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The Stax Thread III - Page 129

post #1921 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by s1rrah View Post
 

 

I can't speak towards comparing the two amps but I've read a lot from some pretty damned on-top-of-it Stax aficionados and from what I've read, the SRM-323S is considered by many to be one of the best (if not the best, considering the money) Stax amps currently available ... also, one of the most powerful.

 

You could probably expect a slightly more detailed image with the SRM-323S ... I use one currently (with 404LE's and Koss 950's) and love it. Had a SRM-T1 before and the 323S blows it away (for my preferences, anyway) ...

Hi S1rrah,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised that the SRM-323S is rated so highly compared to the vacuum tube equipped SRM-T1 and the SRM-006TS costs about £300 more than the SRM-323S. Does the SRM-T1 produce a warmer sound?

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Martyn

post #1922 of 5328

"for my preferences, anyway" :D

I'm also a solid-state taliban, I can understand his rating.


Ali

post #1923 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyn73 View Post
 

Hi S1rrah,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised that the SRM-323S is rated so highly compared to the vacuum tube equipped SRM-T1 and the SRM-006TS costs about £300 more than the SRM-323S. Does the SRM-T1 produce a warmer sound?

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Martyn

The T1 sound like a tube amp to my understanding, so yes it's warmer. That's also my impression, though the T1 isn't overly warm or anything. I think the general consensus is that it tend to pair well with many lambda models as it has enough power and many of the lambdas are also fairly bright, for some of them 'etched' in the treble.

post #1924 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyn73 View Post
 

Hi S1rrah,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised that the SRM-323S is rated so highly compared to the vacuum tube equipped SRM-T1 and the SRM-006TS costs about £300 more than the SRM-323S. Does the SRM-T1 produce a warmer sound?

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Martyn

 

I'm no stat aficionado but it seems to me that the tubed Stax amps are less recommended for Omegas becuase they don't have as much max voltage swing and current compared to the better solid state offerings.  The Lambdas and 009's are less demanding and can make more sense to pair with the tube amps, sort of like deficiencies of one can help mask faults of the other with earspeaker and amp which results in pleasing sound.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/582518/electrostatic-amplifiers-voltage-ratings


Edited by Mr.Sneis - 4/2/14 at 1:44pm
post #1925 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Sneis View PostI'm no stat aficionado but it seems to me that the tubed Stax amps are less recommended for Omegas becuase they don't have as much max voltage swing and current compared to the better solid state offerings.  The Lambdas and 009's are less demanding and can make more sense to pair with the tube amps, sort of like deficiencies of one can help mask faults of the other with earspeaker and amp which results in pleasing sound.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/582518/electrostatic-amplifiers-voltage-ratings

But according to that exact thread the T1 and its variants offer the same voltage swing as the KGSS, 717, 323S, et al.

 

I would not be surprised if the Stax tube amplifiers had audible nonlinear (or even linear) distortion figures even playing test signals.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude_500 View PostSo, at that point you can look right past those numbers, because they quite literally don't matter given that there is enough (that is, when comparison shopping, if you came across an amp that said 100vp-p, you should run away from it. But if you are comparing amps with 800vp-p and 1200vp-p, the difference is completely irrelevant and you should treat them both as "yes, has enough voltage"). What then starts to matter is things like harmonic distortion and intermodulation distortion. These sorts of things will be affected by a load, and therefore different electrostatic transducers might affect an amp differently. A BHSE has feedback so headphones barely affect the output, but with something like the Wes the load could affect the output quite a bit.

Thanks, I think this points us to the right questions. Would the introduction of nonlinear distortion products be dependent upon the amplifier's failure to provide undistorted voltage at the required output levels? I am unsure how this would occur in practice.

post #1926 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3X0 View Post
 

Thanks, I think this points us to the right questions. Would the introduction of nonlinear distortion products be dependent upon the amplifier's failure to provide undistorted voltage at the required output levels? I am unsure how this would occur in practice.

 

Yes, an amplifier will get more and more distortion as it gets closer to railing output. So an amplifier running with +-300V rails with a 500Vp-p output will have more distortion than the same amplifier running with +-400V rails with a 500Vp-p output. But as a result, most designs are just going to run at the maximum reasonable voltage for that topology, so this ultimately just becomes a distortion figure at a desired level. 

 

In essence, just because an amplifier has high voltage rails doesn't mean it has less distortion than an amplifier with lower rails. For instance, a Woo WES has more voltage overhead (I think +-600v rails) than a Blue Hawaii, but a Blue Hawaii has WAY less distortion than a WES just because of its topology. 

 

So in conclusion, anyone who says "that amp has more voltage overhead so it'll have less distortion" doesn't know what they're talking about. The ONLY time this is valid is if topologies are identical i.e. person x made a Blue Hawaii with +-400v rails and said it has less distortion than someone else's identically constructed Blue Hawaii who used +-300v rails.

post #1927 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyn73 View Post
 

Hi S1rrah,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised that the SRM-323S is rated so highly compared to the vacuum tube equipped SRM-T1 and the SRM-006TS costs about £300 more than the SRM-323S. Does the SRM-T1 produce a warmer sound?

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Martyn

 

I found the T1 to be a bit "dull" sounding ... not very dynamic .. but then again, I had the SRM-T1W ... and so it might differ from the regular T1.

 

And re the current offerings ...

 

This is said very loosely but I've read around a bit that the Stax amp(s) that use the ECC99 tubes, such as the SRM-600LE or other amps that typically use 6FQ7(6CG7) tubes but have been modified to use the ECC99 tubes are much better than the amps that, by default use the 6FQ7(6CG7) tubes such as the STAX SRM-007tII and/or the STAX SRM-006tS ...

 

Something about the 6FQ7 tubes not being well matched to the power being put through them (more technical, experienced Stax folk can clarify this maybe) ... and that the ECC99 tubes are much more capable in this regard and less subject to failure down the line...

 

Otherwise, I find the clarity of the 323S to be quite lovely with both the Koss 950's and the 404LE's ... the T1 was okay but just didn't "sing" like the 323S ... seemed lifeless and with no real imaging/dynamics ... 

 

Personally, I'd love to have a SRM-600LE ... but just super pleased with the 323S at the moment ... and if I upgrade, I'll most likely go big and with some sort of KGSS or Blue Hawaii variant ...

 

Best...

Joel

post #1928 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by s1rrah View Post
 

 

I found the T1 to be a bit "dull" sounding ... not very dynamic .. but then again, I had the SRM-T1W ... and so it might differ from the regular T1.

 

And re the current offerings ...

 

This is said very loosely but I've read around a bit that the Stax amp(s) that use the ECC99 tubes, such as the SRM-600LE or other amps that typically use 6FQ7(6CG7) tubes but have been modified to use the ECC99 tubes are much better than the amps that, by default use the 6FQ7(6CG7) tubes such as the STAX SRM-007tII and/or the STAX SRM-006tS ...

 

Something about the 6FQ7 tubes not being well matched to the power being put through them (more technical, experienced Stax folk can clarify this maybe) ... and that the ECC99 tubes are much more capable in this regard and less subject to failure down the line...

 

Otherwise, I find the clarity of the 323S to be quite lovely with both the Koss 950's and the 404LE's ... the T1 was okay but just didn't "sing" like the 323S ... seemed lifeless and with no real imaging/dynamics ... 

 

Personally, I'd love to have a SRM-600LE ... but just super pleased with the 323S at the moment ... and if I upgrade, I'll most likely go big and with some sort of KGSS or Blue Hawaii variant ...

 

Best...

Joel

Hi Joel,

 

Thanks for the advice. I think I'll go for the SR-407 (possibly 507) plus a SRM-323S and hopefully avoid the etch which I'm not hearing with the SR-407 with SRM-006TS. I'm inclined to go for the SR-407 as much of the extra expense with the SR-507 involves the leather earpads and new style headband which I understand can be quite fragile.

 

The SRM-006TS is doubling up as a room heater and I'll probably 'get it in the neck' about the increased electricity bill!

 

Best regards,

 

 

Martyn

post #1929 of 5328

I'm thinking about getting 009's sometime in the future, but I wont have enough to get a totl amp for now. What would you guys recommend as the best "cheap" amp for the 009's? (price: around 2k and under) I heard the srm-727a is one of the best cheap options, is this true? Thanks

post #1930 of 5328

Yes

post #1931 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyn73 View Post
 

Hi Joel,

 

Thanks for the advice. I think I'll go for the SR-407 (possibly 507) plus a SRM-323S and hopefully avoid the etch which I'm not hearing with the SR-407 with SRM-006TS. I'm inclined to go for the SR-407 as much of the extra expense with the SR-507 involves the leather earpads and new style headband which I understand can be quite fragile.

 

The SRM-006TS is doubling up as a room heater and I'll probably 'get it in the neck' about the increased electricity bill!

 

Best regards,

 

 

Martyn

 

I'm confused, wouldn't the 323s accentuate etch with the 407?  (Is that what you want?)  I do admit, one thing the 507 has going for it is it looks pretty killer compared to the drab brown we got with the 407!

post #1932 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by AManAnd88Keys View Post
 


I'm under the impression that he likes to get into arguments...

Defqon is a good guy. Hopefully he will be back.

post #1933 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by gilency View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AManAnd88Keys View Post
 


I'm under the impression that he likes to get into arguments...

Defqon is a good guy. Hopefully he will be back.

+5k

post #1934 of 5328
Quote:
Originally Posted by martyn73 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by s1rrah View Post
 

 

I can't speak towards comparing the two amps but I've read a lot from some pretty damned on-top-of-it Stax aficionados and from what I've read, the SRM-323S is considered by many to be one of the best (if not the best, considering the money) Stax amps currently available ... also, one of the most powerful.

 

You could probably expect a slightly more detailed image with the SRM-323S ... I use one currently (with 404LE's and Koss 950's) and love it. Had a SRM-T1 before and the 323S blows it away (for my preferences, anyway) ...

Hi S1rrah,

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised that the SRM-323S is rated so highly compared to the vacuum tube equipped SRM-T1 and the SRM-006TS costs about £300 more than the SRM-323S. Does the SRM-T1 produce a warmer sound?

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Martyn

 

The analytical SRM-323S is in my ears a good amp for the stax models with less highs like SR-007 and maybe the Lambda Nova Signature, Lambda Nova Basic, SR-202. With the rest of the Lambdas it sounds to bright for me, especially with the new Lambda SR-x07 series. A tube amp is in my opinion the better choice for the Lambdas! I prefer with the Lambdas a SRM-T1/T1S and a SRM-006tS (its better then the pre models SRM-006t and SRM-006tA/II) or a SRM-007t. Also a perfect match is a modded SRA-10/12S + any Lambda model. :D

post #1935 of 5328

Can some one explain to me what 'etch' mean in this context?

 

I have had the LS for sometime. I found that while there is some emphasis on treble, it is quite manageable. Unlike headphones like Grado and the ATH-AD900 which is too sharp for my liking.

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