Macdef, you have some major beef with me or something, the T40 IS the best laptop you can buy, it is expensive, but with that you get the best support in the world, the best display in the world (the 1400X1050 is the best currently in laptops), the highest reliability, the smallest, fastest laptop, and incredible battery life (6+ hours), and the happiness of owning a product that is far superior to any other on the market, I would know, I have used pretty much every laptop on the market in the US (everything from picturebook to ibook to inspiron to powerbook)...I'd have to say that apples are far superior to what they once were (old powerbooks shut off because of poor venting of heat) but still cannot attain the quality of an IBM laptop, the Thinkpad line has always been known as the best, and will always be the best, if you don't want it, or you don't need it then that's your decision, but you cannot compare the T or X series to anything apple has, the 14 hour battery life of the newest X is the highest current battery life in any notebook, and the T40 is the only laptop in it's class to use a 9.5mm drive, making it the smallest, fastest, and most reliable laptop ever created (except in speed compared to those area 51m's in gaming...), IBM makes laptops/notebooks for business users, apple's main audience is the basic consumer, not needing any of IBM's special things, like RapidRestore, which works very well, if you don't like IBM you don't have to bash their products, Apple's are very good, I was stating what the best current laptop was, not saying it was better or worse for differing needs, the T40 IS superior to the iBook, and that's to be expected, both are excellent products, and I recommend them both wholly, but ranting and being an ass over something is nothing to be proud of, it is disgraceful , 5/5 unhappy faces agree that you need to be open to opinions and not bash things!

The IBM eraser head is far more acccurate in my opinion, I went to compusa the other day, and all of the apple's had bad 'trackpads', HP's and Compaqs also have bad 'trackpads', but I like eraserheads better ...are they actually trackpads??

The difference:

Touchpads: you can tap the surface of the pad to 'click'

Trackpads: do not have this capability


Until you have used pretty much every computing product available, you have no reason and or ability to argue with me, as a person who has used a bigger variety of stuff than anybody I know, I should have far superior knowledge, and I find that I do in most cases, unless you can attain a superior knowledge base than I have, I feel that your statements are extremely biased and have no base for their extreme blasphemy!


...and if you don't like the T40, take it out with all the places that think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread (pcmag...pcworld...)


Oh Yeah!, forgot to add that IBM Thinkpad's have always been known for the fact that they have the best keyboards in a laptop/notebook computer

AdamZuf: There are quite a few notebooks with electrical or optical s/p-dif outputs (even my old Dell Latidue 800 has got one), but as most modern notebooks use AC97 audio solutions, you'd run into the resampling problem (plus I don't think that especially low jitter is really a goal for notebook designers...). So you'd probably be better off with a usb sound module.

D-EJ915: I agree, that IBM makes fine notebooks - though Apple, Acer, Toshiba and Samsung also have quite a few good ones to offer. But 1400 x 1050 being the best in notebooks is far from true. Actually, the nicest laptop screens I've seen so far were either 1024 x 768, 1280 x 1024 (very rare) or 1600 x 1200. SXGA+ implementations have problems with game compatibility rather frequently and quite a lot also suffer from a lack of brightness. For myself, I'd prefer SXGA (nicely implemented on older Gateway Solos, now coming back with Sony), although I have to admit that Sony's 16" UXGA implementations are really impressive. I just don't find super high resolutions that useful on notebooks...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

P.S.: After the recent price drop, I also strongly reconsider the iBook. And it's so cute...

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http://store.apple.com/

Click on the red "Specials" tag near the bottom of the page.

Also, frequently if you ask in an Apple retail store, they will have a few refurb/return units in the back of the store at slashed prices. All these units have been completely inspected and carry a full as-new status at a $300 discount. I buy almost all my Apple products this way, except the new iPod which I had to special order (to be engraved).

If your sister (or you) is a student, you can get other great deals through the education store.

--Chris

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(alarum bells)

Gross subjectivity alert!

(alarum bells)

Yea she's a student and so am I. But I would be interested if I can get an iBook with the specs MacDef specified. I checked the Specials section and don't see any iBooks priced at that point with those specs (or even close to it).

And instantly, they're refurbished. How are Apple refubished products by the way? Wonder if IBM has T40 refurbished units. I know Dell marks down their refurbished units by quite a few.

IBM is kind of lackluster as it goes with refurb units, they start selling refurbs about 5 years after they go off sale, so no T40's for us ( that'd be nice )

Personally, I don't really like high-res. displays either, I like te SRX serie of sony laptops, but they discontinued them, oh well...off to buy 6+ D-EJ01's and 5 D-EJ915's

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I've never seen a laptop with coax out. For that matter, I've never seen one with optical-out built-in. However, you can use a USB device like the M-Audio or Xitel units to get an optical-out.


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The Apple Store price for a new one is $1300, but you can usually find one from other mail-order vendors on sale for $50-$100 cheaper. Add $80 for a 512MB RAM chip from a place like Data Memory Systems, and you get around $1300

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Just go to the main iBook page on http://store.apple.com. Click on the $1299 model -- the specs are what I quoted except for the RAM.




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No, I just have a beef with ignorant (meaning uninformed and inaccurate) comments.


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Totally a matter of opinion. I showed in the previous post why it may not even be as good as a cheaper iBook, depending on your needs.


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Actually, some of the T40 models are really not that expensive.


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There are so many things wrong there. Best support? Consumer Reports just released their latest study of computer support. Apple came out on top; IBM wasn't in the top three. In fact, I've always been more impressed by Dell's support than IBM's. Best display? Maybe highest resolution, but not sharpest/brightest, which is what makes a laptop display the best -- resolution is just numbers, and calling a display the "best" because of its resolution is like calling a Coby headphone the best because the frequency response says "5Hz-25kHz." Highest reliability? See Consumer Reports report. Smallest? The iBook is smaller than a T40 model in the same price range. Fastest? With a Mobile Pentium, I don't think so. The Dell laptops that don't use the Mobile Pentium are faster. 6+ hour battery life? The model I mentioned above for $1799 has a 3-hour battery life. As for "the happiness of owning a product that is far superior to any other on the market," if you really think so, then far be it from me to shatter that delusion and ruin your happiness


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BS. I worked in IT and supported hundreds of laptops from several vendors. I never saw a PowerBook that shut off because of poor venting of heat. Ever. Nor have I even read a report of this happening regularly (and if it happened, it would have been publicized, because Apple owners like to complain LOL). Apple PowerBooks have long had a (deserved) reputation for superior quality. Apart from one particular line of PowerBooks (the horrible 190/5300 series), PowerBooks have been extremely reliable.


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Always been known as the best? Not exactly. Always be the best? A bit presumptuous.

IBM laptops are very good. I never said they aren't. But you're deluded if you think they're head and shoulders better than any other Wintel laptop, not to mention Apple PowerBooks.


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You're once again showing that you're clueless when it comes to Apple, Mac hardware, and the Mac OS.


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Try reading my previous post. Where did I "bash" IBM products? I like IBM products, and their laptops are among the better ones on the market. I just have a problem with uninformed assertions.


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See my previous post for exactly why that statement doesn't hold water.


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Seems the only one ranting and bashing here is you.


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LOL! The pencil-tip mouse controls on IBM laptops have been criticized for years for their inaccuracy and difficulty for use. There's a reason IBM is about the only laptop vendor to still use them. Everyone else has moved on to trackpads.



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Touchpad and trackpad are two names for the same device. Some support mouse-button-like tapping, others don't. (FYI: Apple trackpads have supported clicking, click-locking, and dragging for years.)


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First of all, the comments you've consistently made about Apple products proves to me that you haven't used that many products, or at least you've never used any Mac products. You've also shown that you know little about Apple products or the Apple/Mac market.

But more importantly, you're making a lot of major assumptions here. I wouldn't go around talking about how you "know" more about a topic when you don't know a thing about the people you're discussing the topic with. I'm pretty sure I'm quite a bit older than you, with years of experience in this field, and I've used quite a few computers in my time. Before you make statements like "you have no reason and or ability to argue with me" (especially when you make statements that clearly show your expertise isn't as vast as you claim), you may want to take a step back and consider that on a board like this there are bound to be people who know a heck of a lot more than you on many different topics.


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Is that why Apple's latest laptop line has received accolades from many reviewers in the Wintel press for having a better keyboard than any of the current Wintel laptops (with many reviewers specifically pointing out that it takes the crown away from IBM's laptops)? And IBM originally took the crown away from Apple, so clearly IBM hasn't "always" been known for this.

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The iBooks on the specials page are identical to the specs MacDEF specified, short of 10GB disk space and 100Mhz speed, neither of which makes a significant difference in an iBook. "Combo" means DVD + CDRW, both have 32MB Radeon Mobility video, and both come with the same software, etc. Refurb units are identical in every way to new units -- unlike many non-Apple manufacturers that have so many options things are always different. The RAM you're going to have to add yourself either way, which is a $100 upgrade/investment on top of the prices quoted in either case (I suggest buying it from Otherworld Computing, eshop.macsales.com).

Refurbished Apple products are guaranteed to be just as good as new. Most of the time, they are products that are returned after one or two days of use upon which the consumer decided to step up to a Powerbook or get a desktop model instead. Apple will not repackage and sell it without completely verifying that it is not a "lemon" product. I've purchased at least 5 Macs and Mac products this way, and never had a problem with any of them.

Hope this helps!

--Chris

the purpose of this thread, is to offer a best deal for a transportable setup for pure audiophile purposes, in the least money investment, in the real world of internet and streaming/ compression audio, and to make the perfect transportabe rig.

ok, thanks to lini for contributing a little line about not counting on the digital outs of the laptops, as jitter (or anything that has realy got to do with hi-fi) probably don't bother any of these products' designers.

sizewize, the Xitel Pro Hi-Fi link is perfect. i don't think there's a reason to worry too much about the quality of the digital outputs with Xitel. i just wish they would have a cheaper package option without all of the cables! (except the usb)
also, there's no other unit that has both coaxial and optical out, and i guess they both can operate the same time (correct me if i'm wrong), that would give the plus of listening + recording to a MD unit with the optical out (just a nice thought, you can enjoy your 100% sound while recording with the coaxial). the problem is, that it won't work with Macintosh, as far as i know.
http://www.xitel.com/

unlike that, the M-Audio Audiophile is too big! (and has un-needed options for our purpose)
http://www.m-audio.com/products/m-au...iophileusb.php

is wireless internet connection nowdays developed enough to have streaming audio something to look at? (is it practical?)
to the audiophile, is streaming audio even something to look at and maybe enjoy?

the main question remain, if one should consider a used laptop:
with apple/windows based laptops, from what model/period/price range there's that extension that is required for wireless internet connection? if one will pass that option, what are the price ranges for a used laptop of either kinds that would burn CD's, have the longest battery life, stay reliable (no interruption of deep listening with stupid OS crush), be the lightest, the smallest, and stay as low as it can be pricewize?
i guess that for the traveller, apple is a good choice because of customers' service everywhere, am i right?

just to add, for some who don't need a coaxial output, and want a nice usb DAC, or to use an optical out with the higher level Sostenuto-1 PDAC, the M-Audio Sonica might be a very nice option:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/cons...nica_page1.php
the sonica requirs OS 10.1 or later, if you're using a Macintosh.

if you have an optical out in your laptop (as i understand that coaxial are nowhere to be found), you could even pass the sonica, and go directly to the laptop->PDAC->headphones setup.
very nice! (though coaxial out is better, most people will say, and the PDAC uses only an optical out)
here's Kellys' review on the PDAC:
http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showt...highlight=pdac

as a relative to the long sessions (battery dependant) issue,
i have a question:
with either types of laptops, does it matter what OS you got to get the max battery life?
does is matter if you read mp3 from a CD or from the hard drive?
(in battery life terms too, as a relative to figure out how much HD space do you need for your music or just prefer to burn the files on cd's, and make the laptop cheaper)

which computer charges faster?
which computers' extra battery pack is cheaper, smaller or better for some reason?
does the new models better in the terms of battery life?
how much?

Adam: Well, if you need extra-long battery life, either the iBook or one of the new Centrino/Pentium-M-based notebooks (Acer's Travelmate 800 is quite good and not that expensive, for example) would be the best choices.

For charging speed, it's usually slowest on budget notebooks with desktop cpus, where the power supplies are usually barely strong enough to power the notebook itself, when all i/o ports are in use. As for battery types, you probably won't find anything else than notebooks with smart LiIon types, anymore - so you needn't worry about NiMH or anything else. A juicy power supply provided, the smaller packs (= less mAh) will of course charge faster than the bigger ones.

All in all, I'd vote for the iBook: For the price, you can't really go wrong with it. It's also one of the most versatile notebooks in practical use, because unlike many pc notebooks the iBook doesn't need ventlation from the bottom - so there won't be any thermal throttling, even if you run the iBook half sunk into your blanket on your bed...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

what are the minimum specs you think i should consider?

is there a replacement USB soundcard for the Xitel Pro Hi-Fi link, that can operate with the iBook?

iBook is nice but there's no foobar2000 on it which I think is the best sounding media player. Xitel Pro Hi-Fi link isn't 24bit capable is it? Although you have other needs though which I think are contradictory.

Smallest, lightest = not cheapest
smaller = Usually less battery life since the battery is smaller

iBook is a good compromise.

What does wireless internet have to do with streaming?

There aren't many soundcard options for Mac. Only M-Audio makes cheap cards.

Adam: Well, I'd recommend the 12.1" combo model, which should be ok from 700 MHz and up. If you also have games in mind, though, it would be wise to chose one of the newer 12.1" combo models with 32 MB of video ram, which should be available from 800 MHz and up. Plus, expanding the maiin memory to at least 256 MB is advisable, too. For the sound solution, I guess, I'd try the Sonica with it...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini