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Orthodynamic Roundup - Page 1503

post #22531 of 23432

Just curious, has anyone experienced breathing problems when handling the glass wool discs that are commonplace in these old orthos and electrets? My friend made the comment that they looked like asbestos [!!!] and while that's obviously not the case I've been rather paranoid about ever since.

post #22532 of 23432

The same exact stuff is in various Stax also as you know, and I pointed someone here to a rare spare set of the stuff  in Germany for a Lambda model. To alleviate any confusion or fears, the product is known as Micron Glasswool, and labeled directly as such.

 

If you look up Glasswool it does come in various forms, and is still used to this day ( on pipes etc ), so don't sweat it, Then again I hate the stuff myself and always get rid of it in builds. but to many folks 'tis valuable stuff, saleworthy in fact.  :wink_face: 

 

Breathing issues not here but never can tell. Fibreglass always creeped me out for that stuff since once it gets in there it shreds things up.


Edited by nick n - 3/18/14 at 9:52pm
post #22533 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 

The same exact stuff is in various Stax also as you know, and I pointed someone here to a rare spare set of the stuff  in Germany for a Lambda model. To alleviate any confusion or fears, the product is known as Micron Glasswool, and labeled directly as such.

 

If you look up Glasswool it does come in various forms, and is still used to this day ( on pipes etc ), so don't sweat it, Then again I hate the stuff myself and always get rid of it in builds. but to many folks 'tis valuable stuff, saleworthy in fact.  :wink_face: 

 

Breathing issues not here but never can tell. Fibreglass always creeped me out for that stuff since once it gets in there it shreds things up.


AKA Mineral wool. Various grades of which are avialable just about anywhere under the Rockwool tradename.

 

Ditto, That I'd go far and long away from it if at all possible. We had family friends in the canoe building business and in later years the health issues from the stuff working into the skin just about everywhere were gruesome. Last thing you need is some of those fibres working into a finger joint 10 years down the road.

post #22534 of 23432

but when you call it micron glasswool you can charge a billion times more for it.

post #22535 of 23432

When you call anything with a fancy name, it automatically gives you the right to mark up the price ;)

post #22536 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 

I pointed someone here to a rare spare set of the stuff  in Germany for a Lambda model. To alleviate any confusion or fears, the product is known as Micron Glasswool, and labeled directly as such.

 

 

Any links please 

post #22537 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post

Try getting rid of the foam pieces ( is it the dense thin stuff or regular foam ) to let the bass breathe and get damped by the rear felt stuff only. That foam might be messing with things. Or just use one small disc enough to cover the rear cup hanger indent there  and keep it away from the perimeter vents. If bass is too boomy then  double up on the perimeter vent felts maybe.

just some ideas.

Thanks for the ideas. And then...
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluemonkeyflyer View Post

Yamaha HP-1 Modification

The first picture shows what did Not work. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Pictures 2-4 show what Does work:

The SQ is really nice from top to bottom of the FR.
Lots of Fast bass with good extension.
Clear, lush mids with No Boomy Bass Bloat (B3).
Lots of treble details/shimmer without sibilance.


This Did Not Work:



30 mm Paxmate Disc in Cup Floor Under Stock Open
Cell Foam. This created too much damping pressure
against the back of the driver that squashed the bass.


This Does Work:



Paxmate Ring on Cup Floor with Fiberglass Disc inside.

Note: I removed both layers of Stock Perimeter Felt so
the rear slots are fully open. The back wave vents from
the sides of the damping stack.




nick n's secret sauce over Paxmate Ring and Fiberglass Disc
on Cup Floor.




HP-1 Stock Open Cell Foam over Paxmate Ring and
Fiberglass Disc on the Cup Floors.

EDIT: Fiberglass has never bothered me. In this case, I don't know if it adds anything to the SQ since I did not try this configuration without it. I've used a thin layer of cotton extracted from a make-up remover pad with similar results. Angel Hair may work, too. 

I failed to mention that I placed a layer of gauze under the fiberglass. The fiberglass is effectively sandwiched between the gauze and the white felt + stock yellow open cell foam and contained within the Paxmate Ring so it isn't going anywhere. As shown in the 3rd and 4th pictures, I removed both layers of the stock black felt segments exposing open rear cup vents. The back wave vents through from the sides of the damping stack and then out the rear cup vents (slots).

The SQ from this HP-1 modification is some of the best I've heard and comes close when directly compared with current production planars. I doubt that I will open them, again. I'm going to try this same damping stack in the HP-50A.

..this happened. So now I have plenty of ideas to try next. Thanks!

BTW bmf, with all those materials inside the cup, is it too compressed? I figure that if there's too much material inside to the point that most are compressed then that would change the sound not to your/our expectation.
post #22538 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgray91 View Post

Thanks for the ideas. And then...
..this happened. So now I have plenty of ideas to try next. Thanks!

BTW bmf, with all those materials inside the cup, is it too compressed? I figure that if there's too much material inside to the point that most are compressed then that would change the sound not to your/our expectation.

jgray,

I edited that post with more information. The Paxmate disk over the center of the cup\pivot dish + the stock yellow open cell foam created too much pressure directly against the back of the drivers. This squashed the bass and made them too lean in the mids and too bright in the treble.

The current stack is thinner with less compression. The Paxmate Ring sits even with the raised ring around the pivot dish. The fiberglass is thin and level with the top of the Paxmate. The white felt I added is soft and thin. It was easy to close the baffles to the cups without stressing the cup threads.

Removing the stock black felt segments to fully open the cup vents was made on a hunch and it worked. This setup delivers exactly the SS and SQ I prefer...textured bass, clear mids that are not lean, and detailed/extended treble.
post #22539 of 23432
This gives me an idea. Better write it down. Should've thought of it sooner since it's kind of obvious, but that's the benefit of hindsight, huh.
post #22540 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgray91 View Post

This gives me an idea. Better write it down. Should've thought of it sooner since it's kind of obvious, but that's the benefit of hindsight, huh.

Sorry, I missed that you'd already seen the edits.

 

Yes, there are a few ideas within the edits.

 

Keeping a modification log with pictures and an "Ideas" summary is priceless. Like nick n, I keep detailed records of everything I do (with pix) that has been useful many times.

post #22541 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgray91 View Post


Well, there's something odd with the treble. It's not really grating or anything, but it just feels odd. Detail retrieval seems to improve, but I suspect that's because of the odd treble. Bass kind of tuned down a bit overall, but midbass sounds more boomy now. Female vocals is more veiled than stock, but male vocals seem to be clearer now. It's odd, and I don't really like it.

Hot treble And bass bloat? I'm trying to wrap my head around how felt would cause both problems. How thick and dense is the felt; and how much of the rear driver is covered?

 

Have you solved this riddle?

post #22542 of 23432

How are the Elektronica TDS-5 and TDS-5M? Has anyone had experience with them?

post #22543 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketInABucket View Post
 

How are the Elektronica TDS-5 and TDS-5M? Has anyone had experience with them?

Amfiton TDS-5M sounds very nice once modified. It's a reverse engineered Yamaha HP-1, IIRC.

 

I've not heard the TDS-5. I've read reviews that TDS-5M is better than TDS-5.

 

TDS-7, TDS-15, TDS-16 Smela version and TDS-16 Kiev version also sound good to me. TDS-7 has bodacious clamping pressure. TDS-15 is my favorite for appearance with a Steam Punk look.

 

I modified only TDS-15 and did a transplant of TDS-15 into Takstar foster fone...the link is in my profile, if interested.

post #22544 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluemonkeyflyer View Post
 

Amfiton TDS-5M sounds very nice once modified. It's a reverse engineered Yamaha HP-1, IIRC.

 

I've not heard the TDS-5. I've read reviews that TDS-5M is better than TDS-5.

 

TDS-7, TDS-15, TDS-16 Smela version and TDS-16 Kiev version also sound good to me. TDS-7 has bodacious clamping pressure. TDS-15 is my favorite for appearance with a Steam Punk look.

 

I modified only TDS-15 and did a transplant of TDS-15 into Takstar foster fone...the link is in my profile, if interested.

Ok thank you for the information. Basically, if I have a choice between the 5 and 5M I should always chose the 5M right?

post #22545 of 23432
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketInABucket View Post

Ok thank you for the information. Basically, if I have a choice between the 5 and 5M I should always chose the 5M right?

I have not heard a 5M so I have no opinion.

There can be significant differences in sound from two identical headphones. Factor in variable aging, too. How they were stored, etc.

I would buy both if in good condition for a resaonable price.

Listen to both and buy the set that sounds best and is in the best condition.

Good Luck
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