vinyl drawbacks are IMHO:
-high crosstalk, you'll be lucky if you reach  <...dB
 
no offence intended, just curious.
 

Click to expand...

I think he meant "High crosstalk, you'll be lucky if you reach < -30dB"
 
 
At least that's the way I'd write it - the negative sign is important.

vinyl does not sound better then cd's more then cd's sound better then vinyl. It's really a matter of taste and what you're used to. sure high def cd's are more advanced in every technical improvements and so forth but it's an entirely different format like mp3's, music servers and HOOKERS(just kidding!). The reason why people get into analog is because of the analog sound, not that it's technologically better which it isn't, it's because of the non digitized sound or lack thereof. Most of it has to do with nostalgia or old experiences.  Do you really think future generations are going to listen to your MP3's, music servers and ipods etc. like you do now? It's nice to be able to listen to different types of formats. I prefer to listen to CD's over Mp3's. I really don't look at is as which is better but rather having a CHOICE. With vinyl you can play with it and mess with the turntable. With a CD player, it's all remote. Just a different format. To me it's like having different loudspeaker designs. You might like dynamic, the other might light electrostats, where as others might like hybrids. For me, I like to have a VARIETY of gear. Everyone is different and have different tastes. You would have the same arguements in a car, an old design or a new design.

^
 
This is the sound science forum, thus we are talking via scientifically. Scientifically, CD is a much superior format than vinyl (ALL OTHER THINGS CONSTANT).
However what matters more and by and large the greatest factor on a subjective level is not the format, but the dynamic range of the track. Format does not matter as much. Honestly, all you need for music playback is 16 bit / 44.1 kHz. It's pretty darn good scientifically.
 
Also gerbil, you cannot link an loudspeaker design analogy to different formats medium wise. For one, loudspeaker design is deliberately varied to cater to it's intended market. Secondly you are listening to the differences in that loudspeaker design. You are not with different formats.

Quote:

grokit said:

 

Pearl Jam has an Album that's actually titled Binaural, but not every track on it is recorded that way.
 

Click to expand...

Even those tracks on Binaural that are claimed to be so are weakly done - it isn't that impressive.  If I remember correctly, that album also suffers from dynamic range compression.
 

This thread has become tiresome. Now is ze time on SPROCKETS ven ve dance!
 

 
se