Hi !
i would like to exchange some opinions about the possible benefits coming from using usb extenders to connect pc and usb dacs or usb to spdif converters.
 
I really do not understand their working principle, but i understand that a first device called SENDER converts the usb signal in packets (?) that it sends through the rj45 cable to another device called RECEIVER that converts again the packets to usb signals (i know ... very badly said).
The Sender uses, normally but not always, the usb bus power while the Receiver has its own 5VDC/1A smps (nothing special but nothing that cannot be improved of course).
 
In any case i bought a very cheap one .. this one
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/121461808062?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
 
http://i.ebayimg.com/images/a/T2eC16FHJFoE9nh6m+lpBQwrT7I10g~~/s-l500.jpg
 
i am using a very cheap flat 3 meters rj45 cable in between the sender and receiver and two 1 meter cheap usb cables from the pc to the sender and from the receiver to the usb dac.
At present i am listening through a usb powered Audinst HUD-mini Hi-Fi USB Audio DAC
 
http://www.amazon.com/Audinst-HUD-mini-Hi-Fi-USB-Audio/dp/B00FIYVSLS
 
the sound seems a lot cleaner and powerful than with the direct connection to the pc with a usb cable. 
In a word ... better !
 
The receiver has its own  5VDC/1A  power supply
Next move will be to use a usb power supply for the sender in order to isolate it completely from the pc power.
And maybe a better 5VDC power supply for the receiver.
These devices are very very handy especially when the usb dac relies on usb power to work.
The power supply in the receiver can be of very high quality, depending on the budget.
And actually after the isolation of the sender it should be the next best option to improve sound.
 
I wonder if anyone has experience on these extenders that can share here.
 
I am waiting for another one supposed to pass signals up to 480 Mbit/s
... maybe it is too optimistically specified.
 
If i can gather anything from this experience is that usb connection is quite tricky ... not good.
there must be something that just creates issues with audio devices.
Have a nice day
gino

have you test any high res files like 24 bit 192khz
or some dsd files
did it work normal?

hugoboss said:

have you test any high res files like 24 bit 192khz
or some dsd files
did it work normal?

Click to expand...

 
Hi !  no only redbook files and 16/48 because i do not understand well if this model is also usb 2.0 compatible or only 1.1.
However i am waiting for another one said to be good up to 480 Mbit/s ... full 2.0 i guess.
What i really would like to understand it is what happens inside these boxes.   Is the usb signal converter to some other format ?
One thing is true.  While usb cable max length is specified at about 6 meters some of this extenders are good up to 100 meters !
I am waiting also for a better usb interface that should be more resolving of my actual one, an Audinst mini powered from usb.
As i said i have the feeling that the sound throught the Ethernet extension is better.    Less noise, more detail.
This is the other model said to be good up to 480 Mbit/s i am wating to receive ...
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-2-0-RJ45-extender-repeater-with-power-adapter-up-to-100M-330ft-/281975976809?hash=item41a713f369:g:1lUAAOSwvFZW8TMc
 

Descriptions:

This USB extender can easily send the USB signals via Cat.5/5e/6 cable up to 100 meters (196 ft) at data rate of High Speed (480Mb/s) , Full Speed (12Mb/s) and Low Speed (1.5Mb/s). Without any configuration or software driver, this USB extender allows you to extend your USB device or hub up to 100m from your computer, which overcomes the typical USB cable limitation.

It is suitable for USB cameras, printers,web cams ,key board/mouse extensions, and any other USB device.

Product features:

Use a single network cable without external power supply

Supports any High-Speed (480Mb/s), full-speed (12 Mb/s) or low-speed (1.5 Mb/s) USB devices

Extends signal transmission distance of a USB devices up to 100m via a Cat 5/5e/6 cable

Includes an AC adapter to stabilize power supply

Hot-Pluggable

The most cost-effective USB extender solution

No additional software driver required

Package contents:
USB extender transmitter X1
USB extender receiver X1
USB cable X1
Power adapter X1

 

Pls uses high quality Ethernet cable with our extenders.

Click to expand...

 
Thanks a lot,  gino

Hi Gino,
 
I tried this one and it sounded awful - and it could not pass a 24/192k signal (popping and crackling).  The sound ws very compressed.
I returned it to amazon.
 
http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-2-0-Over-Cat5-Extender-Extension-USB2004EXTV/dp/B00T9RTT2U?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00
 

 

1. Connect four USB 2.0 devices away from your computer over Cat5 up to 130ft (40m) or Cat6 up to 165ft (50m)
2. USB 2.0 Extender over Ethernet
3. Cost-effective & compact USB extension over single Ethernet cable
4. Features 2 top ports
5. OS independent
6. Transfer rates of up to 480 Mbps
7. Kit includes a transmitter and a 4 port hub receiver
8. Plug-and-play and hot-swap compatible

Click to expand...

Good luck!

rb2013 said:

Hi Gino,
I tried this one and it sounded awful - and it could not pass a 24/192k signal (popping and crackling).  The sound ws very compressed.
I returned it to amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-2-0-Over-Cat5-Extender-Extension-USB2004EXTV/dp/B00T9RTT2U?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00
Good luck!

Click to expand...

 
Hi ! and thanks a lot for the helpful advice.
Actually they look much better built than the ones i have got
 

I do not quite understand the difference between these units and the one for Lan use.  The principle of functioning should be similar.
I am thinking to lan streamer with usb out.  
In the end they work like a good quality receiver, they take the stream of data from the lan and output a high quality usb signal.
I think that the quality of these devices vary a lot like the price.
For instance with redbook files i have no clicks with one usb dac but i have clicks with a Aune x1s.
Maybe there is also a compatibility issue ?
What i do not know and i would like to understand is what kind of conversion is done inside the boxes.
I think that the fact that the Ethernet connection is speced up to 100 meters while the usb connection only to 6 meters must mean something.
As i said i would like very much to understand how these devices work.
In the end Ethernet extenders are also used for HD video transmission that should be more challenging than audio
But if they do not work there is no discussion
Thanks a lot again,  gino
 
P.S.  i have found also some videos
 
this one is yours i think      >     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4HcwX8d56M
 
this is a very telling test, the one with a web cam     >     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LutDe6YcsQw 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmOwy9ysvr8
 

Hi !  i found something extremely interesting here
 
http://archimago.blogspot.no/2013/12/measurements-usb-cable-extension-with.html
 
so absolutely no added jitter with high speed extenders.
I find them practical to attach my external usb power supplies both at the sender and at the receiver ends.
Now i will try the shielded Gigabit cable recommended to connect sender and receiver.
I feel these extenders are going to stay in the system for ever.
Have a nice day,  gino

ginetto61 said:

  Hi !  i found something extremely interesting here
 
http://archimago.blogspot.no/2013/12/measurements-usb-cable-extension-with.html
 
so absolutely no added jitter with high speed extenders.
I find them practical to attach my external usb power supplies both at the sender and at the receiver ends.
Now i will try the shielded Gigabit cable recommended to connect sender and receiver.
I feel these extenders are going to stay in the system for ever.
Have a nice day,  gino

Click to expand...

the graphical measurement seem same so there is no degradation of the sound quality but also no improvement.
so is there any benefit using that extender for sound quality

hugoboss said:

the graphical measurement seem same so there is no degradation of the sound quality but also no improvement.
so is there any benefit using that extender for sound quality

Click to expand...

Hi and thanks and exactly !  for me they will be handy just to connect two usb power supplies at the sender and at the receiver ends. 
 
However another interesting test would be to see the effect on the jitter of a galvanic isolator and of a regenerator, other must have devices in a usb link.
Like the jitter measured before and after an isolator.  
I have no clue if high jitter can cause problem .. but i do not like it at all.   The designers usually do everything to keep the jitter low ... so it must be ****. 
Thanks again,  gino 

I have these.
 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/USB-Ethernet-RJ45-Extender-Adapter/dp/B0029HRYBK
 
I was able to play 24/96 without any glitch.
 
desktop computer - usb/rj45 - cat5 50 feet - rj45/usb - ifi usb power - usb wireworld platinum - audiophilleo/purepower - dac
 
My main reference was laptop - usb wireworld platinum - audiophilleo/purepower - dac
 
 
With the ifi usb power I was VERY close the the direct connexion. Without, I had never considered to keep this configuration.
 
I compared the ifi usb power to the new generation ifi usb 3.0 and it's a MAJOR step up.

pompon said:

   I have these. 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/USB-Ethernet-RJ45-Extender-Adapter/dp/B0029HRYBK
I was able to play 24/96 without any glitch.
 
desktop computer - usb/rj45 - cat5 50 feet - rj45/usb - ifi usb power - usb wireworld platinum - audiophilleo/purepower - dac
My main reference was laptop - usb wireworld platinum - audiophilleo/purepower - dac
With the ifi usb power I was VERY close the the direct connexion. Without, I had never considered to keep this configuration.
 
I compared the ifi usb power to the new generation ifi usb 3.0 and it's a MAJOR step up.

Click to expand...

 
Hi !  thanks a lot.  Very interesting that high speed transfer can be achieved with cheap product.
I am buying a pair. 
I am waiting for a pair i have bought that promise a speed of 480 Mbit/s  ... i do not believe it by the way. 
I will be using external usb power supplies at both ends.   In this way i should get galvanic isolation from the pc but i will check for this .. i am not that sure. 
In the article the author recommends shielded cat6 cable and this is what i am going to use. 
Thanks again,  gino