How do you know that the sound of the DAC is the problem? Could it be the amp? The DAC is just taking the digital signal and converting it back to an analog signal. Unless it's a terribly inaccurate DAC, it would not convert the digital data of the "brighter" frequencies at greater volume than the "less bright" frequencies. The amp might be making the sound seem brighter, but the DAC is probably not doing that. Maybe I misunderstood your explanation.
Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org
heathdwatts
KeithEmo
You could be right about it's being partly the preamp - especially since it's apparently bright even with analog inputs, but the HA-1 uses a Sabre DAC, and Sabre DACs are known for a characteristic "forward" sound. (People who like them say they sound "detailed"; people who don't like them say they sound "etched" or "bright". The closest analogy I can use for someone who hasn't heard it is that it's like the difference between looking at your living room carpet from the light of a table lamp, or using a powerful hand-held spotlight. They're both "accurate", and it's the same carpet, but the spotlight does make it easier to see the fine details, and it also makes the dirt and dust stand out more. )
It's not a matter of frequency response; any good DAC, including the Sabre, is going to be very flat. What you're hearing is that the digital oversampling filter in the Sabre tends to emphasize transients - which often makes it sound like the treble is boosted a bit. Make no mistake, though, that there is a distinctive "Sabre sound" (although it is more obvious in some implementations than others).
It's not a matter of frequency response; any good DAC, including the Sabre, is going to be very flat. What you're hearing is that the digital oversampling filter in the Sabre tends to emphasize transients - which often makes it sound like the treble is boosted a bit. Make no mistake, though, that there is a distinctive "Sabre sound" (although it is more obvious in some implementations than others).
Armaegis
@heathdwatts: For a while I was using a dac with both analog and coax outputs, so I could switch instantaneously, volume matched between them. The differences were noticeable and the coax input was "brighter". I also ran preamp outputs into a different amp in a few different configs (both digital and analog in) just to confirm. Every single part of the HA-1 from dac to amp to preamp felt "bright" to me (in different ways), with the dac being the most noticeable.
@KeithEmo: I didn't want to get into the dac chip debate, but yes upon the first few minutes of listening I thought it was a Sabre (and at the time I did not know what the dac was; I honestly thought it was a TI chip going in)
@KeithEmo: I didn't want to get into the dac chip debate, but yes upon the first few minutes of listening I thought it was a Sabre (and at the time I did not know what the dac was; I honestly thought it was a TI chip going in)
achristilaw
This guy has problems with various differing gear on occasion. The HE-6 isn't compatible.... duh!
Armaegis
@achristilaw I did also listen with an HD598, HD25, T50rp, V-Moda XS, Gramo One, and GR07, plus whatever else I had on hand. Considering that covers an open and closed planar, an open and closed dynamic, one earbud and one iem, I feel I did my due diligence sampling a reasonable range of headphones and heard enough consistencies between them that I did not need to expand upon every single pairing with the HA-1.
aqsw
You know I value your input, but why do you always dislike my equipment!!?
I am so glad that I have old ears, hearing loss from handguns and motorcycles, and Audeze 2.2s.
You have convinced me to buy another HA1 for my office!
Good review ,
But you should look at other angles than ALWAYS referencing it to the HE6. I and most people here don't care about that headphone.
P.S. I'm not going to lend you my stuff anymore if you keep panning it!,
P.S. you know I'm just kidding!!
I am so glad that I have old ears, hearing loss from handguns and motorcycles, and Audeze 2.2s.
You have convinced me to buy another HA1 for my office!
Good review ,
But you should look at other angles than ALWAYS referencing it to the HE6. I and most people here don't care about that headphone.
P.S. I'm not going to lend you my stuff anymore if you keep panning it!,
P.S. you know I'm just kidding!!
Armaegis
@aqsw
Hey man, I appreciate the loans =P If you'll note the comment just above yours, I did try several other headphones aside from the HE-6. To be fair, I liked the HA-1 more than your old Lyr1, and that Bifrost was ok it simply didn't mesh with me. Oh and of the few LCD2.2's I've heard (which were all different sounding), yours was probably the best.
You know I've always got stuff that you're welcome to borrow as well if you like.
Hey man, I appreciate the loans =P If you'll note the comment just above yours, I did try several other headphones aside from the HE-6. To be fair, I liked the HA-1 more than your old Lyr1, and that Bifrost was ok it simply didn't mesh with me. Oh and of the few LCD2.2's I've heard (which were all different sounding), yours was probably the best.
You know I've always got stuff that you're welcome to borrow as well if you like.
aqsw
I know, thank you
But with my old ears, hearing loss, etc. , I don't know if I could tell the difference! LOL
But with my old ears, hearing loss, etc. , I don't know if I could tell the difference! LOL
zilch0md
Hi everyone,
I'll start by saying, I find Armaegis review to be absolutely accurate, in comparison to my opinion and experience with the HA-1, but perhaps not well elaborated.
Never having heard the HE-6, on any DAC/amp combination, I can't comment regarding the HA-1's use with the HE-6, but I nevertheless trust that Armaegis wouldn't claim that it "shuts down" if it weren't reproducible, so the really nice thing about that part of his testimony is that we don't have to worry about it being subjective.
As for his subjective comments, which is all any reviewer can provide for audio gear, short of measurements, I can find no fault in comparison to my own experience and tastes.
He could have done a better job of qualifying some of his statements, however - specifically, his comments regarding the DAC seem to be contradicted further down where he writes, "This would be good with darker cans like the Audeze LCD-2/3 or the Oppo PM-1/2 or Sennheiser HD600/650..."
Reading this, we have to reconcile his statements to realize his opinion of the DAC, and anything negative regarding the amp as well, does not apply to "darker cans."
I think it safe to conclude his DAC comments should have been qualified by stating that it's incompatible with the HD800, for example. In Skylab's innerfidelity.com review of the HA-1, he wrote, "I wouldn't recommend it to people who are looking for an amp to solve a 'problem' they have with their headphones (and from what I read on several headphone boards this is a very common thing, sadly)."
The HD800 certainly fits Skylab's caution, even if he didn't spotlight it overtly. And it certainly fits Armaegis' description of the HA-1's DAC section: "... really edgy transients, I could maybe see this being good if you have older ears or mild hearing loss, but for younger ears this will be very fatiguing."
Thus, reading between the lines a little to gleen the specifics of what Armaegis has written here, I find myself agreeing with him, but I think his assessment of the DAC is incomplete, in that he doesn't breakout its performance with various inputs offered by the HA-1.
I personally find the the HA-1's USB receiver to be its greatest Achilles' heel. Despite my having been a Beta tester for OPPO, through three prototypes of the HA-1, starting back in December of 2013, you can find posts in the HA-1 thread where I've stated that I consider the inexpensive, Chinese-made TeraDak TeraLink X2 USB-to-SPDIF converter (Coaxial Out) to be a worthwhile upgrade for HA-1 owners who rely on USB sources. Many reviewers of the HA-1 who find fault with its ESS9018 implementation neglect to distinguish the DAC's performance using USB input vs. Coaxial or Optical input.
In addition to the TeraDak TeraLink X2 Coaxial Out, I find the Coaxial Out from my FiiO X5 DAP to be far superior to the USB receiver of the HA-1. Other reviewers have commented on the USB receiver's weakness, so I'm sure I'm not imagining things here. I...
I'll start by saying, I find Armaegis review to be absolutely accurate, in comparison to my opinion and experience with the HA-1, but perhaps not well elaborated.
Never having heard the HE-6, on any DAC/amp combination, I can't comment regarding the HA-1's use with the HE-6, but I nevertheless trust that Armaegis wouldn't claim that it "shuts down" if it weren't reproducible, so the really nice thing about that part of his testimony is that we don't have to worry about it being subjective.
As for his subjective comments, which is all any reviewer can provide for audio gear, short of measurements, I can find no fault in comparison to my own experience and tastes.
He could have done a better job of qualifying some of his statements, however - specifically, his comments regarding the DAC seem to be contradicted further down where he writes, "This would be good with darker cans like the Audeze LCD-2/3 or the Oppo PM-1/2 or Sennheiser HD600/650..."
Reading this, we have to reconcile his statements to realize his opinion of the DAC, and anything negative regarding the amp as well, does not apply to "darker cans."
I think it safe to conclude his DAC comments should have been qualified by stating that it's incompatible with the HD800, for example. In Skylab's innerfidelity.com review of the HA-1, he wrote, "I wouldn't recommend it to people who are looking for an amp to solve a 'problem' they have with their headphones (and from what I read on several headphone boards this is a very common thing, sadly)."
The HD800 certainly fits Skylab's caution, even if he didn't spotlight it overtly. And it certainly fits Armaegis' description of the HA-1's DAC section: "... really edgy transients, I could maybe see this being good if you have older ears or mild hearing loss, but for younger ears this will be very fatiguing."
Thus, reading between the lines a little to gleen the specifics of what Armaegis has written here, I find myself agreeing with him, but I think his assessment of the DAC is incomplete, in that he doesn't breakout its performance with various inputs offered by the HA-1.
I personally find the the HA-1's USB receiver to be its greatest Achilles' heel. Despite my having been a Beta tester for OPPO, through three prototypes of the HA-1, starting back in December of 2013, you can find posts in the HA-1 thread where I've stated that I consider the inexpensive, Chinese-made TeraDak TeraLink X2 USB-to-SPDIF converter (Coaxial Out) to be a worthwhile upgrade for HA-1 owners who rely on USB sources. Many reviewers of the HA-1 who find fault with its ESS9018 implementation neglect to distinguish the DAC's performance using USB input vs. Coaxial or Optical input.
In addition to the TeraDak TeraLink X2 Coaxial Out, I find the Coaxial Out from my FiiO X5 DAP to be far superior to the USB receiver of the HA-1. Other reviewers have commented on the USB receiver's weakness, so I'm sure I'm not imagining things here. I...
zilch0md
Dang! About a half of my lengthy comment was truncated, without forewarning. Oh well... I'm not going to redo it. (Sigh...)
Suffice it to say, the HA-1 is a Swiss knife of functionality, but it cannot be the best of solutions for every headphone or for every listener's hearing and tastes.
Suffice it to say, the HA-1 is a Swiss knife of functionality, but it cannot be the best of solutions for every headphone or for every listener's hearing and tastes.
Armaegis
Thanks @zilch0md. I've clarified the input chain a bit above, but haven't expanded as much since this is just a "micro" review (it seems to have generated the most buzz/backlash so far of any review I've done though =P)
marhol
I heard HE-6 with Oppo HA-1 and I liked it. It wasn´t bright sounding to me. The tone was stunning with beautiful mids. HA-1 did not have problems with powering this beast.
Mediahound
@zilch0md I did a direct comparison with headphones between the USB digital input and coaxial digital input on the HA-1 and could tell zero sound quality difference whatsoever.
Mediahound
This DAC/Amp is detailed but not overly bright, in my opinion.
A good way to test for this is to play a male vocal (John Mayer for example). Does the vocal sound thin, overly breathy or sibilant? Also play some rock guitar (like Dire Straights). Does the guitar sound full or thin and overly metallic?
I did the above tests and with my headphones and system, the sound was quite lush and detailed, not overly bright, just detailed. Of course, this will depend on your headphones. I used the Audeze LCD-3's and also preamp outs to my AudioEngine A5+ speakers.
That said, do I wish the HA-1 had a bit more pronounced mids? Yes. But would I call it overly bright? No.
A good way to test for this is to play a male vocal (John Mayer for example). Does the vocal sound thin, overly breathy or sibilant? Also play some rock guitar (like Dire Straights). Does the guitar sound full or thin and overly metallic?
I did the above tests and with my headphones and system, the sound was quite lush and detailed, not overly bright, just detailed. Of course, this will depend on your headphones. I used the Audeze LCD-3's and also preamp outs to my AudioEngine A5+ speakers.
That said, do I wish the HA-1 had a bit more pronounced mids? Yes. But would I call it overly bright? No.
Moogs
Should use the XLR output. This unit has trouble driving even my HE500s with the 1/4, maxed out, but supposedly the XLR has 4x more output power than the 1/4, which is disappointing and somewhat annoying actually. I still think it sounds incredible driving my A7Xs as well as the HE500 with an XLR though.
LarryMagoo
The 4 Pin XLR connection will double the power of the HA-1 not 4X. The HA-1 has easily enough power to drive my HD 800S...and I have a 20 foot cable. The class A sounds great with my headphones ....this has been substantiated by many reviews so I would blame your listening device...not the HA-1
Armaegis
People are entitled to their opinions just as you have yours.
The 4x misnomer often comes about because people think a doubling of voltage automatically means a quadrupling of power. While this is true from a mathematical point of view, the physical limitations of the current output devices often do not allow for this and the doubling of power is roughly more "true".
The 4x misnomer often comes about because people think a doubling of voltage automatically means a quadrupling of power. While this is true from a mathematical point of view, the physical limitations of the current output devices often do not allow for this and the doubling of power is roughly more "true".
