Expanding your musical horizons is the best way to hear better music. When I order a cup of coffee, I don't ask what mains cable they use on the machine.

lostinspace said:

Expanding your musical horizons is the best way to hear better music. When I order a cup of coffee, I don't ask what mains cable they use on the machine.

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Pfft! Not serious about your coffee then?!

xnor said:

  Why would an amplifier care about the last 2 meters of power cable? Even if you used 5 inch thick silver cables, it wouldn't change a thing.

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Power cables (along with all other cables) act as interference antennas (both receiving and transmitting). Some cable constructions are good interference antennas and other constructions are not.
 
With some components, the input power stage generates lots of interference (EMI/RFI).
With some components, the input power stage is sensitive to  interference (EMI/RFI).

xnor said:

  Why would an amplifier care about the last 2 meters of power cable? Even if you used 5 inch thick silver cables, it wouldn't change a thing.

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While not about the last 2 meters, not all AC wiring systems are equal.
 
*************************************************
 
In this Middle Atlantic paper, see page 12
 
"Integrating Electronic Equipment and Power into Rack Enclosures"
'Optimized Power Distribution and Grounding for Audio, Video and Electronic Systems'
 
Power Distribution and Grounding of Audio, Video and Telecommunications Equipment White Paper 
http://www.middleatlantic.com/pdf/PowerPaper.pdf
http://www.middleatlantic.com/power.htm
 
And this correction:
 
"Addendum to Power Distribution White Paper"
http://www.middleatlantic.com/pdf/Power%20Paper%20Addendum.pdf
 
****************************************************************
 
This Bill Whitlock and Jamie Fox paper has a interesting view of AC power wiring.
 
Ground Loops: The Rest of the Story
Bill Whitlock, AES Fellow  and Jamie Fox, P.E.2

This paper was presented at the AES 129th Convention, 4-7 November 2010, San Francisco, CA, USA
 
ABSTRACT
The mechanisms that enable so-called ground loops to cause well-known hum, buzz, and other audio system
noise problems are well known. But what causes power-line related currents to flow in signal cables in the first
place? This paper explains how magnetic induction in ordinary premises AC wiring creates the small voltage
differences normally found among system ground connections, even if “isolated” or “technical” grounding is
used. The theoretical basis is explored, experimental data shown, and an actual case history related. Little
has been written about this “elephant in the room” topic in engineering literature and apparently none in the
context of audio or video systems. It is shown that simply twisting L-N pairs in the premises wiring can
profoundly reduce system noise problems.

speedskater said:

  Power cables (along with all other cables) act as interference antennas (both receiving and transmitting). Some cable constructions are good interference antennas and other constructions are not.

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My question still stands. Why do the last 2m matter so much, in fact, that some people spend hundreds of $$$ on fancy looking power cables?
Where are the measurements (by manufacturers) that show improvements?
 
 

speedskater said:

  While not about the last 2 meters, not all AC wiring systems are equal.

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So?
People also put their speakers into completely different rooms, but that doesn't justify the purchase of brilliant pebbles or expensive speaker cables.

Why do audiophiles waste their money on countless products that don't improve the sound of their system (and often degrade the sound) ?  Because they are easily influenced  by what they read in magazines, blogs and forums.

Why do the last 2m matter so much
 
Because from an interference point of view, audiophiles often buy poorly designed components.  The nearer the component, the better the cord acts as an interference antenna.

A lot of good points here. My 2 cents:

If money were no object, I'd buy some fancy, fancy cables. Why not? I think this may be the case with some people who use expensive cables. But I pity the people who save up to buy them.
 
This EMI/RFI interference talk is making me want to go Patrick82 with some ERS paper. 

I don't see the point of having a power cable better than whatever cheapo Home Depot stuff is in the walls. Same for interconnects better than what is used inside the amplifier case, inside the headphones, inside the DAC, etc. It seems to me like the most rational way to get into power cables would be to have some Nordost Valhalla going from my equipment, through the wall, and to some batteries. Then I could commission all of my equipment wired point to point with some more Valhalla. Get those lowly PCB traces and silicon out of here. Even my DAC chips will be recreated with point to point wiring. 




 

manbear said:

A lot of good points here. My 2 cents:


If money were no object, I'd buy some fancy, fancy cables. Why not? I think this may be the case with some people who use expensive cables. But I pity the people who save up to buy them.

This EMI/RFI interference talk is making me want to go Patrick82 with some ERS paper. 


I don't see the point of having a power cable better than whatever cheapo Home Depot stuff is in the walls. Same for interconnects better than what is used inside the amplifier case, inside the headphones, inside the DAC, etc. It seems to me like the most rational way to get into power cables would be to have some Nordost Valhalla going from my equipment, through the wall, and to some batteries. Then I could commission all of my equipment wired point to point with some more Valhalla. Get those lowly PCB traces and silicon out of here. Even my DAC chips will be recreated with point to point wiring. 





 

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I wonder if you would enjoy your music any more than you do now.

krismusic said:

I wonder if you would enjoy your music any more than you do now.

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In all seriousness, there's a reasonable case to be made that I enjoyed music the most when I was 10 and got my first CD player. 

I also think your sarcasm meter might need some recalibrating. Or maybe just a better power cable. 

manbear said:

In all seriousness, there's a reasonable case to be made that I enjoyed music the most when I was 10 and got my first CD player. 


I also think your sarcasm meter might need some recalibrating. Or maybe just a better power cable. 

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I wasn't being contentious.
I just have a bit of a theory that all the fretting about the minutiae of sound that things like listening to cables encourages is nit picking that does not lead to enjoying music.
Even though I presume that is what people get into Hi Fi hoping to achieve.
I am not suprised to read what you say about your first CD player.
I think I am actually trying to recapture the excitement that music had for me when I was a teenager. A long time ago.
No cable is going to do that for me!

manbear said:

  This EMI/RFI interference talk is making me want to go Patrick82 with some ERS paper.

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I prefer tinfoil hats. Keeps that nasty EMI/RFI away from my precious gray matter.
 
Once you go tinfoil hat, you never go back. Everything becomes so much clearer. The best comparison I can come up with is sewage vs. a crystal clear alpine stream.
 
 
If cost were no object I'd plaster my walls with really thick sheets of the best oxygen-free aluminum that is available in the universe.

krismusic said:

 
I wasn't being contentious.
I just have a bit of a theory that all the fretting about the minutiae of sound that things like listening to cables encourages is nit picking that does not lead to enjoying music.
Even though I presume that is what people get into Hi Fi hoping to achieve.
I am not suprised to read what you say about your first CD player.
I think I am actually trying to recapture the excitement that music had for me when I was a teenager. A long time ago.
No cable is going to do that for me!

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I'm with you there. I think I've gone far enough with my gear to realize that being neurotic about it holds me back more than getting the best of the best. 

krismusic said:

I wasn't being contentious.
I just have a bit of a theory that all the fretting about the minutiae of sound that things like listening to cables encourages is nit picking that does not lead to enjoying music.
Even though I presume that is what people get into Hi Fi hoping to achieve.
I am not suprised to read what you say about your first CD player.
I think I am actually trying to recapture the excitement that music had for me when I was a teenager. A long time ago.
No cable is going to do that for me!

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Totally agree with this.  There might be a bit of the 'chasing of the dragon' syndrome with a lot of the Hi Fi hunt.
 
I have been through periods where I would get bogged down with the thought of 'this could sound a little better if...', and that road leads to a total lack of enjoyment.
 
Everything I have to do my listening right now brings me lots of pleasure though - so I found my way out of that hole of cyclical purchasing / comparing.
 
Hope you all take some time to enjoy your music tonight!

I think it comes down to the fact that most people are too lazy to do the legwork and research required to figure out how digital sound works. Instead, when they have money in their pocket, they go shopping and just look for something that sounds convincing.
 
If you understand how sound reproduction works, you can judge the relative importance of various aspects of your rig, you can accurately determine the areas that could use some help, and you can sniff out snake oil easily.