[slunk007]

My first post here. Be gentle...

I'm sorry to start one of these, but I simply don't have enough experience with quality headphones. I've done quite a bit of reading on this excellent forum, and I'm becoming more and more confused (and more and more interested), the more I read.

STRAIGHT OUT: I'm trying to decide between a few headphones: HD600/580, AKG k501/401, ATH-A900

MY PROBLEM(s): I am unable to audition any of these models where I live. I live in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. No good stores to audition headphones. We're a speaker city though! I have never used headphones. I have only used earbuds due to portability.

PURPOSE: I'm planning on using these cans at home, on my home PC. Their main purpose would be to listen to Alt Preset -Standard MP3s out of my Audigy2 Platinum's LiveDrive.

MUSICAL TASTES: Pop, rock, indie, alternative, folk, electronica. I listen to all of these genres about the same amount.


MY REFERENCE gear:

- Sony MDR EX-70 (earbuds) -
I do realize that there is a difference between crap earbuds and decent ones. I have a pair of Sony MDR EX-70 and I'm fairly happy with them (although many here think they're crap). Super portable. Works well with my iMP 550X. My complaint about them is that the bass is a little overpowering and the highs are pretty harsh. Fine for listening on the bus however. Rock music (guitar solos, and loud drums) are not too fun on these though.

- Monsoon PM14 (desktop speakers) -
I love my desktop flatpanels. They are not harsh, they have more than adequate amounts of *tight* bass for my tastes, and are fairly articulate (both low and high ends) for PC speakers. Their main downfall is the fact that you have to be in the sweet spot to really enjoy their quality. I like to lay down on my bed sometimes and just groove to some tunes.

Hence my need for a good set of cans...


REQUIREMENTS:
- They HAVE to be comfortable. Preferrably on the lighter side.
- They do NOT have to be sound isolating. My room is fairly quiet.
- Nice soundstage
- I like nice tight punchy bass. Not overbearring but *tight*. (I don't want a 'phone that sounds like its farting along to the music.

)
- No modding necessary out of the box. I don't really want to swap cables, etc.


PREFERENCES:
- Amp-less configuration if I can get away with it. But I'm willing to invest in a headphone amp if need be. X-mas $ only goes so far...
- They should look nice. As long as they don't look like ass, anyway. (I really like the aesthetics of the AKG k501/401, and they A900 ain't bad. HD580 doesn't appeal to me too much. HD600 a little better however)


QUESTIONS:
I've got a couple of questions that hopefully you'll be able to help me out with.

- Is AudioCube the only online retailer that sells the ATh-A900s?
- If you think an amp is necessary, can you recommend one for the recommended headphone? ~$200 or less.
- Do you think that my Audigy2 will be capable of decently driving any of these phones without an amp?


So sorry for the really long post.


Cheers!

 

[Habib]

Let me take a stab at this. First of all, do you want open or closed phones? HD580/600 are open and leak sound, A900 is closed and does not. Both isolate well when you reach a certain volume of course. HD580 has a more laid back sound signature that is very good for classical and jazz but not so good for rock and pop. It take considerable resource to make them more exciting. HD580/600 will probably sound like crap out of audigy2, mine did.

A900 is very good. It's exciting and easy to drive, and relatively forgiving IMO. Audigy will probably drive it better than the HD580/600 but you still should look into an amp of some kind. The K501 I've only heard during a meet and I wasn't very impressive. It has an outrageous soundstage, the biggest I've hear so far (and I own the CD3000). But it's sorely lacks bass and was unable to fill that cavernous soundstage with sound.

I think A900 matches your description pretty well. It's very comfortable, has a decent soundstage and also has nice bass. You can probably get away with an amp but one is recommended - a PIMETA or Meta42 build by headsave or JMT, who are both great amp builder. And Audio Technica phones are just hot. Both can be obtained used on FS forum quite easily.

I dont want to sound snobby but if you are going to use it for listening to mp3 coming out of audigy2, it's going to be an overkill. But if you are going to stick around here and maybe pick up the hobby, you should go with something with more potential such as the A900 and HD580/600. Otherwise I think Koss KSC35 is very good for the price, probably the best overall under $100.

 

[greenhorn]

Grab this: http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showt...threadid=54584

 

[Jasper994]

For easy to drive cans that have very tight punchy bass the Sennheiser HD 280 Pro works very well but I don't know if you'll like the look.

They are good all around cans but some find them to be to analytical and a bit shy in the upper bass, low end bass extension is wonderful though. The nice thing here is that the street price is around $70 so you could spring for a nicer soundcard for music listening (run 2 cards so that you don't lose the gaming abilities of the Audigy 2).

 

[slunk007]

Quote:

Originally posted by Habib Let me take a stab at this. First of all, do you want open or closed phones? HD580/600 are open and leak sound, A900 is closed and does not. Both isolate well when you reach a certain volume of course. HD580 has a more laid back sound signature that is very good for classical and jazz but not so good for rock and pop. It take considerable resource to make them more exciting. HD580/600 will probably sound like crap out of audigy2, mine did. A900 is very good. It's exciting and easy to drive, and relatively forgiving IMO. Audigy will probably drive it better than the HD580/600 but you still should look into an amp of some kind. The K501 I've only heard during a meet and I wasn't very impressive. It has an outrageous soundstage, the biggest I've hear so far (and I own the CD3000). But it's sorely lacks bass and was unable to fill that cavernous soundstage with sound. I think A900 matches your description pretty well. It's very comfortable, has a decent soundstage and also has nice bass. You can probably get away with an amp but one is recommended - a PIMETA or Meta42 build by headsave or JMT, who are both great amp builder. And Audio Technica phones are just hot. Both can be obtained used on FS forum quite easily. I dont want to sound snobby but if you are going to use it for listening to mp3 coming out of audigy2, it's going to be an overkill. But if you are going to stick around here and maybe pick up the hobby, you should go with something with more potential such as the A900 and HD580/600. Otherwise I think Koss KSC35 is very good for the price, probably the best overall under $100.

Thanks. I think I'm definitely leaning towards the A900's. I love how they look (Ch1nkster's pics were making me drool). I had a chance to pick up the ksc-35's on e-bay brand new in their box but it went for more than I thought they were worth $42USD. I live in Canada remember. Exchange rate is a bitch. At one point, I was definitely considering getting them, but comfort is a must, and I'm not sure how the ear hooks of the ksc-35's would feel after hours of listening (I also wear plastic frame glasses, so there isn't a lot of room for them to rest above my ears anyway).

I think I will eventually get the A900's, despite the "overkill" of listening to mp3's thru my audigy2 (i think alt preset -standard sounds pretty close to CD quality).

Thank you very much for your helpful input.

 

[slunk007]

Thanks guys for your help. I appreciate it.

I'll let you know how it turns out.

 

[Habib]

Just so your options are not limited, new ksc35 is $30 dollars at koss.com. A900 kills this easily at 5x-6x the price

 

[slunk007]

Thanks.

Maybe I'll get the KSC-35's for my Dad (and then I'll borrow them).

I think I'm gonna get the A900's tho. I'm sure I won't be disappointed (considering I'll be going from MDR-EX70's to these).

As for the amp... I'll keep my eyes open for a META42, or PIMETA on here in the FS section. No rush though. I wanna hear how these sound thru my LiveDrive first.

Thanks again!

 

[waffenschmidt]

Quote:

Otherwise I think Koss KSC35 is very good for the price, probably the best overall under $100.

I swear, if somebody said they were looking for the best reference-quality, electrostatic phone, somebody would recommend the KSC35.

To me, the KSC35 are the antithesis of tight, punchy bass.

It looks like the decision has already been made, and I have never heard the A900s. I do, however, have the HD580s and K401s. Of those, I feel the K401s are slightly more comfortable, have a wider soundstage, and have tighter bass. I wouldn't call them punchy, but to me the quality and quantity of the bass is just right with a decent amp. I wouldn't recommend trying to drive them directly from most sound cards.

The HD580s are more musical and more enjoyable in many ways. I think the well-known mid-bass hump may be responsible for at least part of that. To me, they are less accurate (analytical?) than the K401s, which could either be good or bad depending on what you're looking for. I appreciate the strengths of both.

 

[Habib]

Um... he's going to use audigy2 as source and no amp. I used to have HD580 with audigy2 and they sucked royally. ksc35 is a cheap way to get a lot of enjoyment with his current setup and allows him to evaulate if he wants to sink more money for this expensive hobby. I am glad he choose to go for something better but just dont want his option to be limited. And I think he figured out a very clever way to try both

 

[waffenschmidt]

Habib, no offense. I agree he's going to need an amp with either the HD580s or the AKGs (I don't know about the A900s). But he seems to realize that as he said "I'm willing to invest in a headphone amp if need be." Well, he needs to if he wants good performance out of those cans.

He also said:

1. I'm trying to decide between a few headphones: HD600/580, AKG k501/401, ATH-A90
2. I like nice tight punchy bass. Not overbearring but *tight*.
3. I don't want a 'phone that sounds like its farting along to the music.

He described exactly what I look for in bass, and I own two of the three families of cans he specifically said he's trying to decide between. I also have the KSC35s, and to me their bass is the exact opposite of what he said he's looking for. They certainly have their strong points, but when I read "farting along to the music" I said to myself "that's a good description of the KSC35s." I seldom use them because to me the bass is loose and overbearing, exactly what he said he doesn't want.

So not only were the KSC35s not on his list, if they had been I would have steered him away from them given what he's looking for in bass. That's why the recommendation took me by surprise.

 

[slunk007]

Thanks for your comments guys. I appreciate your recommendations, and you're right. If I want to invest in this hobby, then I most likely will buy an amp. Then if I so chose down the road, I could get another set of cans, and eventually find my signature sound preference.

Yesterday I ordered the A900's from audiocubes (it came to $285 CDN with shipping...

). I think for my purposes, it will work out very well. I'm sure that I'd be happy with ANY of these selections (given I buy an amp), and I can always sell my cans on here if I want to try something else later.

For now, I'm going to try amp-less. Maybe later I'll invest in an amp, since I'm sure that the A900's would benefit from one. I'm sure the sound quality is going to blow my mind no matter what since my current headphones are the EX70's. When I first bought those, THEY blew my mind. I can't wait!

Just hope my cold goes away soon since its affecting my hearing

.

I'm planning on trying them right outta the box, and then again after a good burn-in session. I'll most definitely post my initial thoughts on here to help the next newbie decide.

Cheers guys!

 

[Habib]

Yeah the reason I threw it out there was because during a mini meet I came out most impressed with the ksc35 and bought a pair myself. And other headphones present at the meet were Grado SR100, SR225, and HP1. Obviously the price has a lot to do with it. The price/performance ratio is hard to beat with low entry cost (heck my ICs cost more than that). I just feel that for $30 everyone around here should own one as a backup or cheap secondary. And for ppl not familiar with the scene, I think it will suffice and save them a lot of money. Only if I knew back then... I jump in with HD580 and had to upgrade relatively rapidly to get better sound out of them

Just didn't want ppl to be misinformed and come back with "this sounds like crap!"

I actually like my old HD580 more the A900, and will probably pick one up again when the time is right.

 

[waffenschmidt]

slunk, I have to agree with Habib's concern about what your new phones might sound like out of your sound card with no amp. I don't know anything about the card or the A900s, but I know both the Senns and the AKGs you were considering need quality amplification to sound their best.

From your post, it appears you've done enough research here to know what you're getting into. But if you're underwhelmed by what you hear, don't blame it on the phones. You may need to pick up at least a cmoy or mint to give them a fair chance. Luckily, you should be able to get one fairly inexpensively on the Buy/Sell forum.

 

[slunk007]

I think they should sound decent. Apparently, they are not as demanding to drive as the HD's or the AKG's (which I've heard are quite demanding).

I'm definitely going to give them quite the lengthy audition. I am right now just reading up on A900 burn in (if you believe in that stuff) and I really want to give them a good burn-in session before I make any hasty judgements.

I have come to the conclusion that it is not "if I buy an amp", but more like "when I buy an amp". Judging from what EVERYBODY on this forum says about HP amps, it is without a doubt that I'll need one eventually. The only question is... when?

Thanks for your comments guys. Keep 'em coming!