CHORD ELECTRONICS DAVE
Feb 28, 2016 at 5:29 PM Post #1,831 of 25,851
   
romaz do you had the time / possibility to compare the JPS Labs Superconductor HP with the DHC Spore4 yet, or anyone else ?
 
I have heard both good and bad impressions of the SuperConductor HP cable.
I have only listen to it one time briefly, and it got a little more control in the presentation, but it was very subtle if any vs the the stock cable, but other than that i think it was hard to hear any other greatness ??
 
I will take it home in 2 weeks an see what it can bring to the table.

I would like to hear this JPS cable because I am curious as you are.  I once almost bought an Abyss.  In fact, it was the headphone that convinced me to move away from my Stax SR009 but after I had a loaner on hand for nearly a month, I found I had high frequency issues with it.  Because I also had high frequency issues with a pair of JPS Superconductor 3 interconnects I owned, Joe Skubinski suggested I have problems with the higher resolution of his products but if this was true, then why don't I have problems listening to live music which is even higher resolution?  I believe my problem is with the Alumiloy in his cables.  It just sounds bright to me, much more so than the brightest silver cables I've heard and so its interesting to know how this new cable is different.  The ad suggests it may have more copper (and hopefully less Alumiloy) which would be a good thing.  When I heard an Abyss with a Nordost cable that was pure copper a few months ago, I didn't have any high frequency issues at all which has got me thinking that maybe it's time to re-explore the Abyss.  I don't know that I'll have an opportunity soon to listen to this JPS cable but if you do, please report here, especially what you think combined with your DAVE (and if possible, what you think of it without the Headtrip).
 
Feb 28, 2016 at 7:00 PM Post #1,832 of 25,851
I would like to hear this JPS cable because I am curious as you are.  I once almost bought an Abyss.  In fact, it was the headphone that convinced me to move away from my Stax SR009 but after I had a loaner on hand for nearly a month, I found I had high frequency issues with it.  Because I also had high frequency issues with a pair of JPS Superconductor 3 interconnects I owned, Joe Skubinski suggested I have problems with the higher resolution of his products but if this was true, then why don't I have problems listening to live music which is even higher resolution?  I believe my problem is with the Alumiloy in his cables.  It just sounds bright to me, much more so than the brightest silver cables I've heard and so its interesting to know how this new cable is different.  The ad suggests it may have more copper (and hopefully less Alumiloy) which would be a good thing.  When I heard an Abyss with a Nordost cable that was pure copper a few months ago, I didn't have any high frequency issues at all which has got me thinking that maybe it's time to re-explore the Abyss.  I don't know that I'll have an opportunity soon to listen to this JPS cable but if you do, please report here, especially what you think combined with your DAVE (and if possible, what you think of it without the Headtrip).


You got the same impression as i have, it is a little veil and unrealistic sound from time to time, but i think with the combination DAVE+Chord Indigo II + Headtrip+Isotek Sirius, the effect is more reduced, and it is much darker and softer, so i do not have the same screamingly high pitch any more, as i had before with all other dac;ś i have tested, which is very good.

I have not had time to investigate what realy causing this effet, but i think the stock JPS Labs cables could be one factor yes, and the synergy effect with the DAC / Amp and interconnects.

I think my Artisan Ultimate silver cables combined with MSB Analog / Hugo / PS Audio Perfect Wave, sounded all veil and sharp, it was an unpleasant combo with the Abyss.

I will test the Superconductor HP as soon as my buddie have them back from a loaner who have kidnaped them for one week, if he doesn't buy them.

Keep you all updated with my findings.

:wink:
 
Feb 28, 2016 at 7:25 PM Post #1,834 of 25,851
I forgot you have an HD600.  That was my first audiophile class headphone and I'd still own it if it didn't break because it's a keeper.  You're right, this headphone scales very well and should have no problems revealing the qualities of the DAVE so all the more interesting that you preferred your Nagra CDC's built-in headphone socket to the DAVE when it really should be no contest.  Having now heard my HE-1000 through the headphone port of the more capable Nagra HD, my opinion is that I easily prefer the DAVE.  My only thought is give a well broken-in DAVE another shot but undoubtedly, you have to go with what your ears are telling you.

Regarding your interconnects, obviously this is not what is holding back your system.

Regarding how a DAC should sound and some may disagree but my feeling on this is that it should only sound one way for each of us and that personal preference should have less to do with it.  Regardless of whether you are a novice listener or a seasoned and discerning audiophile such as yourself, a DAC is either faithful to the full virtues of the recording or it is not.  The music either sounds real or it does not and while your headphones and amp have some role in this, I am finding that the DAC perhaps has the biggest say in it provided that you are starting out with a good digital file.  With DACs, I also don't buy into the idea that you have to have some proverbial golden ear to appreciate its finer qualities because as humans, even if age has hampered our hearing to some extent, we each have an innate qualitative sense of correctness and what sounds natural even if we can't articulate it as well as others.  As the old saying goes, it's like pornography, you can't quite define it in words but you know it when you see it, or with music, you know it when you hear it.  If it takes hours or days, then its probably not there.

Of course, there is the topic of coloration and preferred style of presentation and this is not the same thing as the whether music sounds real or not.  There are some that prefer the fast, focused and full bodied acoustics of the Alice Tully Hall in New York compared to the more bloomy presentation of Carnegie Hall.  There are also some that prefer acoustical music in an intimate setting compared to amplified music in an arena and sometimes, this has more to do with your mood on a certain day, but this is why we own multiple recordings of Mahler's 8th symphony performed in different venues or why we roll out the 300Bs from our tube amp and replace them with 2A3s.  It's why some of us own a more laid back Audeze LCD-3 in addition to a more analytical HD800 or a basshead TH-900.  In my view, coloration belongs to almost any other piece of equipment in our audio chain but not the DAC. The DAC just has to be faithful to the recording.  It has to sound analog.

Regarding the specific virtues of the DAVE and what makes it so special, there are already so many people who have chimed in on this but I will sum up in one word what makes the DAVE special for me -- "timing."  Time resolution impacts almost everything.  It impacts tone and timbre.  It can tell you that the lead violinist is playing a Guarneri and not a Stadivarius.  It tells you where your woodwind section is in the orchestra relative to the horns and and how many rows of woodwinds are present.  Because higher pitched voices reach your ears sooner than lower pitched ones, you are aware you are listening to a thousand voices in the choir.  When time resolution is there, then music is an onion, full of layers.  As I've learned to appreciate the qualities that DACs provide, the one quality I have found that has been most difficult for a DAC to recreate is space.  In the same way that a saxophone can only sound good when it breathes, music has to be able to breathe to sound good.  We talk about soundstage width and height but without depth, then the music is flat, and its not something you can convincingly fix by adjusting the reverb on an EQ .  It is this singular feature that differentiated the more basic $10K TotalDac d1-dual from the more sublime $25k TotalDac d1-monobloc and it was enough of a difference for me to spend the extra money. It is this same special quality that has lead me to the DAVE and thus far, I have not heard another DAC do this better.


I think you are always spot on, and have a great understanding to express your findings and impressions!
Always very pleasant to read your well writhed nuanced and interesting postings on this forum!
✍:tone1:✍:tone1:✍:tone1::xf_eek:k_hand_tone2::xf_eek:k_hand_tone2::xf_eek:k_hand_tone2:
 
Feb 28, 2016 at 8:52 PM Post #1,836 of 25,851
The power amp prototype has been stuck on my desk waiting for me to test it for a year now. So my priorities this year is the amp and Davina.
 
Combining Dave with the amp using the digital outputs, I am eagerly anticipating, as I expect a huge increase in transparency - in short, it will eliminate the sound of a power amp, you will be left with the equivalence of just the sound of Dave driving loudspeakers directly.
 
Rob
 
Feb 28, 2016 at 9:12 PM Post #1,837 of 25,851
  The power amp prototype has been stuck on my desk waiting for me to test it for a year now. So my priorities this year is the amp and Davina.
 
Combining Dave with the amp using the digital outputs, I am eagerly anticipating, as I expect a huge increase in transparency - in short, it will eliminate the sound of a power amp, you will be left with the equivalence of just the sound of Dave driving loudspeakers directly.
 
Rob

 
Wow!
eek.gif
Too sad I don't (can't) listen to speakers anymore!
frown.gif

 
Feb 28, 2016 at 9:22 PM Post #1,838 of 25,851


Like a small tank,
the Chord metall Alu remote , a most have, for the great feeling and weight, the sound gets more promising and weighty when you hold it in your hand or if a friend comes over for a small chat and a listening session :ok_hand::ok_hand::ok_hand::grin:

 
Feb 28, 2016 at 9:32 PM Post #1,839 of 25,851
The power amp prototype has been stuck on my desk waiting for me to test it for a year now. So my priorities this year is the amp and Davina.

Combining Dave with the amp using the digital outputs, I am eagerly anticipating, as I expect a huge increase in transparency - in short, it will eliminate the sound of a power amp, you will be left with the equivalence of just the sound of Dave driving loudspeakers directly.

Rob


This is highly interestingly news Rob.

Have you decided on how many different power configurations you will have to offer ?
 
Feb 28, 2016 at 9:56 PM Post #1,840 of 25,851
Very well impression and feedback, I can't be as elaborate and as descriptive as many of you who has contributed to this thread, sorry just very poor in writing :frowning2:. But I find myself share exactly the same opinion, which I never encounter before with other piece of equipment!
 
Originally Posted by romaz /img/forum/go_quote.gif
First, Rob pointed out that DAVE, like all things, benefits from good mechanical isolation.  My DAVE sits on my desk where its compact size and attractive aesthetics are very much a plus.  I have near-field Omega monitors also sitting on my desk along with a powered subwoofer on the floor and so when music is playing through these speakers, isolation does make a difference.  I have a quad of Black Raviolis that are low profile and do make a difference but I found a more elegant solution that looks like it is custom tailored for the DAVE.  It is the Acoustic Revive TB-38H and is designed to provide isolation for small pieces of equipment like power supplies and I will say that it not only looks good but is very effective.  It is also not very expensive and can be purchased directly from Japan via EBay.  Highly recommended.
  Can't agree more. I had my Dave on poorly isolated TV console. I have using Ansuz diamond isolation feet with it. Just yesterday my dealer come to my place with brand new Ansuz Darkz DTC feet. Dave sounded even darker! Cue up Spanish Harlem by Rebecca Pidgeom, the turning up the vol with the bass vibrating some of my living room furniture DID NOT even shake up the layering and airyness a bit. Highly recomended!
 
 
Second, I cannot overstate how good a job Rob has done isolating the DAVE against almost everything else.  It seems to be immune and even impervious to all the things that significantly impact just about every other DAC I have experienced.  When I first had the DAVE in my home in November, I had noticed quite oddly that my "dirty" Mac Pro plugged into the wall with a standard 18g computer power cord and connected to the DAVE via optical cable sounded as good as my highly optimized CAD CAT which was grounded to an Entreq grounding box and connected to an Audience aR6 line conditioner.  I wasn't sure what to think of this back then and whether I could believe what I was hearing but because my time with the DAVE was so brief (only 48 hours), I convinced myself that I could have imagined it.  Those of you who know me know that I am heavily into music servers and have researched and compared them extensively because with my TotalDAC d1-monobloc and every other DAC I have had, they made a VERY large difference:
 
As it has become clear to me that what is connected before the DAVE has become less important, what is connected after the DAVE has become even more important.  Because the output of the DAVE is so pure and rich and faithful to the recording, it would make sense to use the most transparent analog interconnects, headphone or speaker cables, and headphones or speakers you can afford.  While expensive, I can vouch for the DHC Silver Spore4 if anyone is on the fence about this cable.  The difference in sound quality is there and it is easily the finest headphone cable I have heard.
 
Again, Agreed! Gone are the days I keep looking for stuff that could improve upon USB connection. LIke I said previously when I shop for DAC, source dependency is one of the key I always will be looking at. And I use iphone as source to test different DAC which give me a shock when I did the same for Dave.
 
One point I do wish to highlight is that while other the source that feed to Dave is much less independent, the RF and contamination that a PC/other sources inject back to the mains and eventually affecting preamp and poweramp is still very real. I use isotek Sigma to address this.
 
 

 
Feb 29, 2016 at 1:49 AM Post #1,841 of 25,851
This is highly interestingly news Rob.

Have you decided on how many different power configurations you will have to offer ?

The topology is new, and its scalable, in that I can create any power, so although the first product is 20W or 70W monoblock mode, I will be doing other power amps with different outputs.
 
The range is not decided yet.
 
Rob
 
Feb 29, 2016 at 1:58 AM Post #1,842 of 25,851
Romaz, which specific options did you choose when navigating the DHC dropdown order menus for your DHC Silver Spore4 cable? Thanks.

Esau

While the Silver Spore4 is Peter's best cable for full size headphones, he will tell you the Silver Complement4 is very close in performance but lighter and more flexible although I have not heard it.  I guess you'll have to decide if size and weight is important and with a headphone like the HE-1000, it could be.  My HE-1000 uses 2.5 mm connectors with no lock and because the Silver Spore4 is large and heavy, the connection became loose over time and the signal would cut in and out.  It became very frustrating and this is a design flaw of the HE-1000 and not the cable.  I wish they had stayed with the connectors they were using with the HE-6 which are much more secure.  I had to send my HE-1000 in and fortunately, I received excellent customer service and received a new replacement right away.  My current HE-1000 seems to be handling my Silver Spore4 just fine but if it happens again, I might switch to the Silver Complement4.
 
As for the dropdown choices, Peter will provide you his recommendations on what he prefers but all the options he lists for the Silver Spore4 are of the highest quality.  I like the Eidolac 6.35mm gold jack very much.  I prefer gold to rhodium in general as it seems to add a touch of desired warmth but this is personal preference more than anything else. A good friend who builds cables believes gold yields better bass than rhodium but rhodium yields a slightly quieter noise floor.  I can't confirm this as I haven't done A/B testing but this friend has not steered me wrong yet.  Rhodium plating is more expensive than gold plating but with the Silver Spore4, the difference is insignificant.  As for length, sleeve type, color, split cover, etc., obviously those are personal choices that have no impact on SQ.  I will say that another good friend with a Silver Spore4 compared the SQ differences between a more standard cable length (1.5m?) and a longer cable length (>4m) and there was no drop in perceived SQ.  With Peter's highest end cables, don't feel like you have to get the shortest cable possible to maximize SQ.
 
Feb 29, 2016 at 2:08 AM Post #1,843 of 25,851
  The topology is new, and its scalable, in that I can create any power, so although the first product is 20W or 70W monoblock mode, I will be doing other power amps with different outputs.
 
The range is not decided yet.
 
Rob

Very exciting and simply revolutionary.  20 watts fits my needs perfectly and it's possible this 20 watt speaker amp could be used to drive the Abyss or HE-6 for those looking for more gain.  
 
Rob, could you please explain where in this setup your ADC would fit?  John Franks suggested your ADC technology would somehow be incorporated into a consumer product such as a digital preamp although are we talking about a future version of DAVE as I find nothing wrong with the preamp on the DAVE presently?
 
Feb 29, 2016 at 3:49 AM Post #1,844 of 25,851
Davina is the first adc which is for analogue inputs so you can listen to vinyl at 768k and record the album at 44.1 at the same time. But really the motivation for the product is a first step towards a pro audio interface so pro recording can be done.
Rob
 
Feb 29, 2016 at 3:59 AM Post #1,845 of 25,851
Rob, will you be at CanJam in southern California 19-20 March?
 

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