How do you mod a Grado sr60i to have detail like a sr325is
Dec 28, 2010 at 11:48 AM Post #16 of 106
having tried the 225 and 325, I went back to the 60 (and the other two went to other head-fi members, needless to say). but I too think that the only reliable mod with a reasonable price-benefit ratio is to trade in your 60 for a 225 if you want that sound, or for a 325 if you want that sound. you should be able to buy them new for a price that is close if not identical to their model numbers, or used for a lot less.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 12:09 PM Post #17 of 106
I totally Agree with the above in hindsight if you have budget in mind,
 
I think in the US mods are cheap. Here in the UK mods are expensive.. by the time you have for e.g got some 225i's and bought wooden cups ($150+ shipping), and then recabled to silver or balanced or whatever, it comes to around $300usd on top of the rrp of 225i's here of $310 approx. ---> why not spend the extra 70-100 and get some rs1's?
 
With this said, my advice would be to do some simple mods but not expensive mods on the sr60 as stated with points 1-4 on the bilavid reply,... and save up for some 225i's -- used ones you could get for around 200 usd i imagine, or 300ish new ... then go from there.
 
from the 225i's i would skip the 325i and get one of the RS's...
 
some may disagree... but this is what research on these forums tells me to do.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 12:10 PM Post #18 of 106
Guys, I wouldn't want anything I've written here - or anything I popped off in a PM - to discourage anyone from buying an SR325.  I bought mine  brand new.  It was my second Grado ever.  I loved it.  I still love the 325, and I think the shift to a hybrid aluminum fllagship is a vindication for this oft-maligned top of the Prestige line.  I've tried to defend the 325, usually from the 225 mafia, though I've also tried to be clear that it benefits from an amp that  can bring up the bass.  I found that venting the driver had an effect on the bass that I liked very much and that removing the plastic ring near the rear grill, along with the plastic button, sitting in the middle of the rear grill, created a very pleasant effect, one that would snatch a lot of kvetching out of the mouths of those who tag the 325 as shrill.  My comments on how to improve the sound of the SR60 are not meant as a criticism of the 325.  I'm sure there are are folks who like this headphone just the way it is.  I'm sure there's room enough on the playground for all of us.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 12:11 PM Post #19 of 106
Hi Bilavid just read this im sorry if ive caused a rift, it was only to help in this thread.
 
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 12:18 PM Post #20 of 106


Quote:
My comments on how to improve the sound of the SR60 are not meant as a criticism of the 325.  I'm sure there are are folks who like this headphone just the way it is.  I'm sure there's room enough on the playground for all of us.


 
I am currently running my sr80i into the LDMKIII - only had both for around 2 weeks now they have all been burnt in well and i'm LOVING the factory settings.. i cannot wait to start modding tubes, venting drivers, cables etc...
 
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 12:26 PM Post #21 of 106
 
Hi Bilavid just read this im sorry if ive caused a rift, it was only to help in this thread.
 


Don't be sorry.  I'm just trying to be proactive.  I appreciate the kind words and you know where I stand.  I thought the OP had a right to have his question answered from those of us who have actually modded an SR60 to improve its performance.  Then again, I believe any can may be improved - including the PS1000.  I chafe - as I'm sure you do - at the snubs of those who dismiss a legitimate mod, especially when the snub runs smack dab into the face of personal experience.  On the other hand, maybe the mod talk upsets some people - who then have to dismiss modding as either futile or prohibitively expensive - neither of which is true.  As this thread was expressly titled as a question about available mods, I think we are on the side of the angels in making a reasonable effort to a suggest some common-sense tweaks.  People are free to do what they like.  I'm just trying to offer some kind of fig leaf to anyone who might have gotten offended after coming onto this thread, snubbing the mods and getting our combined response.  I don't think we were wrong to respond as we did.  I just want those people to know that our side of the debate isn't intolerant.  To each his own.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 3:30 PM Post #22 of 106


 
Quote:
 
And $500 later you'll have a phone that still doesn't sound like a $300 325.
Quote:
 
If you want a 325 sound, buy one.  An SR-60/80 will NEVER sound like a 325.


No, it will sound better.  Vent the driver.  Damp the back plate.  Replace all plastic with wood.  Replace the stock cable with silver.  Replace the comfies with either bowls or jumbos.  Do it right and you'll end up wondering why you ever set the 325 as some kind of standard.  Of course, reasonable minds may disagree about what might happen.  My opinion is based on something else.


 

 
$500? The silver will cost you $50, $60 with shipping.  Adhesive felt will cost you $5.  So will a connector from Radio Shack.  Assuming you own a steak knife to remove the grill cloth and a ballpoint pen to vent the drivers, and can take cups apart yourself, there should be no cost for these steps.  The cost of the wood will depend on your choice, but given the amount involved, the real variable is finding a way to get it cut.  The cost of the screen is also negligible, even if you have to buy a pair of scissors or wire cutters.
 
Given that your numbers are off by 80%, I can only assume that you have either never tried it or are God.  Drop me a line when you've either made an attempt - or parted the Red Sea - whichever happens first.  A blanket assertion is not an argument.



My $500 estimate came from the assumption you were buying wood cups and Having then re-cabled. So lets go your DIY way and say $100 assuming you're able to resolve that wood cutting variable which, if you'd have done any serious woodworking you'd know is no small thing. So you now have $200  and hours of labor into these phones, and yes, they do sound different but they're NOT going to sound like a 325. At this point for another $100 you could have bought a new 325, had the exact sound you were looking for and spent your time listening to music instead of soldering and sanding. As far as sounding better than a 325, that is subjective and your opinion only.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 3:41 PM Post #23 of 106
haha...I love that...the 225 mafia....perhaps we can start up the 325 G-Men.
 
Quote:
 I've tried to defend the 325, usually from the 225 mafia, 



 
Dec 28, 2010 at 3:44 PM Post #24 of 106
I have my doubts that an SR-80 driver, even in a different enclosure, will have the improved refinement, cleanliness, and detail retrieval of the SR-325 drivers. The voice coil wiring is different between them - that would amount to some inherent differences. Maybe the silver wiring would help.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 5:09 PM Post #25 of 106
 
Quote:
And $500 later you'll have a phone that still doesn't sound like a $300 325.
Quote:
If you want a 325 sound, buy one.  An SR-60/80 will NEVER sound like a 325.


No, it will sound better.  Vent the driver.  Damp the back plate.  Replace all plastic with wood.  Replace the stock cable with silver.  Replace the comfies with either bowls or jumbos.  Do it right and you'll end up wondering why you ever set the 325 as some kind of standard.  Of course, reasonable minds may disagree about what might happen.  My opinion is based on something else.

 
$500? The silver will cost you $50, $60 with shipping.  Adhesive felt will cost you $5.  So will a connector from Radio Shack.  Assuming you own a steak knife to remove the grill cloth and a ballpoint pen to vent the drivers, and can take cups apart yourself, there should be no cost for these steps.  The cost of the wood will depend on your choice, but given the amount involved, the real variable is finding a way to get it cut.  The cost of the screen is also negligible, even if you have to buy a pair of scissors or wire cutters.
 
Given that your numbers are off by 80%, I can only assume that you have either never tried it or are God.  Drop me a line when you've either made an attempt - or parted the Red Sea - whichever happens first.  A blanket assertion is not an argument.


My $500 estimate came from the assumption you were buying wood cups and Having then re-cabled. So lets go your DIY way and say $100 assuming you're able to resolve that wood cutting variable which, if you'd have done any serious woodworking you'd know is no small thing. So you now have $200  and hours of labor into these phones, and yes, they do sound different but they're NOT going to sound like a 325. At this point for another $100 you could have bought a new 325, had the exact sound you were looking for and spent your time listening to music instead of soldering and sanding. As far as sounding better than a 325, that is subjective and your opinion only.

 
Well, if it's purely subjective, you're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to mine, though mine is based on actually trying it and yours is based on a series of assumed - and faulty - conditions.  It didn't cost me "$500" but then I wasn't "buying wood cups and Having them re-cabled," as you assumed.  
 
I do like the crack, "assuming you're able to resolve that wood cutting variable which, if you'd have done any serious woodworking you'd know is no small thing."  Feel free to assume that I am not engaged in "serious woodworking."  Better yet, feel free to assume that I haven't.  I am what a woodworker is thinking about when he laughs so hard he nearly falls off his chair.  Be that as it may, l reject the assumption that you have to have "done any serious woodworking" to make a pair of wooden rings (one for a slip-on, two for full wooden housing).  I did it, and if I did it, anybody can - maybe even you.
 
Following the tips that have been shared, there's no reason the OP couldn't bring his SR60 up to at least the SR225 level without having to deal with wood issue at all.  Let the OP remove the front grill cloth, vent the drivers, damp the magnet back and get rid of that plastic rear grill (along with its plastic button in the center of the vent).  Let him also swap out the comfies and replace them with bowls.  Should he go and do so, he will have spent a whopping $20 on bowls and $5 on adhesive felt.  Not counting the trip to Lowes or Home Depot, he could do this much in 20 minutes or less.  How much he spends on a rear grill will depend on whether he wants one and on what he wants to make it from.
 
Nobody ever said it wouldn't take either thought or labor to make these changes.  He certainly never asked what he could "do" without having to "do" anything.  Nor is it an indictment of Grado that Grado provides the thought and labor for those who are willing to pay.  It's to be assumed that if you fix it yourself, it will take more from you than if you simply swipe some plastic.  But that was never part of the question to begin with.  The OP wanted to know what HE could do.
 
As for making a headphone sound just like an SR325, that was never really the goal.  The OP wanted to know what he'd have to do to make his headphones sound AS GOOD as the SR325, which is, to some degree, subjective.  After all, some people prefer the 325 to the RS1.  To them, the RS1 (and maybe the GS1000) aren't as "good" as their beloved SR325.  To each his own.  But I may be permitted an assumption or two, I assumed the OP wanted to move his SR60 up to a higher level - using the 325 as a gauge.  He wanted more clarity, better resolution, more detail, better bass, et cetera.
 
If it's all subjective, enjoy your cloud and I'll enjoy mine.  Being so much smarter, you had it all figured out in advance.  I, on the other hand, had to actually try.  To make matters worse, I came to the wrong conclusion.  Pity that.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 5:17 PM Post #26 of 106
 
I have my doubts that an SR-80 driver, even in a different enclosure, will have the improved refinement, cleanliness, and detail retrieval of the SR-325 drivers. The voice coil wiring is different between them - that would amount to some inherent differences. Maybe the silver wiring would help.


Enjoy your doubts.  If I had to choose between spending $300 on an SR325 and spending $65 on the material to make a silver upgrade with a four-wire silver braid, you know what I would do, because I've already done it.  Four feet of four-braid silver wire beats 10 feet of copper cable.  As for the difference in voice coils, tell me this: Who, besides Grado, uses the term UHPLC to describe copper wire?  Google it.  It's a made-up name.  If there's any difference in "standard" and "UHPLC" copper in the voice coil, why are the impedances identical?  The magnets aren't any different nor is the mylar or the plastic basket.  This is all unicorn tears.
 
Hearing is believing.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 5:54 PM Post #27 of 106
These guys havent been following the SR60 Mod thread lol  
tongue_smile.gif

 
Dec 28, 2010 at 6:18 PM Post #28 of 106
Bilavideo: thank you very much for your insight and knowledge. I'm new to hi-fi but when I read about what fellow head-fiers like you have done tweaking and experimenting I feel encouraged to try stuff. I don't own a Grado but now I'm feeling like I could go for an SR-80 and do things to enhance it and make it better, that way getting more for my money and have fun at the same time doing it.
beerchug.gif
thanks.
 
 
 
Free knowledge like this is what makes head-fi great, not just a forum for fanboys.
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 6:47 PM Post #29 of 106
[size=15.6px]THNX to BillaVideo for excellent work & the knowledge he is contributing to all of us.[/size]
 
FATCAT, Do you have scientific evidence to back up your general statement of " 325' vs modded sr60's? 
 
I for one would like to hear what the technical differences you know of between the 325 & 60.....  :)
 
Dec 28, 2010 at 7:11 PM Post #30 of 106
1. I absolutely respect the efforts of the DIYers who have modded their Grados to achieve a better/different sound sig, and I suspect that a lot of what they have done mirrors what the folk at Grado (and elsewhere) do when developing new models. 
 
*but*
 
2. If you are going to mod a pair of Grado/Alessandro phones, --please-- do so on the understanding that you could very well end up with an attractive paperweight. Start punching holes in things and you run the risk of damaging the drivers - clearly, the veteran modders know this, but I fear that newbies may not be quite so au fait with the internals of a headphone. 
 
Many years ago, I spent a lot of time and money disassembling and reassembling old cars. Its a great hobby, but you can easily end up with the $10K+ 'wreck' which has cost you untold paycheques, remains undriveable and haunts you until you find someone who is willing to tow it away, at a fraction of the cost you paid for it. The difference between those who complete such projects and those who do not is usually skill - the ability to weld, fabricate and generally problem solve - and the skilled often cant quite comprehend how the 'clueless' get themselves into trouble. I fear that Bilavideo and others may be in the former group while many of us simply are not - unless you can get replacement Grados for very little money, I would think long and hard about any mod which requires irreversible changes to your headphones.
 
Just my 2 cents worth. 
 
estreeter
 

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