Just got done gaming with Dolby Headphone with my K540's. I noticed that a lot of times there's a certain echo to the sound as a whole, like when I call in a UAV, or a sniper shoots his bullets. I also noticed slight improvement in positional cues, but nothing major. But I know that's because my K540's aren't well suited for gaming.

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ethan7000 said:

How much do you want to spend total? Are you using a PC or console?

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Around $100ish for the set up (Does not include headphones). It will be for PC and maybe PS3/4.

After discussing all the various options for virtual headphone surround I think I missed the obvious. To recap, all the options such as DH, CMSS-3D, THX, SBX etc take the available native audio (usually 5.1) and try to recreate the multichannel sound convincingly over stereo headphones through their different processing methods. But how is this different from simply setting the audio to 2 channel? Obviously doing this doesn't only pass the discrete Front Left + Front Right audio from the multichannel source that is playing but will process all channels in real time and pass the sound appropriately to the 2 headphone speakers. Personal preference to better positional accuracy and sound quality aside, isn't that essentially the same thing?

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lemm said:

After discussing all the various options for virtual headphone surround I think I missed the obvious. To recap, all the options such as DH, CMSS-3D, THX, SBX etc take the available native audio (usually 5.1) and try to recreate the multichannel sound convincingly over stereo headphones through their different processing methods. But how is this different from simply setting the audio to 2 channel? Obviously doing this doesn't only pass the discrete Front Left + Front Right audio from the multichannel source that is playing but will process all channels in real time and pass the sound appropriately to the 2 headphone speakers. Personal preference to better positional accuracy and sound quality aside, isn't that essentially the same thing?

Click to expand...

I guess setting to 2-channel, 5.1 or 7.1 audio is just dumped into 2-channels?
 
Or maybe the two "front" channels contain bigger audio tracks than the the other channels.
So only the two front channels are sent to the headphones?

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lemm said:

After discussing all the various options for virtual headphone surround I think I missed the obvious. To recap, all the options such as DH, CMSS-3D, THX, SBX etc take the available native audio (usually 5.1) and try to recreate the multichannel sound convincingly over stereo headphones through their different processing methods. But how is this different from simply setting the audio to 2 channel? Obviously doing this doesn't only pass the discrete Front Left + Front Right audio from the multichannel source that is playing but will process all channels in real time and pass the sound appropriately to the 2 headphone speakers. Personal preference to better positional accuracy and sound quality aside, isn't that essentially the same thing?

Click to expand...

I guess setting to 2-channel, 5.1 or 7.1 audio is just dumped into 2-channels?
 
Or maybe the two "front" channels contain bigger audio tracks than the the other channels.
So only the two front channels are sent to the headphones?

lemm said:

After discussing all the various options for virtual headphone surround I think I missed the obvious. To recap, all the options such as DH, CMSS-3D, THX, SBX etc take the available native audio (usually 5.1) and try to recreate the multichannel sound convincingly over stereo headphones through their different processing methods. But how is this different from simply setting the audio to 2 channel? Obviously doing this doesn't only pass the discrete Front Left + Front Right audio from the multichannel source that is playing but will process all channels in real time and pass the sound appropriately to the 2 headphone speakers. Personal preference to better positional accuracy and sound quality aside, isn't that essentially the same thing?

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Here, I don't think this is necessarily equivalent to a "best case scenario," but here's a video sample so you'll just hear the difference:
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em[/video]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em

Here's a sample with SBX: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVuck0NrXV0&sns=em

I ended up uninstalling Razer, it was messing up my audio device.

evshrug said:

Here, I don't think this is necessarily equivalent to a "best case scenario," but here's a video sample so you'll just hear the difference:
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em[/video]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em

Here's a sample with SBX: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVuck0NrXV0&sns=em

Click to expand...

That Mirror's edge demo had some really stereo-like hard left/right pans for SBX surround (listen to the helicopter). Sounded like expanded stereo to me. Forget that.. didn't like SBX.... AT ALL. It's more fatiguing than CMSS-3D, and less capable of actual surround emulation, if this demo is any indication.

The BF3 demo did DH and CMSS-3D justice. I don't think it's a good representation of THX Tru Studio, which I feel does better than the video showed.

CMSS-3D had some pretty damn good positional cues, but the rear positional cues were DEFINITELY not on par with DH to me. And it further solidified my belief that CMSS-3D is way too treble tilted and a bad match for headphones that have emphasized treble to begin with. If the rear positional cues get better with other games, CMSS-3D with dark headphones MIGHT be a very good setup. As it stands, it sounds like they cut off frequencies at a certain point, so the bass disappeared.

I'd wanna hear more demos with CMSS-3D anda warm headphone like the 650. All I know is that the X1 had very little rear cue accuracy in CMSS-3D, but did just fine in Dolby Headphone.

Dolby Headphone wins for me again, despite the less than ideal warmer tone for pure analyzing. It just does the surround effect the best, with the least fatigue to me. Easily the most immersive.

Hard left/right panning is just unnatural in every way. Your ears never go through that. That's why the free Razer/SBX surround is just not... good.

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daleb said:

I ended up uninstalling Razer, it was messing up my audio device.

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I also did unistall it because the sound kept on skipping and the volume on the left channel would turn up or down by itself while gaming. Oh wells...it was free for a reason after all.

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evshrug said:

Here, I don't think this is necessarily equivalent to a "best case scenario," but here's a video sample so you'll just hear the difference:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em
Here's a sample with SBX: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVuck0NrXV0&sns=em

Click to expand...

 
Thanks. They all sound ok in slightly different ways, even the standard stereo.
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purpleangel said:

I guess setting to 2-channel, 5.1 or 7.1 audio is just dumped into 2-channels?
 
Or maybe the two "front" channels contain bigger audio tracks than the the other channels.
So only the two front channels are sent to the headphones?

Click to expand...

After comparing my headphone out and the analog multichannel out and effectively muting specific channels to see what sound is present from each position, I can say it is the individual 5.1 that is being sent to the 2 headphone channels. Having spoken about the other methods it seems like even selecting standard stereo creates a comparable effect on a headphone. Everyone's mentioned their personal preference between the different virtual headphone surround options, but is anyone of the opinion that the standard mixed stereo is preferred? Thanks

evshrug said:

Here, I don't think this is necessarily equivalent to a "best case scenario," but here's a video sample so you'll just hear the difference:
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em[/video]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnpLUlD20z8&sns=em

Here's a sample with SBX: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVuck0NrXV0&sns=em

Click to expand...

Drawing conclusions from that video leads nowhere. Hardware OpenAL with CMSS-3D is unbeatable in theory, the only drawback is the sound degrading done by CMSS-3D. Anyway: Here you have Software OpenAL without Creative's HRTF library (for which they actually did a lot of work back then) compared against the whole stuff.

See my video comparison:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JS2_SCTFLM&hd=1 THX TruStudio Pro

vs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHhwUT4BYMk&hd=1 CMSS-3D

Here you have the same panning problem so the conclusion of there stereo effect of SBX theoretically applies to THX Tru Studio as well. However the uploader did not have the right settings. I am creating a video right now which will show the difference to THX.

Other than that we need to test more modern games so all solutions have an even basis.

How does the Beyerdynamic DT990 Pro 250 Ohm compare to the Philips Fidelio X1?

Inner Fidelity First Impressions of DTS Headphone:X
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/first-impressions-dts-headphonex

Mirror's Edge

THX http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JS2_SCTFLM&hd=1

SBX http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ixb4kk6HwM&hd=1

CMSS-3D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHhwUT4BYMk&hd=1

I recorded a SBX run with CMSS-3D like EQ settings (really interesting) but somehow the EQ is bypassed, The hell!?! :confused_face:

fegefeuer said:

Mirror's Edge

THX http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JS2_SCTFLM&hd=1

SBX http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ixb4kk6HwM&hd=1

CMSS-3D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHhwUT4BYMk&hd=1

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Okay, I don't know what's going on with people's settings, but THX Tru Studio sounds too stereo like in that video, and it does NOT represent what I hear, which is legit virtual surround like Dolby Headphone. SBX still sounds horrible, and CMSS 3D sounds like I expected it to sound.