[rb2013]

  Oh man, so up til now I'd been using the F1 KS (Kernel Streaming) mode with Jplay. I just switched to the ASIO and it so much better! Opened up completely. Don't know if it's my jplay settings or if the F1 is optimized for ASIO but I obviously was not hearing its full potential. This thing is awesome. Best bang for the buck accessory I've ever had (I'm cheap so not saying much).

Cheers to that!

 

[rb2013]

 
You mean you heard a difference just that quickly?!  
 
 
You mean just by switching to ASIO; just like that you can hear differences ?!  Instantly !!??   Without several hundred hours of in-depth comparison?  
 
Sounds suspect to me but I'm gonna go ahead and believe you on this one just this once

How about on TV commercials? The true test in audio now. Would you rate the annoyance factor a 9+ or a 10-?
Would you say on the Tide commercials more 'Krell' or more 'AR'?

 

[rb2013]

 

   
LOL
 
I didn't diss it, I just prefer the Intona in my setup, that's a very different scenario.
 
I didn't get 'hit in the face' with an obvious improvement over the Intona, so I removed it. I obviously didn't give it time to improve but I'm in love with how my system sounds right now so I'm not under pressure to improve it.
 
If I could have I'd have got an LPS for it, which would no doubt raise its performance no end... but in the EU we have distance selling rules that enable return for full refund within a set timeframe so I didn't have the time to do that experiment. I didn't want to be stuck with it in case it didn't improve.
 
My gut feeling is that I introduced an SMPS into my digital chain and that affected something negatively.
 
rb was 'hit in the face' with his but he wasn't comparing it to an Intona (which could just as easily not have worked for him)
 
I'm expecting another 'whoaaa' post from rb when he puts his on LPS.
 
A good mantra might be "try to remove all SMPS from the digital chain", it seems to have worked for me, even my LAN Fibre Media Converter at the Aurender end is on an exotic LPS.
 

+1 Well that is fair enough.  And you are right - just using a LPS on one side made a very significant performance improvement.  I waiting for the upcoming JCAT and Uptone USB galvan isolation devices.  JCAT makes some really nice stuff- pricey but very good.
 
But this post has me curious - if the F-1 already has GI - why should the Intona or the Startech USB2G4LEXT2 make any difference?
 
5/11/16 at 9:35pm

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Comment from Leter (Singxer, the manufacturer of F-1 and SU-1):
Related to the post yesterday, I asked him about the isolation.
 

the F-1 and SU-1 (include Berkely Alpha, tanly and hydra-z) also use a galvanic isolation.
 
the ground is isolation.the isolation voltage more than  2kV.
yes,the USB signal isolation is very diffcult.
so all of them used I2S or SPDIF signal isolation.and used a cpld or fpga to shaping the Signal.

 

[rb2013]

   
Totally agree, it's all because of compatibility, and NO standard for (external) I2S, which probably never will implemented...
 
 
Btw, @rb2013 , it has 10 R-Cores 

It gets my vote as the most beautiful DAC ever - with the cover off.  Love all those copper tops - I stand corrected!
 
My point was that SPDIF is not some horrid scheme - does it, like USB have some flaws?  Yes!  Neither were designed for audio.
 
But then i2s has it's issues as well, as you mention.  And from what I read maybe AOIP as well - in terms of clock latency.
 
But all can be made to produce excellent sound - with extreme effort.

 

[onlythat]

 
How about on TV commercials? The true test in audio now. Would you rate the annoyance factor a 9+ or a 10-?
Would say on the Tide commercials more 'Krell' or more 'AR'?

Look what I found!!!    It's right over here!  http://hometheaterreview.com
 
They use DIALOGUE to review TV's and stuff!  
 
Get 'em Rb!  This ought be goooood.
 

 

 

[rb2013]

 
Look what I found!!!    It's right over here!  http://hometheaterreview.com
 
They use DIALOGUE to review TV's and stuff!  
 
Get 'em Rb!  This ought be goooood.
 

 

Duh!  'home theater review'  the same guys who panned the Maggies running them flat against the wall, on each side of their flat screen.

 
Here is the operative statement:

They use DIALOGUE to review TV's and stuff!  

 
We're talking two channel stereo - not 5 channel surround sound.

 
But use your AM radio for all I care - your credibility is zero with me...

 

 

[abartels]

 

   
Totally agree, it's all because of compatibility, and NO standard for (external) I2S, which probably never will implemented...
 
 
Btw, @rb2013 , it has 10 R-Cores 

It gets my vote as the most beautiful DAC ever - with the cover off.  Love all those copper tops - I stand corrected!
 
My point was that SPDIF is not some horrid scheme - does it, like USB have some flaws?  Yes!  Neither were designed for audio.
 
But then i2s has it's issues as well, as you mention.  And from what I read maybe AOIP as well - in terms of clock latency.
 
But all can be made to produce excellent sound - with extreme effort.

Thanks for the compliments 

 

[onlythat]

  Duh!  'home theater review'  the same guys who panned the Maggies running them flat against the wall, on each side of their flat screen.

 
Here is the operative statement:
 
We're talking two channel stereo - not 5 channel surround sound.

 
But use your AM radio for all I care - your credibility is zero with me...

 

In the limited time I've had to listen following its 200 hour break-in, (and a few hours listening at the 180 hour mark),  thus far the PUC certainly has not been 'destroyed' by the F-1 either with Horowitz Plays Mozart or with Mozart for your Growing Baby or with annoying TV commercials about Mozart.  
 
The two have merely demonstrated very obvious tonal differences and some sound staging differences and the F-1 has a bit more detail.  This of course, I'm afraid, renders your credibility suspect with me  (One track Startech LAN guy didn't help matters). 
 
I'll give 'er another 100 hours and some Brill Creme commercials...
 
 
 
Why you couldn't be a bit more civil to me for offering some simple preliminary tonal observations based on switched off comparisons with a device I know extremely well sonically -- well-- that escapes me

 

[rb2013]

 
In the limited time I've had to listen following its 200 hour break-in, (and a few hours listening at the 180 hour mark),  thus far the PUC certainly has not been 'destroyed' by the F-1 either with Horowitz Plays Mozart or with Mozart for your Growing Baby or with annoying TV commercials about Mozart.  
 
The two have merely demonstrated very obvious tonal differences and some sound staging differences and the F-1 has a bit more detail.  This of course, I'm afraid, renders your credibility suspect with me  (One track Startech LAN guy didn't help matters). 
 
I'll give 'er another 100 hours and some Brill Creme commercials...

Try the shower test...I'm sure the F-1's bubbles will sway you...to bad the F-1 won't work in your car - you could compare it on the way to work. 
Better right under your local airport's runway...like I need you to approve of my credibility...thanks for playing...

 

[KEGGER]

RB, as much as I respect your opinions and relays of what you hear and think.
 
Others should be treated the same,
 
onlythat is not saying that 1 device is better than the other, just they sound different to him,
In his system and his ears the F-1 is more detailed than the PUC, that's pretty much all I take away from his description,
 
Again not saying 1 is better or worse or bad, just a difference, and someone "could" end up prefering 1 over the other to there liking.

 

[rb2013]

  RB, as much as I respect your opinions and relays of what you hear and think.
 
Others should be treated the same,
 
onlythat is not saying that 1 device is better than the other, just they sound different to him,
In his system and his ears the F-1 is more detailed than the PUC, that's pretty much all I take away from his description,
 
Again not saying 1 is better or worse or bad, just a difference, and someone "could" end up prefering 1 over the other to there liking.

That is fair enough - and this is a free country (somewhat), so you or anyone can read what he posts and take it as gospel or with a grain of salt...that's your choice.  I do give him credit - at least he HAS it - before commenting.  How many don't and pan the F-1, some just because it has an SPDIF connection (it does do i2s as well).
 
But for me, and I speak only for me, as an admitted insane audio nut (see my avatar) - using TV dialogue to review two very good audio devices (and one track of classical) is not just suspect - but worthless to me.  Then to post that comparison with references to the legendary Harry Pearson is asinine.
 
Sorry I call BS when I see it.  Don't really care if you like it or not.
 
At any given moment this thread has between 24-35 viewers, when I'm posting.  Go to @abartels thread, or Gino's or...nada.  So like my style or hate it - certainly challenge me - fine.
 
Say the F-1 sucks, or that SPDIF sucks, or that the GB LAN USB sucks (after one song) - no worries.  What this thread is about.
 
But just don't blow smoke up my ... and expect me to be fine with it.

 

[rw35]

  if the F-1 already has GI - why should the Intona or the Startech USB2G4LEXT2 make any difference?
 

 
Well there you go... another example of us all thinking we've finally got this digital stuff sussed and then finding out there's probably something else in addition to it.
 
You are right that if GI=GI then only one instance of it should be required. Must be something else happening that's improving the signal as well?
 
PS just for sanity... the 1 track  used on the Startech is one I know inside out, so it's easy for me to spot the presentation variations. (LOL someone one here is very keen to have the heat taken off them and aimed at me)
 
PPS: The track is 'Level 42 Children Say', it's by no means the best recording but it has multiple layering over a solid groove... a track that great systems can throw a very nice performance from and one that crap systems probably won't make a very good job of.
 
rb... get that LPS on I'm waiting for your reaction, you know it makes sense = LPS's rock!
 
 

 

[rb2013]

Here is some perspective - when I originally started the Gustard U12 thread - I received the same -'it sucks' 'you're just hyping it' comments - but as folks actually tried it and liked it better then what they had - it got a strong following.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/736294/gustard-u12-usb-interface-8-core-xmos-chip
 
Then I came on this Melodious MX-U8 and it was better for me - so I posted about it.  The Gustard U12 lovers went berserk (well a few - esp the ones who had modded it), more derision and flames, but again for those who tried it many liked it.  Stereotimes even wrote about the thread:
 
http://www.stereotimes.com/post/yellowtec-puc2-lite-usb-converter/
 
Then after having some reliability issues with the Melodious - the Breeze came along!
Now folks were really getting pissed at me - 'now you're hyping something else'  But sorry I call it as I see it.
Once again a few tried it and loved it!  Even a few of my most severe critics - some even modding theirs.  It got a cult following, and still does.
 
Along came the DIYinHK DXIO Pro3a - and I tried it - best yet!  And no need for heroic clock mods - as it already had the NDK SD clocks.
And now the wash, rinse, repeat process began again.  Tried the PUC2 Lite and it was a close draw - as I reported. More folks up in arms.
But I stuck to my guns - my ears don't lie.  Trying to put all this in some kind of ranking and order I listed what I had heard and ranked them.  The flame attacks became almost unbearable - talk about it just being audio!   Here I was spending my time and money to try all these different devices and mods and getting abused for it!  But I persevered...
 
Well that thread kind of hit a wall and became almost exclusively a Intona thread (FredA and Bummer) - even though there already was an Intona thread (not many folks interested) so these folks hijacked the Gustard thread.  I left it - nothing much new in XMOS being discussed.  It had over 300,000 views when it was shut down.
 
But my search was not over - never will be. I came across the XU208 and the F-1 and I began this thread.  And I was excited - it blew all others before out of the water!  Including the PUC2 Lite and the Pro3a.
But of course the skepticism and derision continued...but as before a few tried it and loved it.  So that is where we are today...and it continues:
 
Here are my rankings and ratings and I'm sticking to them:
Here would be my current ratings and rankings (the numbers are just a relative number - like when you see charts with 1990 dollars - or what ever reference point is chosen - they are not percentages).  The Breeze Audio (Talema) DU-U8 = 100
 
Here would be my current ranking and ratings obviously these are my subjective ratings YMMV - and yes I have owned all these for an extended period of time:
Singxer F-1 DC30W/Cerious/Recovery/DCi/Pur2/GB Lan   190   $180+$150+$250 +$200+$100+$100+$479
Singxer F-1 DC30W/Cerious/Recovery/DCiPur/ iPur2  170   $180 +$150 +$250 +$200 +$100 + $100
PUC2 Lite TeraDak DC30W/Cerious/Regen               135   $481 + $150 + $250 + Regen $175
DXIO Silver/TeraDak DC-30W/Cerious                     130   $180 + $150 + $250
Singxer X-1 DC30W/Cerious/Recovery/DCiPur/iPur2   125   $59 + $250 +Recovery $200 + iPur2 $100
PUC2 Lite - USB power                                         110    $481
Breeze/Cerious Graph/WBT RCA Nexgen                  109  Du modded $208 + CT GE $250
Breeze DU-U8 with Cerious Graphene                     108   DU $168 + CT GE $250
Breeze DU-U8 (Talema version)                             100   $168
Breeze DU-U8 (BingZi version)                                95   $148
Hydra Z with LPS                                                  92   Z $700 + $150 TeraDak DC30W
Melodious MX-U8 (upgraded caps)                           85   $260
Melodious MX-U8 (stock)                                        81   $247
Gustard U12 (upgraded caps)                                  76   $175
Gustard U12 stock                                                 72   $160
iDAC DAC2 (used as a DDC)                                    65   $479
Musiland USB3.0 US Dragon                                    65   $165
M2Tech EVO with LPS                                             60  EVO $600 + Acopian LPS $280
Audiophileo 2  USB Power                                       50  $495
M2Tech Hiface                                                       40  $149
 
Now as I have said before any of these newcomers that sound better - do not suddenly make the previous favorites sound worse.  They continue to sound just as good, even when something better comes along.  So I am not recommending anyone purchase any of these or anything I post about - just reporting what my experienced ears hear.
 
So we push forward despite all...
Cheers!

PS On request I've added approx prices when new.

 

[rb2013]

   
Well there you go... another example of us all thinking we've finally got this digital stuff sussed and then finding out there's probably something else in addition to it.
 
You are right that if GI=GI then only one instance of it should be required. Must be something else happening that's improving the signal as well?
 
PS just for sanity... the 1 track  used on the Startech is one I know inside out, so it's easy for me to spot the presentation variations. (LOL someone one here is very keen to have the heat taken off them and aimed at me)
 
PPS: The track is 'Level 42 Children Say', it's by no means the best recording but it has multiple layering over a solid groove... a track that great systems can throw a very nice performance from and one that crap systems probably won't make a very good job of.
 
rb... get that LPS on I'm waiting for your reaction, you know it makes sense = LPS's rock!
 
 

Well I do have one favorite track as well - I use to calibrate for further listening.  It has some very subtle undertones and very hard to reproduce micro-vibrations. 
 
But it's a very sophicicated newer recording - almost Hi Res in depth.
 
We will see what comes!
 
And the Mutec and Pro4a in the wings - should be an interesting June.

 

[Albrecht]

+1