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Anyone Else Catch This Online

post #1 of 17
6/21/07 at 7:45am
Thread Starter 
So I was checking stuff online and came across this...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19313280/

Thoughts?
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post #2 of 17
6/21/07 at 8:03am
looks like frank black, loves music like john peel, is angry like steve albini.

i'm 100% in accord with everything in that glorious article, and i think the writing is beyond brilliant. that's probably not helping to start a discussion, but thanks a lot for the link
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post #3 of 17
6/21/07 at 10:05am
I think a nice, loud fart before the altar of pop culture now and again is needed......though I am a big Bob Dylan fan, even in his most brilliant years, he threw some really pointless turkeys out there.

I would disagree with his characterization of Metallica though, in that Metallica was creating a denser, more complex, and IMO more interesting thrash sound than any of their contemporaries, and it is the epic ferocity of their early output that made them stand out. Yeah, they toured harder, longer, and promoted themselves more intensely than other Bay Area thrashers, but the proof is in the music. Listen to any Exodus or Testament album of the period, and then listen to one recorded by Metallica at the same time. No contest........

I completely agree about the Doors, though.
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post #4 of 17
6/21/07 at 12:14pm
I don't know... reading the article, the only wanker I could really pick out was the author himself, and yet... he was so careful to remain self-deprecating that you can't really pass him off as a pretentious whiner with nothing better to do than cut peoples' tastes down.

I mean, I don't really disagree with what he was saying about the bands in particular - despite enjoying the music of just about every artist listed. Pop is pop and it gets blown way out of proportion until it becomes "teh bestest moosik evar" by the masses. Which is ridiculous.

BUT!

The part that irks me the most, where he loses substantial credibility in my eyes, is right at the beginning. Where he fully admits he's one of those bloody record store snobs with nothing better to do than cut down peoples' tastes. Honestly, people like music for myriad reasons and I can't think of a single one of them that is "wrong" in my eyes. Intelligent discourse and debate in the art world is important, but when it's not a discussion of the merits and shortcomings of the work itself, it becomes pretentious snobbery.

I would punch that guy in the face in a heartbeat.
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post #5 of 17
6/21/07 at 12:37pm
Things like this really bug me. It is really just an excuse for the author to show off his supposed musical knowledge and sophistication, and what it really boils down to is that he misses that feeling of superiority over everyone who walks in his store. While he is correct that all popular music is over-rated in one way or another, how could artists as prolific and important as Bob Dylan and the Beatles ever truly be over-rated? Their respective impacts on popular music and, by extension, the world, are inestimable. More importantly, millions upon millions of people have been deeply moved or affected by their music. In the end, that is what is truly important. If the music, no matter how derivative, base, unoriginal, manufactured, or just plain catchy, speaks to you, then that is good music.

That all being said, I have to agree that U2 is one of the most over-rated bands in the world. Yeah, I have and listen to the greatest hits, but their live shows are astronomically expensive and "Vertigo"? - come on, that was horrible.
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post #6 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:01pm
Fails. The Clash, Sonic Youth, overrated? Come on.
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post #7 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:03pm
Near You-George Jones & Tammy Wynette
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post #8 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:17pm
I'd agree that just about every band is overrated... for some folks' taste. Why get into a big tizzy about it? I notice that the writer never mentioned bands he does like.
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post #9 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSTpt1022 View Post
If the music, no matter how derivative, base, unoriginal, manufactured, or just plain catchy, speaks to you, then that is good music.
That's the one. Even as a person who likes some very complicated or even downright UGLY music, loves to discuss themes, strengths and shortcomings, I still just love music for no other reason beyond the feelings it evokes.

Critique the art, don't criticize the art lover.

And uh, Ken, think you meant to post that in the music game!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Chaos
I notice that the writer never mentioned bands he does like.
Of course not! That would open up his secretly vulnerable heart to outside criticism, which can never be allowed. Everyone else is wrong when it comes to his own tastes and yet, he is the only one who is right when it comes to others'.
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post #10 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Chaos View Post
I notice that the writer never mentioned bands he does like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Article
Sonic Youth
My personal all-time favorite band. And just about every rock critic thinks they’re incredible. So there’s got to be something wrong with them. I just can’t see it because I’m blinded by love.
...
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post #11 of 17
6/21/07 at 1:44pm
Point made Jeff, but I hope you can see the irony in writing an article like that and then ending it the way he does. He could stand to take an introspective look at his preoccupation with what other people like.
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post #12 of 17
6/21/07 at 11:52pm
glendaleviper, that article is ironical from start to finish. he aims at himself as well as he does at others. hold your anger for a minute and re-read it filtered through my sunglasses

not only is sonic youth one of his favorite bands, he clearly respects others mentioned there (he apparently still likes u2, warts, sunglasses and all, for example).

that article isn't fuelled by hate but by love of music - AND is an ironic appreciation of the unconditional love of music. quite the opposite of what you make of it. my guess is that he would love your reaction, though - he set your heart on fire in just the way he intended
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post #13 of 17
6/21/07 at 11:57pm
I don't think the article was meant to be taken all that seriously.
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post #14 of 17
6/22/07 at 10:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riordan View Post
he set your heart on fire in just the way he intended
He sure did!

I recognize the article was written to be somewhat ironic... I guess my intolerance for "music bigots" got the best of me.
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post #15 of 17
6/22/07 at 10:23am
The article was an amusing read...and that's about it. I don't really value the opinion of someone who hates popular music simply because it's popular...
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