If all you need is to hear the outside world, you can ask your JH13 to be (re)made accordingly. They do that for artists who don't want to be cut from the audience and their fellow musicians. Ultimate Ears call this option "ambient."

To: I ponderous, I'm really thankful for the help. Everyone's been great. When I mention opening a floodgate, I meant my PM inbox not the thread. The offers keep coming--even after the post!

Please do not PM me with offers. Again, this is not a for sale thread.

I've logged about 35hrs are so on them.

To Midoo: I am comparing the JH13s to a Grado GS1000i (up for sale) and a Senn HD800 (demo). They are both full size circumaural dynamic phones. They push the air around your ear to a much greater extent than the armatures of an IEM (esp. the GS1000 and HD800). This effect is also aided by their open-backed design, which also gives you minute bits of crossfeed information. Also, unlike IEMs, they give you additional spatial cues by interacting with the outer ear (the "pina").

I don't pretend to understand all the physics, psychoacoustics, or audiology involved. I just know for myself this all translates into a feel of the music being located in my listening environment. This is a personal thing. I am listening to music, enjoying my house, reading, etc. IEMs, for me, close me off from my space. They are designed that way, to isolate acoustic interaction. This allows there to be a pure experience of the acoustic ambiance that was recorded in the studio or live venue. For me this translates into a transporting experience. They make me want to close my eyes and "go there." To my mind, the JH13s do this better than any IEM. It may just not be right for me as I intend it to replace my primary phones.

Given all of this, I am wondering now if it is a fitment issue. This is my first experience with custom molds. I didn't think placement could be adjusted like regular phones. However, I did give them a shot again and accidentally changed their location. They are still sealed but sit protruding more outward. Any IEM will never be full-size, and vice versa, but this does seem to move the sense more toward full-size.

I'll keep everyone posted. Thanks again for all the helpful options.

mmm,i got what you mean,thanks for the elaboration,keep us updated on what you will do.

My best wishes to you.

Some of my friends feel the same way toward iem as you do. One even exaggerated it as Claustrophobia. Just curious, do you enjoy universal iem?

I understand your misgivings regarding the overall sensation of wearing a custom fit earphone that penetrates so deeply into the ear canal. That's one of the reasons why I won't be investing in one. Even with universal IEMs, I prefer models that only require shallow insertion such as the IE8 and the TF10.

Everybody has their preferences for what "sound" should sound like. Some people can never make the transition from speakers to headphones and some people can never move from headphones to IEMs. There is nothing wrong with this - it's just personal preference.

I've found that IEMS have this weird effect where it seems like my head is the speaker, whereas with full sized headphones you do feel like the sound is coming from outside you head. I don't know if I'll ever adjust to way IEMs sound and feel to make an IEM my primary listening device.

As far as selling them, I have this suggestion. If you can only sell them for $100-$200 (since they are customs), don't sell them. You would have quite literally lost close to $1000.

In the grand scheme of things $200 isn't much. Over the course of a year that's not even $20/month. If you sell them and lose close to $1000, in a year you'll probably kick yourself thinking about how much money you lost and now you have nothing to show for it. I don't think that recovered $200 will psychologically compensate you for the money you've lost.

If you can get a good amount of your money back then selling it makes sense. You just have to decide the cutoff where it would make sense to sell it. I won't state a dollar amount here but you can PM me if you want the amount I'm thinking about. Please be aware that I am not trying to buy your IEM so don't think I'm using this as a way to do that.

Hope this helped in some way.

Hi,

First of all I just want to say thank you so much for all the input and encouragement. It was just an enormous help navigating all the bumps and turns of this decision. The short of it is that I've decided to keep the JH13s after all. I've become a total JH13 IEM convert. I'm sorry to those who were interested in buying them. I'm also writing the longer version of what happened in case that helps anyone.

I attribute the radical change from my prior experience to three things.

1) The fitment issue: This is really critical. I had them inserted too deep into my ears. For my ear shape at least, I didn't need to do that to produce a good seal. It only ended up causing a compressed and congested sound. This was a significant part of my feeling, not just immersion but, an uncomfortable sense of submersion (no "air").

2) Physical burn in: I'm not confident about this as the two other issues confound confidence here. Nevertheless, I seem to detect some of the positive affects of typical burn in. Much more significant is factor #3.

3) Psychological burn in: My mind had to make a pretty major alteration in how it interpreted hi-fidelity. All up till now, I wasn't just listening to music through my sound system, I was also listening to the sound system. It was the way that my brain decoded reproduction quality. With the GS1000i and HD800 I wasn't only enjoying the music but what those phones did as the music passed through them. I was always aware I was listening via a transducer-in fact I was listening for it.

When the resolution level gets to the point of the JH13s, reproduction gives way to reality. Wow that sounds like an over the top sales line. At any rate, personally, I needed to adjust from dynamic to armature, circumaural to in-ear, design. But, I also needed to make the jump from valuing the sensuousness of sonic signatures to a clear conduit to the music. It's not that the JH13s don't have a "sound" but that I have never experienced this level of natural realism before.

All this for me has resulted in what I'm calling the S2CSQ ratio or the 2-4-8 rule. But this has already gotten long. So, I'll post that in new thread, as it is a related, but somewhat tangential topic.

Thanks again, and best of luck to all those pursuing the JH13. I can only say its worth the investment.

I think number 3 is honestly a massive factor - one we maybe don't consider enough on these boards.

On a personal note, you shouldn't be apologising to anyone mate - from personal experience I'd say you were a pleasure to deal with - a top banana.

Good luck and enjoy the monitors dude! If nothing else you've confirmed the healthy demand for these 2nd hand, which maybe indicates prices will be healthy and high for resale (unless something radically 'better' comes on to the market).

A happily ever after ending to a thread. How lovely.

Quote:



X2 for me!

I applaud you in your trials and conclusion. It is also likely very nearly the last nail driven into my soon to be lighter wallet, I'm pretty close to getting a pair myself!

As one of the aparently many who tried to releive you of these, sorry for jumping the gun, and thank you for being far more polite than I might have been. You appear to be a gentleman!

Thank you also for your opinions, even if they, among many, are likely to cost me north of $1200!
Cheers ;~)