from Karlosaks observations, he said that the cable was thicker than that of the HD600, and the plugs were bigger???!!!
could this mean that any upgrade cable made for the HD600, won't work for the HD650??? that would be kind of depressing news for me and everyone else. i was going to soon try out the new Zu cables, but am reconsidering seeing as how they might not fit the HD650's, because i will get the HD650's sooner or later and i don't want to have to buy two cable upgrades.
hmmmm?

nevertheless, it sounds like the new HD650's will be an awesome headphone taking on a slightly new forward sound, but still maintaining the Senn HD600 sound character!!! can't wait. jaZZ, you better write a full formative, professional review once you get your hands on yours but seriously, take your time, i can't wait to hear what you have to say!!!

so, what do they sound like compared to the HD590?

http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser...releases_hd650 :

Well, at least they are saying that the drivers are matched. "Hand-selected, matched headphone systems with very tight tolerances (+/1 dB)"

Don't jump too quickly, guys. There's a Special Edition coming out.

http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser...rs_partner_usa (in case you want to email them and ask when they are going to become available in the USA).

If I am not mistaken it has been confirmed, by Sennheiser themselves IIRC, that the cable's connectors will be the same making them compatible with the older stock cable and the other popular aftermarket cables. People are thinking that the new cable has a larger plastic area around the connector's but not right up to the pins themselves where the plastic molding right around them is likely the exact same. I think they wanted to make the overall size of the plug/connector area closer to the end of the cable to be a little more substantial so it's easier to grip and might add to stability in some way. Does that make sense? Hard to explain.

out of curiousity, couldnt it be very possible that the hd650 is actually exactly the same as the hd600 (except looks and some ergonomics of it) but just with different cables? cuz we all know that changing the hd600 cables can change and improve the sound. From some of the newer pictures and from people's speculations, the cables on the hd650 have been changed. could sennheiser just be doing what they did with the 580->600 change? keep the same drivers but just change looks/material or MAYBE in this case, the cables?

I hope so that inner part of the plug is the same. The outer part of the plug was really bigger, maybe for better grip or so. I think I will have to solve the mystery and go for a listening once again (according to the Sennheiser distributor HD-650 should be constantly available for listening on the store from now on ).
I'll then pull out plugs on both phones and compare their dimensions. Maybe on Friday

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The sensitivity is different.

580/600 = 97dB
650 = 103dB

Also the freq response in different, goes lower on the low and a little bit higher on the highs, you may vary with a cable the way those freq are dsitributed along the spectrum, but I doubt you can increase the freq response width with a cable, IMO they are using new "improved" drivers (for good or bad) with a more forward sound, according to what I have read to the date, nothing for sure though, and remember that the paper accepts whatever you write on it....

PeterR wrote: Quote:



Thanks for reminding me of that page. I hadn't made the mental connection between the plot at Headroom and the Linkwitz article until now. Until last month, I hadn't really given headphones any thought.

Certainly, it seems the Sennheiser notch may be deliberate... and may be one of the reasons that their cans have a distinctive, distant (not quite as "in the head") sound.

But, as Linkwitz pointed out, this may differ among individuals (impedance of ear canal drum-to-diaphragm column), which may explain why some listeners swoon and others gag over the Sennheisers.

If I had the time (and money), I'd enjoy building an adjustable equalizer and testing it with high-rez heaphones like the Omega. That and building a proper acoustical measurement phantom for headphones (I'm sure the publications exists out there somewhere....). Have any more links to recommend? :^)

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The trouble is with Sennheiser spec sheets (both HD-600 and the HD-650) is that the frequency response has no attenuation data. Unless one can assume that both are spec'ed at a -3db rolloff, it is hard to tell if the two frequency responses correlate.


JF

From my HD-580's (back of the box):

16 - 30,000 Hz (-3 dB)
12 - 38,000 Hz (-10 dB)

I'd expect the HD-600s to be similar, maybe a little better. My guess is that Sennheiser is talking about -3dB with the HD-600 and HD-650 (but it's just a guess).

At least in common engineering practice, if it is not menitoned it means plus/minus 3 dB. Of course I would never trust this as there are too many manufacturers who fake these things....

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Yep, think you are right about the -3db. However, what is the response inbetween the two end points? I've seen some interesting dips on graphs between 2k and 8khz.

Anyways the Sennheiser Orpheus specs are 25 - 75,000 Hz -3db (for what that means). Must admit my Sennheiser Ministars are a bit veiled between 20k-75khz. Though, I'd kinda like to try the Orpheus out. I think that they would sound okay. Also like to hear some ATC SCM150ASL reference monitors. Oh well, least I've heard the real thing--live music!

Back to the topic at hand, the HD-650s. That's my upgrade path from my Ministars.

And there may be some irony in people complaining that the HD-650s cost more if these same people ditched their factory HD-600 cables for $150+ third party cables. Did Sennheiser listen to users and beef up the 650 cables? Naturally, that would increase the cost.

And speaking of third party headphone cables, on one hand you've got a well respected company like Sennheiser developing the best headphones they are able to produce (for the price) and on the other hand you've got third party vendors selling wire for the same price. You are perfectly right, I have not listened to this third party wire (sure it sounds great--how many milliamps are we talking?). I recommend putting the money into the best transducers you can afford. Think that is where the real action is at--literally.


JF

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Probably, or maybe just a new paint job. But $400 US to find out? And some of what we like about the HD600 might now be gone?

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Risking repeation, newer, better transducers are the components most in need of improvement in the audio chain. And I don't mean that it is possible to make them better.

I say, let's hope for the best with the HD-650s.


JF

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Based on the sensitivty measurements I think it looks like they indeed have made changes to the drivers and IIRC Sennheiser has said they did this in some statement they made that someone posted here not too long ago. A cable wouldn't cause a disparity in sensitivity like that. But it does beg the question that John's eluding to about the quality o fthe cable. How good is that new cable and how does it compare to the popular aftermarket cables? If comparable people could ditch their HD600's and aftermarket cable and be just a little shy of the retail price on the HD650. That also begs another question for us slightly poor, budget conscious people: Will the HD650's be sold at a huge discount at some of these online places and such that have rock bottom prices on the HD600?