Focal Elear and Utopia Review / Preview With Measurements - Head-Fi TV

tsavjason said:

Let's weigh my opinion. My opinion as some think is biased. The problem with that assumption is that I do my best to help people understand the attributes of all the different headphones here with bias to none. The topic here is the Focal. I've been commenting based on my opinion without bias based on being a design and engineering firm that sells gear. I sell every brand that I've commented on and don't comment if I don't have the product to legitimately compare or sell. ...

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that post wasn't directed at you so i'm not sure why you've quoted it.

fwiw, i think that your posts would benefit from you dialling down the hyperbole. you are a mot and it's not surprising that some folks have been sceptical of the claims that you've been making, regardless of the purity of your intentions - just saying.

up late said:

that post wasn't directed at you so i'm not sure why you've quoted it.

fwiw, i think you've been pushing the utopia hard and i can understand why some folks have reacted to your posts in the manner that they have.

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That would be my error as a new bee to posting. Did you happen to notice that this was a Focal launch? Wouldn't that be the product I was letting all of you know about since the launch was 100% about that product? Are you telling me to be fair that I should talk about an unrelated brand when launching product? Please advise on your opinion at your earliest convenience.

tsavjason said:

Let's weigh my opinion. My opinion as some think is biased. The problem with that assumption is that I do my best to help people understand the attributes of all the different headphones here with bias to none. The topic here is the Focal. I've been commenting based on my opinion without bias based on being a design and engineering firm that sells gear. I sell every brand that I've commented on and don't comment if I don't have the product to legitimately compare or sell. ...

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Hi Jason, you might not be aware of this, but I think you need to register as a MOT (member of trade) with the mods in this forum. While you've always made it clear that you're a dealer, it just helps prevent misunderstandings and heightens transparency (and is actually mandatory, if I'm not mistaken).
Apologies if the rules have changed or the process is already underway, I know it can sometimes take a while.
Carry on!

@TSAVJason is registered as Sponsor: The Source AV as I can read it at the right of the avatar. Isn't it the same as MOT ??

phonomat said:

Hi Jason, you might not be aware of this, but I think you need to register as a MOT (member of trade) with the mods in this forum. While you've always made it clear that you're a dealer, it just helps prevent misunderstandings and heightens transparency (and is actually mandatory, if I'm not mistaken).
Apologies if the rules have changed or the process is already underway, I know it can sometimes take a while.
Carry on!

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He's a Sponsor, which is a type of MoT.  He's either been MoT or Sponsor from day 1. 
 
There have been some particularly negative, bordering on rude, posts in here lately, and I feel that it's really atypical of our community.  Maybe we can leave all the personal attacks aside and just talk about the headphones?  If you have an issue with someone's observations, based on your opinion of that person, there's no reason to make that public.  If you've decided you don't want to buy a Utopia or Elear before even hearing them, that's wonderful -- I'll see you in other threads.
 
Comon folks, we're better than this.

up late said:

fwiw, i think your posts would benefit from dialling down the hyperbole. you are a mot and it's not surprising that some folks have been sceptical of the claims that you've been making, regardless of the purity of your intentions - just saying. 

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Take this as you will, and I refrained from responding to your previous post when I stated there have been mentions of keeping this sort of discussion(s) outside of this particular thread as I felt we were above it - I personally feel your posts, though everyone is entitled to their opinion and I find yours to be as valid as anyone else's, are single handedly derailing the focus of the topic at hand; "launch impressions" - just saying.
 
Either way, this is nothing personal and I have zero weight when it comes to how things are conducted in this thread or any other for that matter. I, as your average head-fi community member, feel like you should reconsider your approach.

mmmm.....yeah. I second that (@Stillhart's post). If you have already made up your mind NOT TO BUY even though you have not auditioned said headphones, it would be helpful if you just leave the thread in peace. This is the (listening)  IMPRESSIONS thread, after all.

fjrabon said:

 
by "non-EQ headphones" I am assuming you mean without an HRTF based crossfeed circuit/program?  HRTF crossfeed is more than EQ, though differential EQing is certainly part of the recipe.  There are also some very tiny time delay aspects and crosfeeding signal.

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Yes without any HRTF crossfeed. Not easy for sure...
But you are right: binaural IS the solution for headphones. I know of sound engineers who master all their audio also in binaural. Perhaps if the headphone market becomes large enough the majors will sell the binaural files along with the 'speakers' ones ,,;

tsavjason said:

That would be my error as a new bee to posting. Did you happen to notice that this was a Focal launch? Wouldn't that be the product I was letting all of you know about since the launch was 100% about that product? Are you telling me to be fair that I should talk about an unrelated brand when launching product? Please advise on your opinion at your earliest convenience.

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i've edited my post since your reply - please take another look. i have nothing further to add.

raypin said:

  mmmm.....yeah. I second that. If you have already made up your mind NOT TO BUY even though you have not auditioned said headphones, it would be helpful if you just leave the thread in peace. This is the (listening)  IMPRESSIONS thread, after all.

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It's a listening impressions thread with a Seller being extremely positive on the products, and discreetly discrediting those opinions that aren't that positive.
 

  Quote:

Originally Posted by TSAVJason
 
Bass light? That's funny!

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TSAVJason said:

 I believe you'll find these to be much different than the 2 comments posted.

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Originally Posted by TSAVJason
 
 My statement is had he heard them broken in, I doubt very seriously he would make those determinations but then he might.

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TSAVJason said:

 Everyone hears differently but in general there is no way the 800S or 800's win against the utopia.

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I've been on Head-Fi for a while, and never seen this kind of behaviour from a sponsor before.

mmm......again, it's a listening impression thread. Not a listening impression thread that is completely devoid of bias, personal preference, conspiracy to pull the wool over the eyes (and ears) of very intelligent people, ulterior motives.............the point is this thread is about:  let's hear what you've heard, simply because the vast majority of the human population has not had the chance to audition said headphones. Whether the impression(s) are valid or not are  of course, a different matter altogether and will be validated/debunked as more people have a chance to audition it. Let's keep an open mind....
 
I am very active in this thread because I am genuinely interested in what is after all a brand-new, supposedly flagship headphone. How many of those are launched on a regular basis? Not too many. We ought to be more welcoming.......

me x3 said:

   
It's a listening impressions thread with a Seller being extremely positive on the products, and discreetly discrediting those opinions that aren't that positive.
 

  Quote:
 
 
 
I've been on Head-Fi for a while, and never seen this kind of behaviour from a sponsor before.

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There exists a way to express your displeasure without derailing the thread:
 

 

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Now can we please get back on topic?  Here, I'll help!  I find it pretty interesting that some people tend to prefer the Elear to the Utopia, regardless of price, while admitting that the Utopia is a much more capable headphone.  The tuning is definitely different enough that it's strongly influencing people's preferences.  I wonder to what extent the tuning on the Utopia vs the other flagships is influencing people's preferences. 
 
I certainly admit that I look for a very balanced sound signature these days.  Not too much bass, but not bass light.  Not to mid-forward but not recessed.  Splashy highs without being harsh or unrealistically emphasized.  Give me a headphone with great balance on top of technical prowess (speed, clarity, micro detail, macro detail, imaging, soundstage, etc) and I'm in heaven. When you add in great physical properties (build quality, design, comfort, etc) it's even better.  This is what the Utopia is for me and why I personally like it so much.  
 
There may be other flagships that best it in certain aspects here and there.  But there isn't another one that I've heard that offers such a complete package in all areas.  In reading other people's feedback on it, I get the impression that they're focusing on one or two things that they personally value above all else.  
 
I don't know, what do you guys think?

Difference being, a dealer of numerous products can talk about anything that they carry, a manufacturer can only talk about their own products.

To be back on track, looking forward to the Master 1 vs Utopia shoot out when it happens

Dan Foley from Audio Precision brought a pre-production unit of their new APx1701 Transducer Test Interface to play with for a day, so, among other things, we measured the impedance of both the Focal Elear and Focal Utopia. (Nominal impedance for both is rated by Focal as 80Ω.)
 

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Measurements in this post were made using:

1. Audio Precision APx555 audio analyzer
2. Audio Precision APx1701 Transducer Test Interface (pre-production)
3. G.R.A.S. 45CA Headphone/Hearing-protector Test Fixture
   1. G.R.A.S. KB0072/KB0073 small pinnae; G.R.A.S. RA0045 IEC 60318-4 ear simulators including G.R.A.S. 40AG microphones; G.R.A.S. 26AS 1/4" microphone preamplifier; G.R.A.S. 12AP microphone power module
4. Herzan acoustic enclosure (custom)

 
​NOTE: These impedance measurements were made with the headphones coupled to the G.R.A.S. 45CA.

me x3 said:

It's a listening impressions thread with a Seller being extremely positive on the products, and discreetly discrediting those opinions that aren't that positive.



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I've been on Head-Fi for a while, and never seen this kind of behaviour from a sponsor before.

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Thx for your comment. It is not my intention to discredit anyone or other headphone. It is my intention to provide my opinion relevant to a comparative with other brands that we also represent. I have provided opinion on the abyss and we don't represent that brand. I do however think the abyss is a hell of good headphone. I've also given a few people my opinion on the Headamp CSXmk2 and the SPL products that were shipped in from Germany. These are brands we do not sell. I also mentioned I think those brands have terrific attributes. I don't sell Chord, I'm quite familiar with the brand and I tell people it is a great brand to consider using. I'm very careful to avoid negative comments unless it's well deserved and even then I try to be respectful of people's feelings.