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ATH-ES7 vs. Equation Audio RP-21

Nov 3, 2007 at 4:04 AM Post #46 of 60
Thank you for your answer. What i have hear about the RP-22X is that it has more deep bass, just not more bass impact (it must be leaner). Or anybody will prove to me the opposite. I believe that for that, the RP-21 are more popular...
in other hand, you have test this headphone with movies?
Good luck
Quote:

Originally Posted by nick20 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Man..

I gotta say the RP21's are impressive. I've read the RP22's are like $20 more, come in silver instead of gold/copper/bronze or whatever color you wish to say the RP21's come in.


All I can say, since I JUST got mine two days ago, is these things are BASS machines. Lots of bass in the lower and mid sections. By that I mean, strong, thunderous bass, yet detailed, and in no way "mushy" or "bloated". A little difficult to explain. IMO, and only IMO, the bass from these HP's is nearly perfect. Good down low, but as good in the middle. Maybe with more listening experience I could further explain this, but I am trying my best. If you have any interest in enjoying bass, look no further than the RP21's.

Yet, the RP21 sound seems to mesh so nice. From only a early listen (2 CD's total) the soundstage, details and treble are also nice. Overall, a great sounding HP. The best under $100? That's up to the person hearing them. Since I received mine in a trade, there's no doubt I would buy these if given the chance.

The RP22's look a lot better than the RP21's, and aren't AS portable as the ES7's, only because the ES7's look much smaller, and are lighter. I would not hesitate to use the RP22's in public. Maybe not so much so the RP21's, unless you like the color. I don't dislike it, I just don't prefer it. It's nice, but not my "cup of tea"..



I listen to a variety of music, from some female vocals, to a little hip-hop, to some Bob Marley, and Maroon 5. (etc. etc.)



Overall, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the highest performance wise, these easily get an 8.

And cost to performance wise these are close to a 9 out of 10.



Performance: 8/10
Price/Performance: 9/10

Not perfect, but to me, these are awesome sounding cans. I find myself tapping my feet more with the Grado's (just got these yesterday), and I would have to say both are extremely enjoyable HP's.


Any questions? Let me know, I will do my best..






-Nick
rs1smile.gif



EDIT: If anyone cares, I just got done listening to Taylor Swift (labeled as country, but she's has great vocals) and the bass overall in the CD isn't very strong, but when there was bass, it was detailed and refined. Not big, strong or thunderous, like I mentioned above. The bass was snappy, tight and articulate, and had good overall synergy with what I was listening to. It just goes to show, these headphones can hit the spot almost anywhere in the bass region.

If you're listening to hip-hop, some rock, or something that has noticeable bass, these will present big, strong, thunderous, bass, and can also show its lighter side with the more detailed and refined bass.


Overall, I am very pleased with the bass. And I'm not that much of a fan of "lots of bass". These sure hit the spot in the bass department. I'm sure there's better, but I do doubt there many headphones in the sub $100 category that compete bass wise. Of course, each headphone has it's pro's/con's, and the RP21's sure outweigh the con's by a significant amount.


 
Nov 3, 2007 at 4:21 AM Post #47 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by wilashort /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Thank you for your answer. What i have hear about the RP-22X is that it has more deep bass, just not more bass impact (it must be leaner). Or anybody will prove to me the opposite. I believe that for that, the RP-21 are more popular...
in other hand, you have test this headphone with movies?
Good luck


If this is directed to me, which I think it is; I have not tested with movies. These run off a tube amp.


I also forgot to mention, when listening to some bass heavy (if you will) Bob Marley, which isn't really bass heavy, its more like in the middle of being lean, detailed and articulate, and strong, thunderous and impactful (it's VERY nice). It's just the "right" amount of bass. In other words, it doesn't "drown" [muddy/boomy?] the other sounds, music or the voices, it isn't too dry and lean.

To be honest, it's not the best bass in the world, but it is damn good. There is times the bass struggles, but more times than not it is very good. There's certain notes on Kayne Wests' (Graduation) CD that I highly doubt any headphone can reproduce accurately, and I know the JVC DX1000 are bass monsters, but I still cannot see any headphone actually reproducing it. Speakers (and subs) yes, I don't think headphones can do it..



Again, I am extremely pleased, and I highly recommend these.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 4:43 AM Post #48 of 60
Well the ultrasone edition 9 and audio Technica L3000 (i don't know if the PS-1 isn't included in this category) are some examples which be in this category, according to what i had read. but are excessively expensive to consider.
other thing that i like is a headphone as a grado (the same energy, mids and speed but with a soundstage, as what have my headphones, without the harsh highs ) but closed and i believe that these two are the closest....
You can make a comparison with a song that have DRUMS or in a movie, and if one of the two punch louder/stronger in a explosion/or a big mass hiting something hard... You can post that impresion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by episiarch /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I have both. They're sure different cans. I'll try to give some general impressions and if you have specific questions I'll do my best to answer them.

In terms of overall sonics, I think reasonable people might easily split down the middle on which one they prefer. The RP-21 has a very easy-to-listen-to, mostly balanced presentation with significant bass emphasis (probably not enough bass emphasis if you are a true basshead, but a fun amount if you like a generally neutral sound with some extra whoomp). The ES7 has more of a light, airy presentation, very pleasant and almost open sounding, and its bass is more of the sleeping-giant variety: you really don't notice it until the music calls for it, and then it grabs you and shakes you and makes you go [size=small]whoa[/size].

So they're significantly different presentations, and I don't feel I can call a winner, because it's much more a matter of which style suits you better than of which one has greater merit in some absolute sense.

Now for some sonic nitpicks, which I want to clearly label as such because I notice them only because of the high quality of my other equipment, while they are unlikely to make a decisive difference to you if these are your first $100-or-so pair of cans. To me, the RP21's high treble loses resolution and starts to sound inaccurate from about the top octave of a piano on up: it doesn't really reproduce the sound of a cymbal being struck, so much as it does a really good job of suggesting that sound. A nitpick, unless better clarity in that department is something you're used to and depend on. On the ES7 side, I have to say that I don't like it without an amp. It doesn't sound bad, but it suffers the classic unamped deficiencies of loss of separation between what should be separable layers of music, loss of impact, loss of crispness when highs are playing at the same time as lows, and general loss of life. The RP21, on the other hand, holds up shockingly well unamped, though it becomes more satisfactory still with an amp.

(I'm not sure that either one needs as much of an amp as I drive them with. It might very well be that the little amp in something like a Turtle Beach Audio Advantage drives them nicely. I haven't tried that experiment, but I will if someone's interested.)

Comfort: comfort on the ears goes to the ES7, with nice soft leather pads and not too much clamping force (and you can bend the supports outward if you want to make it lighter still), while the RP21 has firmer pleather pads and a bit more clamping force. Comfort on the top of the head, however, goes to the RP21 with its padded headband as opposed to the ES7's unpadded plastic headband. (The Beyer snap-on wraparound headband pad looks like it would fit on the ES7 headband, and that would probably improve the situation immeasurably.) I'd call overall comfort a tie, though personally I'd probably lean a little towards the RP21.

Ergonomics: the ES7 has a lightweight, fairly short (1 or 1.5 meter, I'm guessing) double-entry cord. The RP21 has a fairly heavy long (3 meter?) single-sided (left side) cord, which is replaceable with a coiled cord and various homebrew options. Personally I find the ES7 easier to deal with at my desk, but YMMV.

Isolation: I can't call a winner here. I'd say it depends on whether your personal anatomy gives you as good an all-around seal in the RP21 earcups as the soft ES7 pads can give resting on your ears. (For me the answer is "not quite".)

Fashion sense: obviously the glossy ES7 has the style points, but the RP21 is better-looking than I feared, and it has a certain almost retro hip-to-be-square thing going on that kinda works.

Supplied extras: the ES7 comes with a soft carrying bag. The RP21 doesn't.

Let me know what I missed and I'll try to fill in the gaps.


 
Nov 3, 2007 at 4:54 AM Post #49 of 60
I've owned the RP-21s and not the ES-7s, but from what I hear:

The RP-21s will kick the ES7's ass in SQ, but it has like a 3-meter cable, so not at all ideal for porty use.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 5:00 AM Post #50 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phraxos /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The RP-21s will kick the ES7's ass in SQ, but it has like a 3-meter cable, so not at all ideal for porty use.




Hmm.. 9 feet of cabling is not enough for portable use? I doubt the ES7 comes with a 20 foot cable.. but I may be wrong..
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 5:07 AM Post #51 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by nick20 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hmm.. 9 feet of cabling is not enough for portable use? I doubt the ES7 comes with a 20 foot cable.. but I may be wrong..


Err, I think he meant it's too long.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 5:20 AM Post #52 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by nick20 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hmm.. 9 feet of cabling is not enough for portable use? I doubt the ES7 comes with a 20 foot cable.. but I may be wrong..


i think he was actualy saying a 9 foot cord is a little long
wink.gif
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 9:05 AM Post #53 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phraxos /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I've owned the RP-21s and not the ES-7s, but from what I hear:

The RP-21s will kick the ES7's ass in SQ, but it has like a 3-meter cable, so not at all ideal for porty use.


I've heard RP-21 and ES7, and neither kicks the other's ass, as you put it. Sound is subjective - some will prefer the RP-21's sound, others will prefer the ES7's sound.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 12:17 PM Post #54 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by leo5111 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
i think he was actualy saying a 9 foot cord is a little long
wink.gif





Oh... yeah.. I see.. I guess..
confused.gif



I have these in "home" use, so I don't know if 9 feet is too long or what. I would just get one of those "wire wraps" and get it over with. Or find someone in the DIY section to to a simple recable and shorten it.

These HP's are certainly worth a cheap recable.



My bad, it was getting late, and I was tired and not thinking straight. But that's no excuse..
biggrin.gif
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 1:02 PM Post #55 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by episiarch /img/forum/go_quote.gif
To me, the RP21's high treble loses resolution and starts to sound inaccurate from about the top octave of a piano on up: it doesn't really reproduce the sound of a cymbal being struck, so much as it does a really good job of suggesting that sound. A nitpick, unless better clarity in that department is something you're used to and depend on.

Comfort: comfort on the ears goes to the ES7, with nice soft leather pads and not too much clamping force (and you can bend the supports outward if you want to make it lighter still), while the RP21 has firmer pleather pads and a bit more clamping force. Comfort on the top of the head, however, goes to the RP21 with its padded headband as opposed to the ES7's unpadded plastic headband. (The Beyer snap-on wraparound headband pad looks like it would fit on the ES7 headband, and that would probably improve the situation immeasurably.) I'd call overall comfort a tie, though personally I'd probably lean a little towards the RP21.


Replacing/removing the relatively thick inner foam really clears up the highs on the RP21 IMO. Comfort of the pads can be improved by replacing them with Beyer leather pads, but that significantly ups the total cost of the phone. Another sidenote is that IMO the RP21's seem to have a better frequency balance with the Beyer pads. However, I would not be willing to stake my Head-Fi reputation on that one
biggrin.gif


P.S. Forgot to add that the RP21's seem to be the kind of phone that actually looks much better in person. Don't know why but all images I have seen just do not do them justice. Not saying they are the most stunning cans, just that I would not judge their looks too harshly from images.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 2:18 PM Post #56 of 60
Quote:

Originally Posted by morphsci /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Replacing/removing the relatively thick inner foam really clears up the highs on the RP21 IMO. Comfort of the pads can be improved by replacing them with Beyer leather pads, but that significantly ups the total cost of the phone. Another sidenote is that IMO the RP21's seem to have a better frequency balance with the Beyer pads. However, I would not be willing to stake my Head-Fi reputation on that one
biggrin.gif


P.S. Forgot to add that the RP21's seem to be the kind of phone that actually looks much better in person. Don't know why but all images I have seen just do not do them justice. Not saying they are the most stunning cans, just that I would not judge their looks too harshly from images.


I have removed the foam directly in front of the driver in the RP21 and replaced w/ the foam insert shipped w/ the velour pads from Beyer. Although I have read that the leather pads sound a bit better than the velour I went w/ the velour pads because I sweat less and to me they are more confortable.

Edit 1: Forgot to say that the foam that is shipped w/ the velour pads is thinner and less dense than the one in front of the RP21 driver. It is these two differences that IMO improve the highs in the RP21.

Edit 2 for pics:

This pic compares the stock foam in front of the drivers (bottom) to the one shipped w/ the Beyer Pads (top).

This picture shows the Beyer velour and foam installed on the RP21.


Another picture of the Beyer velour pads installed on the RP21.


The next 4 pictures is for those of you that own the RP21 and would like to tighten the bass at the cost of an slight reduction in "Boom Boom" factor. Basically I added cotton inside the housing! I used one circle cotton applicator pad, and 1.5 cotton balls per housing.







 
Nov 3, 2007 at 8:07 PM Post #57 of 60
Very good and ilustrative work, is the RP-21 easy to open?. (well, suddenly i will buy this headphone).

Asr: Well, which of the two has the most open sound of the two?? and which of the Two has a sound similar to the grado, and which of the two has more bass extension and the most important for me [size=large]IMPACT[/size] ([size=large]PUMP[/size] [size=x-large]PUMP[/size]) (not boom boom (of a boomy bass)) when something bigger hit the ground.... A tight sound...
All of you UNDERSTAND now to what i refer???
420.jpg

well, a little exaggerated
blink.gif
biggrin.gif
basshead.gif


My DT990 has more impact (1.5x more (for now)) than my DT770pro (but obviously I want a closed headphone too) and that what it's hardly being re-burning in (because it was put for 6 months) since yesterday.
 
Nov 3, 2007 at 10:34 PM Post #58 of 60
Oh, sorry, i don't see your post. Honestly, of Boy Marley i only be heard one song (i had various that i will hear in the future).
I don't like the boomy bass because of the drown of the others frecuencies as you say.
In other hand i like the JVC DX1000, which is the best alternative for me (according to Skylab), which has more bass impact than the DT770pro and with a warm sound as i like, but the price is a little high (ouy for now of my budget)

Thank you for your recomendation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick20 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
If this is directed to me, which I think it is; I have not tested with movies. These run off a tube amp.


I also forgot to mention, when listening to some bass heavy (if you will) Bob Marley, which isn't really bass heavy, its more like in the middle of being lean, detailed and articulate, and strong, thunderous and impactful (it's VERY nice). It's just the "right" amount of bass. In other words, it doesn't "drown" [muddy/boomy?] the other sounds, music or the voices, it isn't too dry and lean.

To be honest, it's not the best bass in the world, but it is damn good. There is times the bass struggles, but more times than not it is very good. There's certain notes on Kayne Wests' (Graduation) CD that I highly doubt any headphone can reproduce accurately, and I know the JVC DX1000 are bass monsters, but I still cannot see any headphone actually reproducing it. Speakers (and subs) yes, I don't think headphones can do it..



Again, I am extremely pleased, and I highly recommend these.


 
Nov 4, 2007 at 2:35 AM Post #59 of 60
ok, i read again all of the answers (with the head a little fresh and some of them appear after) and i will be buying the RP21 (it has more potential to improve the sound).
Anyway i want a faster headphone too and it is the winner.
Thank you at all for your collaboration.
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wink.gif
 
Dec 2, 2007 at 9:20 PM Post #60 of 60
I hadn't thought of padding up the enclosure mrarroyo, I'll have to try that.
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