[Cho Worsh]

Thank you so much!

there's only one question I am left with an that's the EM7 tubes that woo audio offers on their site with an adapter and mentions it's really a boost to performance.

I got a pair of 13DE7 on the way because I do listen a lot to rock, but I wonder how the 13EM7 would compare, as I can't seem to find if it's a worthy upgrade in comparison, I thank anyone in advance

Wow, the 13EM7 topic has generated a number of opinions as can be seen by doing two searches on head-fi.org. That is, type in 13EM7 in the search box in the top right hand corner of this webpage and you will get 2 pages of results. Then, type in 6EM7 and you will find even more responses from members on this topic going back many years.

 

[Cho Worsh]

Wow, the 13EM7 topic has generated a number of opinions as can be seen by doing two searches on head-fi.org. That is, type in 13EM7 in the search box in the top right hand corner of this webpage and you will get 2 pages of results. Then, type in 6EM7 and you will find even more responses from members on this topic going back many years.

Here's a post from way back in 2011:
Jul 7, 2011 at 6:36 AMPost #11478 of 40728
takezo
takezo
1000+ Head-Fier
Joined: Dec 7, 2006
Posts: 1,325
Likes: 28


Quote:
jamesnz said: ↑
has anybody ordered/used the 6EM7 and adapter to use with their 6SE? is it worth it?



yes, i've tried it on my 6se and they are worth trying. it's essentially a 6gf7a in an 8-pin octal base.
(the 6gf7a is 9-pin noval base) the output plate resistance is only 750 Ω, very low compared to
other compatible tubes for the 6se, and SQ is very nice. the grid voltage operates at a much lower
point than what the 6se is designed for but it's still within operating voltage, just not optimal. if you're
a diy person then changing it is not difficult, but not recommended if you plan to tube roll other
types. personally, i think it sounds fine even at the outer ranges of its operating voltages.
try to get box-plate construction instead of the more common flat-plate, as the former presents
a more balanced/coherent sound. i prefer the 6gf7a mainly because they are much cheaper to the 6em7.

 

[TristanLdlw]

I'm aware, I searched this thread only for 13EM7, but out of 2 pages, I only found one somewhat objective description of the tube

Might need to search broader for EM7, most posts of the 13EM7 in this thread are subjective comments that make no comparison with the other compatible tubes or music genre matching; it's all over the place. I wish there was a power/driver post like the rectifier one (which is excellent) as the driver/power tube is probably a more important part than the rectifier tube. Yup, like that.

 

[471724]

Thank you so much!

there's only one question I am left with an that's the EM7 tubes that woo audio offers on their site with an adapter and mentions it's really a boost to performance.

I got a pair of 13DE7 on the way because I do listen a lot to rock, but I wonder how the 13EM7 would compare, as I can't seem to find if it's a worthy upgrade in comparison, I thank anyone in advance

I have a 1st generation WA6SE, and a while ago I tried out the 6-V version of the 8-pin 13EM7 with the adapter furnished by Woo Audio. For me, with my system (Ayon CD07s transport, Yggdrasil DAC, HE1000V2 and HD800s), this supposed upgrade was a bust. The sound was slightly muddy, and even worse, there was a pervasive low level hum, even with the low impedance HiFiMans. I was able to return the items and received a full refund. So I suppose you could try it with little financial risk.

 

[nerone]

Here's a post from way back in 2011:
Jul 7, 2011 at 6:36 AMPost #11478 of 40728
takezo
takezo
1000+ Head-Fier
Joined: Dec 7, 2006
Posts: 1,325
Likes: 28


Quote:
jamesnz said: ↑
has anybody ordered/used the 6EM7 and adapter to use with their 6SE? is it worth it?



yes, i've tried it on my 6se and they are worth trying. it's essentially a 6gf7a in an 8-pin octal base.
(the 6gf7a is 9-pin noval base) the output plate resistance is only 750 Ω, very low compared to
other compatible tubes for the 6se, and SQ is very nice. the grid voltage operates at a much lower
point than what the 6se is designed for but it's still within operating voltage, just not optimal. if you're
a diy person then changing it is not difficult, but not recommended if you plan to tube roll other
types. personally, i think it sounds fine even at the outer ranges of its operating voltages.
try to get box-plate construction instead of the more common flat-plate, as the former presents
a more balanced/coherent sound. i prefer the 6gf7a mainly because they are much cheaper to the 6em7.

I have 3 pairs of 6EM7 that I can try later. Right now I'm using the 6DR7, i quite like them.

Below is a list of the dissimilar triodes (two different tiodes in one tube) with their technical data.
Green ones are the ones are listed as compatible with WA6-SE 1st gen in the manual, in white the ones that might work, but I do not recommend trying before asking Woo audio.

 

[fortunate son]

I'm aware, I searched this thread only for 13EM7, but out of 2 pages, I only found one somewhat objective description of the tube

Might need to search broader for EM7, most posts of the 13EM7 in this thread are subjective comments that make no comparison with the other compatible tubes or music genre matching; it's all over the place. I wish there was a power/driver post like the rectifier one (which is excellent) as the driver/power tube is probably a more important part than the rectifier tube. Yup, like that.

There are quite a few subjective comments for the 6EM7 that will show up in a head-fi. org search of that tube. I have read all of them that I could find and came away with the impression that most members who posted comments concerning the EM7 tube did not agree with Woo Audio's claim of its sounding better than other compatible drivers for the WA6/6SE.

 

[fortunate son]

I have 3 pairs of 6EM7 that I can try later. Right now I'm using the 6DR7, i quite like them.

Below is a list of the dissimilar triodes (two different tiodes in one tube) with their technical data.
Green ones are the ones are listed as compatible with WA6-SE 1st gen in the manual, in white the ones that might work, but I do not recommend trying before asking Woo audio.

+ 1 for 6DR7.
For a change of pace, 6EW7.
Most overrated IMHO 6DE7 (the gain is too low).

 

[nerone]

+ 1 for 6DR7.
For a change of pace, 6EW7.
Most overrated IMHO 6DE7 (the gain is too low).

I guess this depends on the headphone used. For low impedance ones, low gain might not be a problem. For low impedance and high efficiency might even be desired, so you can have more play with the volume, am I wrong?

 

[nerone]

Here's a post from way back in 2011:
Jul 7, 2011 at 6:36 AMPost #11478 of 40728
takezo
takezo
1000+ Head-Fier
Joined: Dec 7, 2006
Posts: 1,325
Likes: 28


Quote:
jamesnz said: ↑
has anybody ordered/used the 6EM7 and adapter to use with their 6SE? is it worth it?



yes, i've tried it on my 6se and they are worth trying. it's essentially a 6gf7a in an 8-pin octal base.
(the 6gf7a is 9-pin noval base) the output plate resistance is only 750 Ω, very low compared to
other compatible tubes for the 6se, and SQ is very nice. the grid voltage operates at a much lower
point than what the 6se is designed for but it's still within operating voltage, just not optimal. if you're
a diy person then changing it is not difficult, but not recommended if you plan to tube roll other
types. personally, i think it sounds fine even at the outer ranges of its operating voltages.
try to get box-plate construction instead of the more common flat-plate, as the former presents
a more balanced/coherent sound. i prefer the 6gf7a mainly because they are much cheaper to the 6em7.

The 6GF7 are essentially the same as the same as the 6EM7, but with a different pin and triode 2 plate voltage.

 

[barbz127]

Can anyone comment on any audible differences between the rca 6de7 black/grey vs black/black?

Currently running slyvania 6fd7 with allesandro ms2 however the bass output doesnt work well with my mrspeakers aeons or to my ears anyway. Certain songs it's too full and forces me to skip. I'll find an example and update.

Open to tube suggestions for the aeons if anyone has them.

Thankyou

 

[nerone]

There are quite a few subjective comments for the 6EM7 that will show up in a head-fi. org search of that tube. I have read all of them that I could find and came away with the impression that most members who posted comments concerning the EM7 tube did not agree with Woo Audio's claim of its sounding better than other compatible drivers for the WA6/6SE.

I've just gave a try to the 6EA7.
Compared to the 6DR7 they sound less dynamic and more bloated under 250hz. If your headphone is "thin" sounding and lacking bass, I'd recomend it. Otherwise I'd stay with other options.

 

[fortunate son]

I guess this depends on the headphone used. For low impedance ones, low gain might not be a problem. For low impedance and high efficiency might even be desired, so you can have more play with the volume, am I wrong?

Depends on whether you have a WA6 or the WA6SE because the WA6SE has more gain available than the WA6 has.

But yes, it's headphone dependent as to which driver tube will be best as to available gain. For example, if you try to use some of the older less efficient HiFiMans such as the wooden cup HE5 you can run out of gain before you get a satisfying level of volume with the WA6 unless you use the higher gain drivers in the 6V and 13V such as the 6DR7 and 6FD7.

However, the tonality of the tube is what matters most to me and the 6DE7 is my least favorite, though not really all that bad and the 6FD7 sounds great on rock and pop and progressive jazz but can sound harsh on some classical music.

It also matters which rectifier you have. For example, the often recommended Sophia Princess 274B is a good mate for certain driver tubes and not so good for others. As indicated in DubStep Girl's survey of rectifiers, the Mullard GZ32/CV593/5V4 is hard to beat with any of the driver tubes that are compatible with the Woo amps. The Mullards cost $100 or more each but are more satisfying to me day in and day out than any of the 5U4 variants, the Princess or even the crazy expensive WE 422A.

UPDATE Until recently I used almost daily both the WA6 and WA6SE. Then I heard a Deckard amp and was won over. I bought the Deckard and parted ways with the Woo amps. The Deckard is tubed with a Sophia Aqua rectifier, Telefunken EL84 power tubes and a Telefunken E88CC output tube. Nice!

 

[cebuboy]

Thank you so much!

there's only one question I am left with an that's the EM7 tubes that woo audio offers on their site with an adapter and mentions it's really a boost to performance.

I got a pair of 13DE7 on the way because I do listen a lot to rock, but I wonder how the 13EM7 would compare, as I can't seem to find if it's a worthy upgrade in comparison, I thank anyone in advance

no idea about the 13v variant of the EM7s, but I do like the RCA 6EM7s compared to the Sylvanias and GEs. They sound almost the same as the 6FD7s. They go well with the LCD2F + WA6SE.

 

[TristanLdlw]

Thanks everyone, currently enjoying the standard tubes and burning everything in.

However after some research I decided to get an indirectly heated rectifier.

I have a GZ32 Mullard, a GZ32 Philips and a NOS GZ34 Philips on the way. That should do it for a while.

I also have another set of 13DE7 and 13DR7 tubes coming my way both made by RCA. Although currently running Japanese 13DE7 tubes and I don't plan on changing them out anytime soon.

Just adding a small stock.

Btdubs, the WA6SE 2nd gen is a piece of art, wow!

Just swapped in an RCA 5U4G and RCA 13DR7, there's a notable a difference!

 

[feanorean]

"6sn7 is super linear and offensive to no one's listening
palate but the 6dj8 has a beautiful coloured tone that
is addictive. it also needs the anode plate voltage to be
lowered to around 130v for the 6dj8 and 150v for the
6922 and 7308 to function a long time. it'll work fine at
200v on the wa6SE without any resistor adjustments
but i'm sure it'll lead towards an early grave for the tube."


Just wondering if I have this correct. The WA6/WA6-SE will run a 7308 tube but likely to shorten the life of the tube? I have a pair of Amperex JAN 7308s that I love and want to try on my WA6.