FWIR the iphone 3GS has good SQ and apple is finally putting in radio. This makes me more interested in ipods than ever before. I doubt I'll ever buy one though.

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Capacity of 1.8" hard drives is constantly increasing, about 2 times each 2 years. On 2005 fall there was 40gb/platter, then we've got 60gb per platter, 80gb per platter on 2007 fall, then 120gb per platter on 2008 fall and now 160gb on 2009 fall... i believe that there would be 240gb/platter on 2010 fall and 320gb/platter on 2011 fall; the question is if apple will still produce hdd-based ipods at the time.

I was really excited when the touch first came out, because I have always hated the scroll wheel on other ipods. I got the 32GB when it came out and I still use it, still love it.

I don't think ipods really need innovation any more, they need improvements in storage, SQ and price to keep above their competitors.

I've stuck with my 5G 60GB model since 2004. I ended up adopting an "economy of use" attitude about syncing music. I only carry around music that I know I'm going to want to listen to, or the most recent additions to my library. Nowadays I usually just read on the subway and leave music listening to my home and my office. It helps me save money towards desktop upgrades, lol.

I think it is a mature product. The iphone is really what kind of pulled it all together. Now there is nothing really left to put into handheld devices that will give a dramatic leap at least until biotechnology starts coming into play which won't be for awhile.

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This "economy of use" concept is certainly interesting - and can be applied to DAPs with as little as 4GB capacity. My main portable rig is a June 2009 purchased Apple-certified refurb 3rd Gen nano with 4GB, and is loaded with virtually anything I'm likely to desire with room to spare. New-to-me music takes greater than 95% of my listening time so I don't have that need to carry "all the music I've ever owned" around with me. This image of a wall of CDs available at one's fingertips is greatly overrated as relates to my habits.

My music server isn't like that so why not my DAP? Why waste time deleting/re-encoding music and copy across? Just encode whole lot in one go leave entire library on your DAP.

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Answer: don't want to. I have the Beatles Sgt Peppers album. Have loved it throughout time itself. But will NEVER, EVER cue it up to listen to it. I've burned it out, flamed forever and never to be had again. RIP.

Understand, I STILL love Sgt Peppers. Should it pop up at my brother-in-law's house or in an elevator somewhere, I still enjoy the listen. But given the choice, as I am totally given when I control the buttons on iPod, I'll NEVER select it, in favor of Dream Theater's latest disc or whatever. I NEVER shuffle music either BTW.

In fact, take it a step further. What if you had a 500 GB DAP? One terrabyte? 500 terrabyte? Would one's intention be to carry every album, every movie, every short home video EVER in our possession? Would we be content to scroll for twenty minutes to locate that which we were looking for (give or take short cuts)? Capacity will surely catch up with whimsical desires, easily facilitating such fancies. Since it is not even close to being there yet a certain amount of discernment will be necessary. For me, that exercising of choice comes in the form of," what do I have time for today?" (given no more than 1-2 average listening hours per day) Newest, most interesting and relevant content is what always prevails.

I just want a 120GB Ipod Touch.

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I completely agree with this. The average consumer does not value sound quality very much. This is why popularity does not mean much when evaluating audio products. And this is why, though Ipod has gained many new features, the actual sound reproduction is still pretty weak.

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Interesting how different listening habits can be. I'd say about 85 to 90 percent of my listening is to material I've already listened to many, many times before. I do try to listen to new stuff now and then, but I've learned from experience that most new stuff (just like most old stuff) is, imho, crap. So I try to make the best use of my limited listening time to what I consider good stuff.
I would love to be able to keep all that music that I consider good on one device and take it with me wherever I go. More storage the better.

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Snake,

Not sure of your listening "experience", but do you have any albums you've been enjoying for more than 30 years? At some point the music can get so stale as to be rendered unlistenable.

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Afraid it is closer to more than 40 years. Of course, I don't listen to those albums on a daily basis. My music ibrary is rather large and my listening moods have varied considerably over the years. When I'm in the mood for some Motown tunes from the 60's I still find them very enjoyable. The same can be said for the Beethoven symphonies I have enjoyed listening to over the past 20 years or so.
Have lately found myself developing a taste for Wagnerian Opera and wouldn't be at all surprised if I still enjoy that 30 years from now if I am fortunate to still be alive and not deaf at that time.
Guess if I found an album to be completely unlistenable I would not classify it as good music. Certainly as we age our tastes vary and what once seemed to be good can now seem to be quite bad.

I really likes to see ipod touch with 120GB HDD but i think Apple shows no interest to increase capacity that fast. So we have to wait next three years till it's(120GB) available in flash drive. Now i wondering if Apple launch ipod classic special edition for audiophiles with greater internal AMPs and DAC. Quote:

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Why the average consumers don't value sound quality very much? I think the average consumers are kidnaped by the big brands. and the commercial channels also are kidnapped by the big brands. even the medias are kidnapped by the big DAP makers. It is hard to make a difference voise for the small makers. So the average customers have to select between the same low fi players. I don't know what is defferent between the SANSA clip and IPOD Touch in term of sound qality.

Yes the sound quality between the differece DAPs is only in the sound signatuer difference than not the essentially overall sound quality difference. The average customers have no time, no energy or no skill or no chance to experience the really hifi set up. ------ the result is they reluctant to cost time to be picky on the sound quality beteen the difference low fi DAPs.-----thus the DAP maker say the average customers is satisfied with their low fi DAP, It just like to the chrildren, you give a noise toy to him he will be happy.

The sequence is the DAP market is shrinking day by day, the NO picky average consumers lost interesting on the DAP.

It is truth that many average costumers don't know what is amp, and why you need to replace a earphone or mod a earphone cable.

So headfi org become the best platform to communication on portable audio gears. So the headfiers is very happy. at least the members of headfi are not the average consumers. Headfiers can get the informations and experience on the DAP or portable audio tech informations from here. and the small really creative comapanies have a platform to deliver their voice. So the headfiers can mod the portable gears, can trial different paring. and can test the latest innovation products of hifiman and AMP3.