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Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 1154

post #17296 of 19545
Quote:

Originally Posted by ccash View Post
 

<snip, snip>

 

I immediately noticed the nice, full, rich low end. I sat and listened for a while and found myself wanting to EQ in an upper mid and treble boost. Was this the "veil" I keep hearing about? The bass started to seem a little too full. The soundstage is nice, but no comparison to the wide-open airiness of the 880, which is really the 880s biggest strength. In comparison, the 650 seems closed in, pinched and a little muffled. That said, still wonderful sounding. Listening in iTunes, if I EQ in some upper mids and highs, they get right about where I want them, SS-wise. I have a lot of different sources though, so I don't want to have to rely on EQ'ing them. 

 

<snip, snip>

 

I've been busy reading the break-in threads and apparently what I'm experiencing is completely normal... and that after 100, 200, or 300 hours they'll be like a different set of phones; the bass will tighten and un-bloat, the treble will present itself and the phones will just open up. I'm willing to find out, so I guess I'm going to leave iTunes on in shuffle mode for a few more days.

 

You guys think I'm in for a nice surprise or a disappointment?

 

100-200-300 hours for break in?  I've been away from my head-fi rig for a while, but just got my HD 650 today - used from a seller on eBay that claimed very little use (they do appear unused).  I am coming from Grado RS2i and the change in sound is really dramatic; lush is one way to put it, but I see what folks mean by the veil.

 

Looking forward to experiencing the "break in".

post #17297 of 19545
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccash View Post

Received my 650s yesterday. I ordered them because: I started a headphone search a couple months ago. It's really difficult to find places to audition headphones, and I didn't realize you guys have meets. Of the ones I was able to audition, the Beyer DT-880 and these Sen 650s impressed me the most (and the LCD-2, but you know...). 

I bought the DT-880 600 Ohm, then a Matrix Mini-i as a DAC, partly based on its "warm" signature, and then a Darkvoice 336se. Trying to de-harsh the 880s. They are really special phones -- they have some magic in their air and I love it, but they're thin in the upper-bass and low-mids and certain songs just make me wince. I have to turn down the volume or take them off. Stuff like light jazz and classical are really great (Diana Krall sounds amazing with this setup), but with lots of other stuff they grate on me and and/or sound thin. To try to "tame" them, I got some RCA tubes -- a greyglass VT-231 and a 6AS7. A somewhat subtle change overall, but in the right direction.

I couldn't get the 650s off my mind, so I'm auditioning them now to find out if they give me what I'm looking for.

Well, out of the box they're pretty much the opposite of the 880s. There's an expensive feel and sound to them (and there should be for the price). Even though they're tight on my head right now, I like the positive-feedback feel better than the 880s light, barely-touching-your-head feel.

I immediately noticed the nice, full, rich low end. I sat and listened for a while and found myself wanting to EQ in an upper mid and treble boost. Was this the "veil" I keep hearing about? The bass started to seem a little too full. The soundstage is nice, but no comparison to the wide-open airiness of the 880, which is really the 880s biggest strength. In comparison, the 650 seems closed in, pinched and a little muffled. That said, still wonderful sounding. Listening in iTunes, if I EQ in some upper mids and highs, they get right about where I want them, SS-wise. I have a lot of different sources though, so I don't want to have to rely on EQ'ing them. 

I have a Sylvania VT-231 tube on the way to try to brighten up my rig. The Mini-i isn't doing the 650s any favors either.

I've been busy reading the break-in threads and apparently what I'm experiencing is completely normal... and that after 100, 200, or 300 hours they'll be like a different set of phones; the bass will tighten and un-bloat, the treble will present itself and the phones will just open up. I'm willing to find out, so I guess I'm going to leave iTunes on in shuffle mode for a few more days.

You guys think I'm in for a nice surprise or a disappointment?

Sylvannia should add some tightness to the sound, failing which a silver plated cable tongue.gif
post #17298 of 19545
Thanks Lorspeaker, I hope so!

Krutsch- I know. It sounds a little nuts to me too, but since so many people say it, I have to respect it. So instead of just concluding that the 650s aren't what I'm looking for -- out of the box -- I'll do the break-in for a few days with continuous music and then make another evaluation.

I just read an article where they took measurements before and after 100 hours, and there aren't any real changes in frequency response. The main difference was in pad wear, which they say will affect the sound more than anything by making them more bassy.

I apologize if this is a tired subject for some of you. I'm chasing the holy grail of sound for my ears and I'm afraid its going to be Goldilocks syndrome: "These phones are too bright. These phones are too bassy..." For the reviewers that actually say there's a difference, the 600s sound like they may be what I'm looking for: not as sweet or flattering, but more natural, with less bass and a little more bite up top.
Edited by ccash - 5/3/14 at 11:56pm
post #17299 of 19545
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccash View Post

Thanks Lorspeaker, I hope so!

Krutsch- I know. It sounds a little nuts to me too, but since so many people say it, I have to respect it. So instead of just concluding that the 650s aren't what I'm looking for -- out of the box -- I'll do the break-in for a few days with continuous music and then make another evaluation.

I just read an article where they took measurements before and after 100 hours, and there aren't any real changes in frequency response. The main difference was in pad wear, which they say will affect the sound more than anything by making them more bassy.

I apologize if this is a tired subject for some of you. I'm chasing the holy grail of sound for my ears and I'm afraid its going to be Goldilocks syndrome: "These phones are too bright. These phones are too bassy..." For the reviewers that actually say there's a difference, the 600s sound like they may be what I'm looking for: not as sweet or flattering, but more natural, with less bass and a little more bite up top.

For me personally I find the 650s a little to dark and bassy and the hd800s are sometimes missing that touch of warmth that I like. The hd600 has pretty much a perfect balance for me, a touch on the warm side but it's a very natural sound, closest sounding to my speaker setup.
post #17300 of 19545

Yep, comments like yours James are what I'm talking about.

 

But then I find a comment from Bob Katz (a famous mastering engineer) who says the HD600s were more bassy than the 650s. Huh?? I guess the only to find out for myself is to hear them.

post #17301 of 19545

hd600    --------->     hd650/SPCcable      <------------- HD650

 

not enufbass............................................................... too loose a bass

wish4somesweetness----------------------------------------too mellow

neutral-----------------------------------------------------------kinda veiled

 

 

All must finally converge at the sweetspot...it is somewhere betwix the two !

 

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 90

post #17302 of 19545
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccash View Post

You guys think I'm in for a nice surprise or a disappointment?

Short answer? I think you're in for the shock of your life.

If I had to give an example of burn-in as a fact it would be the 650's. I didn't put my pair to the stopwatch or anything but I worked it out to be somewhere around 200 hours. The sound has opened up dramatically! Treble has finally broken free of the mids & the bass is tighter. Imaging is much improved.

I don't want to get into an argument about the "veil" but I do wonder if those who complain about it actually give the 650's enough time to open up.

If I had spent money on partnering equipment on day one I might be very disappointed by now, the change in signature is that great.

As ever though, YMMV. smily_headphones1.gif
post #17303 of 19545

I recon this "veil" issue is gonna be a topic talked among everyone for years to come but I really love the veil. If you don't like the veil of the 650 I say you should be leaning towards Audeze.

If you dislike the bass, veil, and the "darkness" of the HD650, you shouldn't be trying to compensate it with other equipment(amps, cables) imo, you should rather be looking for different phones.

Now stone me to death for saying Graham Slee is the best amp for HD650 and all the things that I said^.

post #17304 of 19545

The cable, huh? I won't go into what I think of that, but I'm willing to try! (later though)

 

I hope you're right Zorrofox, because you can just tell these are great phones, despite what I found lacking at day one.

 

Again, sorry about :deadhorse:! I hear the veil, don't like it, and hope it will be lifted with break-in. Thanks for your feedback. I'll be sure to report back in a couple hundred hours :beerchug: 

post #17305 of 19545

Just curious but what music (or sound like pink noise) do you guys play usually for burning in phones?

post #17306 of 19545
Any recommendation on where to buy these right now? I mean the cheapest option ? Cause I see them at 499 everywhere, with an exception at 429...
Any cheaper ?
post #17307 of 19545
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Y View Post

Just curious but what music (or sound like pink noise) do you guys play usually for burning in phones?

There's an album specially designed to burn in headphones and is a completely free download.. Is late though and this is the last post I'll check, if you want to find it is somewhere under ULTIMATE BURN IN ALBUM look for it in the forum. If you want to avoid it just send me a PM Tomorrow and I'll send you the link from my laptop (I'm in the cellphone)
post #17308 of 19545

I'm using music because I think that'll give the drivers more of a workout. Pink noise is too constant and doesn't fluctuate that much dynamically.

 

Regarding price, I got mine on a sudden Amazon drop to $439, but from what I'm reading Sennheiser has a tight grip on what they can be sold for by Authorized Dealers. If you find them cheaper, they are probably not authorized (or worse) and you'll run into hassles should you need repairs.

post #17309 of 19545
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccash View Post

I'm using music because I think that'll give the drivers more of a workout. Pink noise is too constant and doesn't fluctuate that much dynamically.

Regarding price, I got mine on a sudden Amazon drop to $439, but from what I'm reading Sennheiser has a tight grip on what they can be sold for by Authorized Dealers. If you find them cheaper, they are probably not authorized (or worse) and you'll run into hassles should you need repairs.

That's what you think. Pink noise is precisely that - noise. By definition it fluctuates.

I've had a folder of noise on my PC since years back. Three 1 minute tracks of white noise, pink noise & brown noise. Rinse & repeat.

I used that method for the first 100 hours but I gave up because it was already clear that these were the headphones for me. I just listen to music now. Lots of music.

They continue to improve too. I'm having a lie-down after my Sunday morning coffee & smoke and really, even if it never gets better than this, I'll be content. I have arrived.

smily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gif
post #17310 of 19545

These cans do take a long time to burn in, I actually like to listen to the music when burning cans in so I can hear the transformation.....it is a wonderful thing to experience.

 

I am over 300 hours now and I really feel like they are still getting better and better.

 

Thee headphones perform well beyond their price point, imho.

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