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SBtouch Soundcheck Touch Toolbox 3.0 anyone?

post #1 of 27
Thread Starter 

I just did the full modification of the firmware of the SBtouch called "Touch Toolbox 3.0", I was VERY skeptical about any sound improvement to say the least. I was using my Meridian DAC so I didn't expect a noticeable upgrade of my digital sbtouch output.

And now I must say I am amazed by the jump in sound quality!


Edited by telecaster - 4/30/12 at 11:19am
post #2 of 27
Thread Starter 

It's free, no one did it?

post #3 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

It's free, no one did it?

 

Yes, it makes the touch sound worst.  I had to manually edit the tt script and set the process priorities back to the stock logitech priorities to get the fullness and musical feel back.

post #4 of 27
Thread Starter 

Would you care to elaborate a little?
 

post #5 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

Would you care to elaborate a little?
 

 

TT 3.0 makes things sound thinner brighter.  This can be perceived as more detailed and might sound good in a warm/dark sounding system.

 

I found things got too thin and sterile.  Not until I changed the priorities back to Logitech defaults did everything sound full and musical again.

 

 

As to how to change these priorities, just dig through the 100s of pages of Klaus's thread on the squeezebox forums.

 

 

I've now ordered a Hiface 2 to use with the EDO app for the Touch.  This should make TT 3.0 totally unnecessary.

 

 

post #6 of 27
Thread Starter 

My findings are different, the sound before is blurry and undefined, like distant sounding I would say that there is a nasty REVERB wetting everything in stock SBT.

 

Pretty strange you like it better than TT 3.0.

 

Placement and decay is not good in stock SBT. After the TT 3.0 decay is superb, placement is like night and day, it lay the stereo mix with greater precision and width. The result is everything sounds way better, that is what I heard and confirmed with 3 factory resets.

For me the sound is nowhere brittle, I just spotted that the extreme bass is absent is dimmed but I have an EQ that took care of that. The rest of the spectrum is actually so much better

post #7 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

My findings are different, the sound before is blurry and undefined, like distant sounding I would say that there is a nasty REVERB wetting everything in stock SBT.

 

Pretty strange you like it better than TT 3.0.

 

Placement and decay is not good in stock SBT. After the TT 3.0 decay is superb, placement is like night and day, it lay the stereo mix with greater precision and width. The result is everything sounds way better, that is what I heard and confirmed with 3 factory resets.

For me the sound is nowhere brittle, I just spotted that the extreme bass is absent is dimmed but I have an EQ that took care of that. The rest of the spectrum is actually so much better

 

I didn't say I didn't run TT 3.0, just not in it's stock form.

 

Remember every external DAC is going to respond to touch tweaks differently.

post #8 of 27
Thread Starter 

I understood differently from you first post soz m8. Would you mind sharing what you did to the priority exactly? I am digging the long and winding thread but it's pretty big.

I have an excellent but rather old DAC so I think I don't have any jitter reduction system in mine that's why I hear such a dramatic improvement in sound.

 

Your solution with Hiface 2 is pretty interesting.. I wouldn't mind shelling out for one of those, and could even use it with a PC..

 

Is it really better than the TT 3.0 mod? Any glitches or inconvenient in sight with usb out of SBT? I only have normal FLAC, almost no HiRez.

post #9 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

I understood differently from you first post soz m8. Would you mind sharing what you did to the priority exactly? I am digging the long and winding thread but it's pretty big.

I have an excellent but rather old DAC so I think I don't have any jitter reduction system in mine that's why I hear such a dramatic improvement in sound.

 

Your solution with Hiface 2 is pretty interesting.. I wouldn't mind shelling out for one of those, and could even use it with a PC..

 

Is it really better than the TT 3.0 mod? Any glitches or inconvenient in sight with usb out of SBT? I only have normal FLAC, almost no HiRez.

Start looking around the end of December in that thread.

 

I don't know if the Hiface is better but in theory it should be.

 

1) it's asynchronous and reclocks the signal, so it won't matter what the Touch is doing as long as it can feed the hiface data fast enough.

2) it's galvanized isolated, so noise from the touch should not make it to the dac.

3) BNC connector which is a true 75 ohm connector.

 

 

To get async usb out to work on the touch you have to install the EDO app.  "Enhanced Digital Out", it's third party.  That said Triode (the developer) knows his stuff.

post #10 of 27
Thread Starter 

Thanks a lot for the position in the thread. Even if I read it, I am too noob to modify the tt file because when I open it with wordpad I got this:

chrt -f -p $PRIOSIRNETTX $PIDSIRNETTX            >/dev/null 2>&1
chrt -f -p $PRIOSIRNETRX $PIDSIRNETRX            >/dev/null 2>&1
}

 

this is the end of the priority part, and it looks nowhere what these guys are showing. Maybe I need another program to edit the tt file?

So you set the priority like SBGK last mod?

post #11 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

Thanks a lot for the position in the thread. Even if I read it, I am too noob to modify the tt file because when I open it with wordpad I got this:

chrt -f -p $PRIOSIRNETTX $PIDSIRNETTX            >/dev/null 2>&1
chrt -f -p $PRIOSIRNETRX $PIDSIRNETRX            >/dev/null 2>&1
}

 

this is the end of the priority part, and it looks nowhere what these guys are showing. Maybe I need another program to edit the tt file?

So you set the priority like SBGK last mod?

 

No, ignore SBGK, he's a complete nut job.

 

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?91322-soundcheck-s-Touch-Toolbox-3-0&p=680771&viewfull=1#post680771

 

winscp is all you need.

 

Make a copy of the tt file.  Find the section where all the above default tt 3.0 values are set.  Set them back to the logitech defaults.

post #12 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrTone View Post

 

 

No, ignore SBGK, he's a complete nut job.

 

 

X2 !!

 

post #13 of 27
Thread Starter 

BTW what is your system? HP, hp-amp and DAC? I'm curious.

 

Thanks for the heads up, I've followed what SGBK was experimenting and yes and did all sort of blind numbers fiddling without any safety net.

 

I have did try your modification of the priorities in the tt file (back to stock SBT value).

 

For my system the change is that the sound didn't have that much more weight and bass afterwards, it has for sure but I felt that the bass boost was due to a lack of control and the bass reverberating was what amplified it.

 

It sounded like a mix of the vanilla SBT and TT 3.0. The sound was back to be blurry and reverb wet to me but less blurry than SBT by a mile.

 

The definition of TT 3.0 was a bit there but lost in a slight amount reverb. I missed the fast decay of TT 3.0 that is what I liked most with the stock TT mod. Also to me the stereo width was diminished. Still it was way better than vanilla SBT but I thought I lost too much definition and found the blurryness unbearable. That blurry affected instrument separation to me, and the bass register was poluting the mediums too much.

 

I guess your priorities mod necessity was due to the "thinness" you experienced with TT 3.0.

To me I don't have that at all, the TT 3.0 is weighty accross the frequency range (lack of very low end, if any) and I only have to boost the low bass a little on my Meridian preamp.

 

So I went back to TT 3.0 and pretty much prefer that for my system at least the speed and definition of TT 3.0.

 

The definition of stock TT and the stereo width is greater but it's not and day. But to me the cleanlyness of stock TT was better fit in my system and couldn't bare with the lack of bass control to my ear.

 

Thanks for the settings info by the way! I will surely experience back and forth to validate this quick impression!

 

I guess those settings are very sensitive to specific system, impedance of DAC imputs, DAC topology and such..
 


Edited by telecaster - 5/1/12 at 2:58am
post #14 of 27

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by telecaster View Post

BTW what is your system? HP, hp-amp and DAC? I'm curious.

 

 

 

Touch->Black Cat Veloce->Yulong D18 Sabre Dac->Balanced Morrow Cables->SimAudio 600i integrated->Morrow Speaker Cables->Focal 1028BE Electra speakers.

post #15 of 27

I just noticed that you have HD650s, I have a pair as well that I use daily at work.  I can imagine how TT 3.0 would sound great through them, they are warm, full and lush sounding. 

 

My sound system I mention above is extremely detailed and flatter in the bottom end then the HD650s.  Focals have extremely fast drivers, very punchy.  More clarity in the top end as well.


Edited by DrTone - 5/1/12 at 6:27am
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