Firstly, there is no evidence I can find that shows actual mechanical changes that are definitely audible.
 
Secondly, I don't accept the anecdotal evidence of those who say they have experienced such audible changes as I think that the change is in their head and not in the headphone. The reason why I say that is so is because of my experience with second hand headphones. How, if they have already been used and so are 'burned in', are they changing for me? Again, that to me suggests the headphone its self is not changing, I am.
 
I am happy to be corrected, shown evidence and will change my mind and retract my theory.

It doesn't qualify as actual evidence, but the fact that certain manufacturers call for running their headphones for hours unattended with pink noise when their headphones are new is persuasive to the physical burn in side of this debate. IMO psychoacoustics are even more relevant generally, but I believe that there can be physical changes in at least certain headphones as well.

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grokit said:

It doesn't qualify as actual evidence, but the fact that certain manufacturers call for running their headphones for hours unattended with pink noise when their headphones are new is persuasive to the physical burn in side of this debate. IMO psychoacoustics are even more relevant generally, but I believe that there can be physical changes in at least certain headphones as well.

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Or they're playing into the madness!!!  Kind of like the cable manufacturers that print arrows on the jacket...

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wgb113 said:

Or they're playing into the madness!!!  Kind of like the cable manufacturers that print arrows on the jacket...

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Yeah, I changed the interconnect between my DAC and Amp.  It sounded horrid at first, only for me to discover that the directional cable was in the wrong configuration.  I switched it around and voila.... fluid music.
 
..
....
Ok... just kidding.  I too don't buy the directional thing one bit. 
 
I'm with ProgRockMan almost all the way.  My only disagreement is that burn in doesn't exist with headphones.  I do believe that it does since there's really no reason it shouldn't.  However, I do agree with him fully that the majority of change I experience while listening to a particular pair of cans is psychoacoustic.  All I need to do to convince me is to experience the awkward aspects of a particular can's signature settling down, switching to can that is a lot better in ways that the previous can isn't, and then switch back.  The awkward aspects are back where they were before .... and more.  Give it a little time and I'm OK with them again.  Experiences like these make me smile when I read testimonies of how cans change with each listening session, followed inevitably by the advice to burn in said cans before making a final decision.  I read that sort of testimony and advice as.... don't jump to any conclusions about what you think of a particular cans signature.  Listen to it for a while and see if it grows and you where you begin to love it, or if it only gets more annoying.  I've had both experiences with cans.

Quote:

grokit said:

It doesn't qualify as actual evidence, but the fact that certain manufacturers call for running their headphones for hours unattended with pink noise when their headphones are new is persuasive to the physical burn in side of this debate. IMO psychoacoustics are even more relevant generally, but I believe that there can be physical changes in at least certain headphones as well.

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Which ones? Though I agree with wgb 113 that maybe they are buying into the madness. It is like the Belden admission they cannot detect directionality, but are still happy to sell cables as directional to satisfy the market.
 
If burn in really was a noticeable physical change then it would surely be the same with all headphones and produce the same result. So, for example the way AKG make their K44 headphones and what they are made out of, would mean that initially they do sound 'bright' and lacking in bass, but after a while that settles down. But the way Sennheiser make their HD201 headphones and what they are made out of, there is no burn in at all. But that does not happen, there is no consistent reports of such burn in, backed up by manufacturers with evidence of construction and measurable physical changes.

 
Really people....
 
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/468146/burn-in-myth/15#post_6338400
 
Same applies for most headphones as most headphones and speakers use the same system to produce sound, that being dynamic transducer.

 
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chinesekiwi said:

 
Really people....
 
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/468146/burn-in-myth/15#post_6338400
 
Same applies for most headphones as most headphones and speakers use the same system to produce sound, that being dynamic transducer.

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Great link thanks. My first impression was what a difference in the measurements between brand new speakers of the same make. That would surely mean, if such differences were audible, it is impossible to make any speakers/headphones that sound the same at all.
 
The Hydrogen thread has some important points; posts 11, 13 and 14 cast doubts on whether or not the full sized speaker measurements may apply to headphones. Post 12 accepts the measurements but the same poster goes on in post 17 to ask whether such is audible and for proof of such.
 
Head-fi does not get a good press in the thread

 
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Though I agree with wgb 113 that maybe they are buying into the madness. It is like the Belden admission they cannot detect directionality, but are still happy to sell cables as directional to satisfy the market.

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Belden's just one of many cable MANUFACTURERS that I've sat with that private labels for the audiophile brands and they laughed the printed arrow thing all the way to the bank...
 
There I was, sitting through the week-long Belden College of Wire Knowledge in beautiful Richmond Indiana, looking at a co-worker's jaw drop in disgust as he heard this information.  I think he's spent more on cables than I have on my entire system...his dream was crushed in an instance!!!
 
I don't deny that there is likely some minute form of "burn-in/break-in" that goes on with certain electronics.  I DO think that we as a community, heavily exaggerate it as we do many things.  Once it reaches mass hysteria the marketing departments take hold of that fear and sell their solution right back to us.
 
In the end, as with The Great Cable Debate, it's cool to think whatever you want.  Just don't forget to enjoy the music!!
 
Bill
 
 

The Belden College of Wire Knowledge!!!!! I was sure you were making that up, but
 
http://www.belden.com/03Products/03_TechnicalInfo.cfm
 

I wish I was.  For the most part it was brutal to anyone that's been in the (wire & cable) industry for a few years.  Lots of marketing and drinking of the Belden kool-aid.  

Was mention made of this to do with cable directionality? -
 
http://www.aes.org/sections/pnw/pnwrecaps/2000/lampen/
 
What, if any other "audiophile myths" were discussed?

Stephen didn't present at our BCWK, Kip Coates covered the Broadcast/Broadband portion but told the same story.
 
The only other interesting tid-bit he relayed was that Roger Daltrey refuses to use any microphone cable other than their 1800F due to the durability...
 
Most cable manufacturers that do the private labeling politely ask you to ignore the packaged items you pass as you tour the facility.

So do Belden make cables for other 'audiophile' companies who presumably sell stuff on at a profit with directionality etc included?

I don't think that Belden consider themselves an audiophile company.  Their market is the professional A/V production market.
 
They, along with other cable manufacturers, do private labeling for 99% of the "audiophile" cables in the market.  Sometimes it's as simple as a particular color jacket with printed arrows, other times it's a custom construction specified by that "audiophile" cable seller.  I assume then that the cable seller gets their order from the manufacturer and then terminates in-house before packaging for retail sale.
 
Mention burn-in to any of the cable manufacturers (not sellers) and they'll try and have you committed...that is, after they've asked you to repeat yourself three times and explain what you mean.
 
I buy aftermarket cables because they're more durable and the length I need as opposed to what's included with equipment.  I have never heard a difference between two properly functioning cables.  Just as I have never heard a piece of equipment sound better during listening.  
 
I have no problem with people making money.  If there is a market, fill the need, again, to each their own.  Just don't forget to enjoy the music that brought you to the discussion in the first place!
 
Bill

Thanks for that Bill, a fascinating insight. For any future cables I may need I go to pro-audio (ready made and for DIY) as opposed to audiophile, for the very reason that they have to make the cable to a high standard, but cannot get away with charging silly prices.