I want to have faith in Ray Samuels Audio... but I just don't
Aug 8, 2008 at 1:38 AM Post #182 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by malldian /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Which makes this thread... pointless.


If you don't care about the technical aspects of his designs that you might buy and only the "how it sounds to me" or other's opinion, I guess. Anyone can open up what they bought and see, I don't think he wants to talk about the possible accomplishments or flaws of his designs specifically though, just a guess, I didn't ask him myself. He isn't doing design for the DIY community.

Quote:

Originally Posted by malldian /img/forum/go_quote.gif
In that case "who/where" needs to step up or I see no reason this shouldn't be locked.


Thanks for your opinion, it does not seem to be needed. I'm sure the mods know how to do their job.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 1:49 AM Post #184 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire /img/forum/go_quote.gif
My question is, if it contributes to his signature sound, should it be labeled "flaw"?


No comment on Ray's designs, but crosstalk or extra noise is not usually considered to be a positive sonic signature. Stuff like rolled off frequencies, maybe.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 2:05 AM Post #185 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by manaox2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
No comment on Ray's designs, but crosstalk or extra noise is not usually considered to be a positive sonic signature. Stuff like rolled off frequencies, maybe.


Or rolled off highs, particularly. That seems the one frequency where inadequate reproduction could be considered desirable.

I can understand the desire to protect one's intellectual property - the whole issue with the Grado RA-1 clones and Graham Slee clones bears testament to the necessity of this.

But then again, many manufacturers use the quality of the componentry they're using as selling points. Elias the Benchmark rep has been very forthcoming with technical info of the design, implementation and hardware used in the DAC1/USB/PRE in the "DAC1 now comes with USB" thread, as one example. Justin was also very candid as to the DAC chip, upsampler chip and so forth used in the Pico.

And Ray is in fact quite candid about the componentry he uses as well. Looking on the RSA website, he states that the Raptor is OTL, that it uses a 12AU7 driver tube with 5687 output tubes, Holco .5% tol resistors, Musicap polyprop caps, Plitron toroid, and so on.

To quote the RSA website:

"The power supply is dead quite. Two stages of rectifications follow the full wave bridge rectifier, each stage with current limiting 1% Vishay power resistors, these two stages slow down the current hungry caps, allowing the filament voltage to get to the tube first before the plate voltage rises to the required voltage. A high voltage regulator is implemented in the power supply to keep the voltage steady no matter how the AC voltage fluctuates. As to the filament voltage, a very powerful, compact universal switching power supply is used with 12VDC, 3.4 amp of current."

When I read this, the first thing I think is "No, it wasn't", and then my eyes latch on to that keyword switching power supply.

I'm no engineer, but I did alot of research on amp design choices when I was customising my old M^3, and one thing that cropped up was that switching power supplies are somehow 'bad'. I dont know how, or why, but seeing that on the RSA website immediately makes me think that this may have been a contributor to the issue I had.

Which could be completely incorrect - maybe as someone said earlier, I was using an older version with a different toroid, which is what caused the problem - but I'm interested enough to want to find out.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 2:24 AM Post #186 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by Covenant /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I dont see what the problem with the title is. It gets straight to the heart of the matter - I want to believe in RSA products, but currently do not. My initial post goes on to give a history as to why I do not, and then asks for information to disprove/enlighten me.

The title does not say anything about Ray Samuels the man, nor does it imply that all of his products, or even just the Raptor, are objectively bad. It was deliberately made subjective by my use of "I" in "I want to have faith".

But can we please stop squibbling over grammatical connotations and various interpretations of my intent. I've described my intent in depth.



That was never under dispute. My original thread was linked to give people an idea of the hiss/hum problem that I originally noticed. It was not an "inquiry" into the conduct of RSA, because it is eminently clear from the way he handled my complaint that his conduct and professionalism is par excellence.



Saying something like, "I've lost faith in Ray" is a bit extreme when even you admit that his service is great...you could have simply stated that you had some questions about his product design...

It's just a bit overly dramatic....it makes it seem like he has commited a transgression against u...lol

FYI..I am not a customer of RSA...
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 2:28 AM Post #187 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by number1sixerfan /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Saying something like, "I've lost faith in Ray" is a bit extreme when even you admit that his service is great...you could have simply stated that you had some questions about his product design...

It's just a bit overly dramatic....it makes it seem like he has commited a transgression against u...lol



I guess you're right about that. After the fact now though
frown.gif
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 2:34 AM Post #188 of 267
I knew this one would stir it up like no other. Ray sits firmly on the Mt. Olympus of head fi and blasphemy of the gods always brings people out swingin' whether Ray, Tyll or anyone else.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 2:37 AM Post #189 of 267
EDIT: N/M

There seem to be two sides and little in between. However, I have yet to hear anything useful. People are always upset when they think someone is taking too much money and too much credit then they deserve. We can't seem to get past that issue to get anything done. Like discussing the topic, not its effects.
frown.gif
I'm guilty now too.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 3:43 AM Post #190 of 267
I have complete faith in Ray Samuels Audio. First I would like to say that I love music, I have been playing guitar for most my life. As a musician I use my ear's as a tool, I consider myself someone who pays close attention to sound, and the manipulation of sound. I value my experiences with music, and share them with careless abandon. I guess it's with my background it is no surprise that I consider myself an 'audiophile.' Having recently propelled myself into the practice of using headphones as my primary source of enjoying music I became acquainted with one of Ray Samuels Audio's amps, 'The Tomahawk.' At the time I was exploring the DIY route, and became familiar with things like capacitors, resistors, printed circuit boards, switches, and operational amplifiers. I was so floored by the 'Tomahawk' that I decided to hang up my DIY efforts, and pull out the wallet. When I received my very own 'Tomahawk' the curiosity and interest that was instilled in me by my attempts to build my own amplifier fed a certain desire to open up the amplifier and have a look inside. I remember marveling at the small circuit board with everything laid out in such a perfect manner and soldered with love, it just seemed to hypnotize me. I remember thinking to myself as I admired the craftsmanship, 'whoever is responsible for this truly has a deep love and appreciation, and an enormous sense of pride for what they do.' I think that moment is truly what solidified my admiration, and respect for the Ray Samuels Audio product. I guess I can really identify with the work ethic the finished product exudes. Aesthetics are not even the tip of the iceberg either, I mean I can honestly say that the sound I get from a Ray Samuels product is to me, perfect. I look forward to, and enjoy every listening session I have with my XP7. Even on Ray's website, his products are not marketed in a way that would sell just anyone. I mean he is verbalizing his enthusiasm and excitement for the product, but he seems to do it in a sort of 'tech talk' style. I mean not everyone truly knows the benefits of using 'polypropylene' 'metal film' or 'tantalum' capacitors/resistors! You know? I mean but it's just Ray, he's excited, and he's proud of what he is creating. He has faith in himself, all you got to do is talk to the guy to know that. I guess all I'm saying is how can you not have faith in someone who has so much faith in what they do? Gosh, I mean the guy picks up the phone every single time I have called. He takes ownership, responsibility, and pride in everything he does. You really cannot ask for any more than that. Here is to you Ray Samuels! May you live long and create many more fabulous audio creations! P.S. - Looking forward to the new amp! Happy listening everybody, and thanks for reading. Best - WaxMan.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 3:57 AM Post #191 of 267
did you recognize any of those parts actual uses in there place and have more to add to the main topic? From pics I found (wish I had some to post here), I couldn't tell much myself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WaxMan /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I mean not everyone truly knows the benefits of using 'polypropylene' 'metal film' or 'tantalum' capacitors/resistors! You know?


I bet someone with any DIY experience does.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 4:28 AM Post #192 of 267
I don't like tantalum caps but the resistors are very nice. Funny how as a cap they suck but as a resistor it is excellent though I like Kiwame or Riken Ohm carbon resistors as much and they are much less money. Sadly the only tant resistors have magnetic ends now and that messed with the sound. On the tant caps, they have been used in a preamp with a constant charge on them and sounded great. It is all about implementation.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 4:35 AM Post #193 of 267
I was just trying to illustrate how on the RSA website the way the products are described in the paragraphs are not really directed towards the average Joe on the street. I mean it's really just Ray personalizing and taking pride in that he uses the best materials in the construction of his product. But you know it's just kind of like 'tech talk' if you think about how the average Joe would react to something like that. I don't know it's just the endearing way in which Ray talks about his stuff. I mean it's cool you know, just Ray being himself. Never mind I'm being over analytical. Ray rocks!
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 4:47 AM Post #194 of 267
Quote:

Originally Posted by WaxMan /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I was just trying to illustrate how on the RSA website the way the products are described in the paragraphs are not really directed towards the average Joe on the street. I mean it's really just Ray personalizing and taking pride in that he uses the best materials in the construction of his product. But you know it's just kind of like 'tech talk' if you think about how the average Joe would react to something like that. I don't know it's just the endearing way in which Ray talks about his stuff. I mean it's cool you know, just Ray being himself. Never mind I'm being over analytical. Ray rocks!


If it sounds like it is not directed to average Joes, that is probably because it really is directed specifically to people who love headphones and headphone equipment or head-fi in general. We like being marketed to.

Who doesn't take pride in their creations? Your a musician. You wouldn't purposely put something out there that you didn't care about and I'm also sure Ray or most other manufacturers in a serious business wouldn't. Sadly, materials don't only make the amplifier, lets talk design.

update: I think you made me realize something. The average head-fier isn't going to understand the technicalities of amp implementation. The OP sounds like he already found some stuff that could satisfy. No one is coming forward probably because they know this. This isn't going to change any minds or help many. People do buy these and other products based on marketing or word of mouth, otherwise we would all be a little smarter on many topics. So, if you really love your equipment, know your equipment. Thanks OP for coming forward, best wishes in the future.
 
Aug 8, 2008 at 5:36 AM Post #195 of 267
Some people may like one type of design over another and think this or that may work better in a certain circuit, but i dont consider it a design flaw unless the product fails, or fails to deliver.
If it over heats, breaks down, goes on fire, breaks up, sounds like trash, hums bad at listening levels, crackles......then its flawed.
If it sounds good, keeps working, runs cool enough to be safe and have decent longevity, looks professional and neat within reason,......then i dont think its flawed no matter who feels they can improve it.
Maybe their "improvements" would ruin the house sound somehow???
I also dont give a hoot who copied what, as long as it wasnt illegal and sneaky.
I have a bunch of DIY amps here, and im sure the builders didnt design every one of them from the ground up.....but im happy with them all and the price i paid and they all work fine and sound good. As long as i get what i want, i really dont give a darn.
We live once...and life is short....i dont have time to worry about it.
Freekin enjoy your toys already, and worry about your own successes and failures and unless its truly a crime, dont worry about everyone elses.
Anyway, we got Bose and Monster to make fun of and point fingers at....and theyre big enough to take it.
biggrin.gif
lol
 

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