Are expensive cables silly squiggly snakes? Ahhh! Mine eyes!
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:13 AM Post #61 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Once again you assume cables are only capable of a muiscule impact on sound and you sir could not get any further from the truth. You are wrong, plain and simple.


Then I ask you to provide the evidence that high end cables modify the frequency band of an audio signal less vs. a budget cable, in decibels please. And using appropriate measuring equipment.

Perception and opinion are not counted as evidence.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:15 AM Post #62 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Do you get a tape measure out to measure your underwear when you buy it or do you just rely on how it fits? Funny how its always the ones who dont have any experience yelling Placebo. I used to think the same way you did when I got into this, cables are bull. Then I bothered to find out for myself and in doing so I met others who experienced the same things I did, with amps, headphones, tubes, sources, and cables. At least bother to find out for yourself before you go telling me what I "MAY HAVE HEARD".


Question avoidance skill +50.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:18 AM Post #63 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Then I ask you to provide the evidence that high end cables modify the frequency band of an audio signal less vs. a budget cable, in decibels please. And using appropriate measuring equipment.

Perception and opinion are not counted as evidence.



Only by you and a few other confused inexperienced people. If you want to get an osiliscope out then feel free. I took the time and money to find out for myself, you do the same. Are we supposed to spoon feed you knowledge? Stop discounting your own ears and open your mind.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:19 AM Post #64 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Then I ask you to provide the evidence that high end cables modify the frequency band of an audio signal less vs. a budget cable, in decibels please. And using appropriate measuring equipment.

Perception and opinion are not counted as evidence.



The frequency band of an audio signal is also not the entire summation of the sound a person hears (Otherwise a large number of products would be pointless to buy in the audio world, more so than have been already acknowledged), which is why measuring equipment doesn't account for the audible differences between audio equipment.

In order for there to be a true test, there would have to be some machine that fully replicated a set of human ears (not even just one). Then you would have to slap some headphones on top of it, take some readings of the output data of the "air to ear" sound transform, then try a different cable.

This is why someone hasn't just proved that there's a difference with different cables to people's ears, because science just isn't there yet.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:20 AM Post #65 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Do you get a tape measure out to measure your underwear when you buy it or do you just rely on how it fits?


Haha, yeah, I personally try on a bunch of different underwear before I find what fits -- rather than by looking for the correct waist size value on the underwear packaging. It's funny how 10 bags of opened and used underwear scattered about the dressing room floor can set off store employees -- especially when they have to pick off a lot of strange looking curly black fibers.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I used to think the same way you did when I got into this, cables are bull. Then I bothered to find out for myself and in doing so I met others who experienced the same things I did, with amps, headphones, tubes, sources, and cables. At least bother to find out for yourself before you go telling me what I "MAY HAVE HEARD".


One could say this is a product of groupthink -- although, you may indeed be onto something that only experienced insiders can see. [cue twilight zone theme]
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:21 AM Post #66 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Only by you and a few other confused inexperienced people.


Then why do we sound pressure meters to calibrate separate speakers to an accurate volume in a speaker based audio system?

According to your logic, doing such things by ear should yield perfect results.

Problem being you would not be able to prove both speakers emit the same volume sound with out a SPL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taikero /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The frequency band of an audio signal is also not the entire summation of the sound a person hears... which is why measuring equipment doesn't account for the audible differences between audio equipment.


I am afraid this line of reasoning is incorrect: the audible frequency band does account for what a ear measures, but not for what a person perceives. If you are implying below 20hz then it is still flawed as most headphones roll off below that, and most people can only feel such frequencies. If you imply above 20khz then you are still flawed because most headphones really roll off above that, and most ears cannot measure perceivable changes in volume at those frequencies.

Notice that what an ear measures is the same thing a microphone measures: air pressure waves. So if different audio equipment does produce different sound the only way such differences could be measured by the ear are in the form of air pressure waves, the same thing a microphone measures.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:26 AM Post #67 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by MadMan007 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Question avoidance skill +50.


I don't know all of the technical reasons for why cables work the way they do, but I am smart enough to believe my own ears and not your skepticism. If you guys don't want to benefit from my experience then its not me your hurting. I have music playing just now through a system I spent a year acquiring and I am completely happy with each and every part. I have learned a lot from others (who have an open mind) and helped a lot of people along the way. If Skepticism is your only concern then maybe you should not be on a site for audiophiles. What is it that you want me to tell you? You could learn more from my signature than I could learn from a handful of your posts.
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Feb 9, 2009 at 8:27 AM Post #68 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Then why do we sound pressure meters to calibrate separate speakers to an accurate volume in a speaker based audio system?

According to your logic, doing such things by ear should yield perfect results.

Problem being you would not be able to prove both speakers emit the same volume sound with out a SPL.



I dont think I need a meter for headphone calibration, see what I mean?
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:38 AM Post #69 of 1,535
I think you are missing the point of my example: in this circumstance ones ears do not yield proof.

With out that proof, you are not able to rule out ones mind for the cause of what you hear.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:40 AM Post #70 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Its very easy to hear the difference between silver and copper.


Since silver is approximately 5% or so more electrically conductive, I could imagine that perhaps there may be some difference to the perception of the signal going though it -- although I don't think this necessarily makes it a better cable, especially not $200+ better. I'm fine with copper.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:47 AM Post #71 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I think you are missing the point of my example: in this circumstance ones ears do not yield proof.

With out that proof, you are not able to rule out ones mind for the cause of what you hear.



Agreed.

On a side note, none of this should become an "us vs them" competition. My only stake in this is the truth, not to win an argument...

...even though I am winning, you losers. lol jk.
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Feb 9, 2009 at 8:51 AM Post #72 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by CompressionalFlagellation /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Since silver is approximately 5% or so more electrically conductive, I could imagine that perhaps there may be some difference to the perception of the signal going though it -- although I don't think this necessarily makes it a better cable, especially not $200+ better. I'm fine with copper.


Depending on how long the cable is, it could actually be worth $200 (given a reasonable markup and the cost of decent connectors).
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Pure silver's expensive.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:58 AM Post #73 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I think you are missing the point of my example: in this circumstance ones ears do not yield proof.

With out that proof, you are not able to rule out ones mind for the cause of what you hear.



Just because ears don't "yield proof" in this circumstance doesn't mean they NEVER can be used to prove anything (like you are implying).

I think your belief that everything in audio can be measured is false (IMO).
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 8:59 AM Post #74 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by CompressionalFlagellation /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Since silver is approximately 5% or so more electrically conductive, I could imagine that perhaps there may be some difference to the perception of the signal going though it -- although I don't think this necessarily makes it a better cable, especially not $200+ better. I'm fine with copper.


Its only better if you want what silver has to offer. Personally I dont like silver cable as it has a very un natural sound signature.
 
Feb 9, 2009 at 9:05 AM Post #75 of 1,535
Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Or maybe its both.

COLD-WELD SYSTEM: Novel plug design enables a perfect heat-free connection between cable and plug.

When King Cobra is fitted with RCA plugs, two conductors are used together for the much higher potential across the negative connection, providing a substantial performance advantage. The shield is only attached at one end, providing total shield coverage without compromising the negative conducting path.

kingcobrafx9.jpg



I hate to say it, but that looks like the construction of about every decent cable I've ever seen. Copper wire, plastic covering, foil wrap and plastic out sleeve. "Drainwire"? But agreed, the only cable I ever didn't like was silver. So I'm not saying cable doesn't make a difference. But a basic copper cable pretty much delivers the sound I want, and not an expensive one at that. This is the best cable I've ever heard. https://www.thecableco.com/product.php?id=4871 I once owed 7 pieces of speaker wire at the same time and did a anal-retentive shootout at this stuff won. $24 for 30 feet.
 

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