[dexter3d]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well simple the content you maintain has VALUE whether you want to admit it or not, it does have value. If it did not then you would throw it out. You paid a certain amount for the CD + Content. You then keep the content and sold the CD + Content again for an amount. That content you keep still retains its value even though you sold the CD, so you made a profit.

I don't agree that a recording is a good like a kilo of potatoes. Of course there are musicians who treat their work as 'intellectual property'. IMO, it is a disgrace to music to think of it like this. Yes yes, it takes money to record, and musicians need to live and stuff, but I really don't care if they live semi-luxurious life instead of luxurious, given that their music becomes more accessible to the humankind (of course, I don't approve making money out of stamping their CDs). In the end, do you have a right buy Monet's painting and chop it to pieces? No you don't, because it will never be just yours alone. Would a real artist mind if the whole world listened to his music, with 85% of the world having copied a CD from a friend? I don't think so. And a good musician will never starve just because some people get their recordings for free. Otherwise, perhaps she should think doing something different for living. Music is not about selling stuff, it never was.

 

[haloxt]

^If only people would use this sort of logic against creditors.

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by haloxt /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^If only people would use this sort of logic against creditors.

+1

 

[soundboy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif In the end, do you have a right buy Monet's painting and chop it to pieces?

Of course, I do....if I have the money. If I buy a Monet, it will be mine....and mine alone. I could pee on it if I want to.

By your logic, shouldn't ______________ (fill in your favorite musician's name here) come over to my home and play live....and not charge me a single cent. I certainly can't afford to buy one of his/her/their concert tickets and watch an artist "at work". After all, as you posted in your last post, "Music is not about selling stuff, it never was."

 

[dexter3d]

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif Of course, I do....if I have the money. If I buy a Monet, it will be mine....and mine alone. I could pee on it if I want to. By your logic, shouldn't Bruce Springsteen come over to my home and play live....and not charge me a single cent. I certainly can't afford to buy one of his concert tickets and watch an artist "at work". After all, as you posted in your last post, "Music is not about selling stuff, it never was."

With regard to Monet, it appears we think totally different. Leftism vs..destruction?

And no, by my logic Bruce Springsteen should charge you for a private gig. You didn't understand the point I was making.

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif With regard to Monet, it appears we think totally different. Leftism vs..destruction? And no, by my logic Bruce Springsteen should charge you for a private gig. You didn't understand the point I was making.

I think you are confusing personal feelings and beliefs with law.

 

[dexter3d]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think you are confusing personal feelings and beliefs with law.

Law is not made by aliens, right? I'm arguing for the position which could actually be a point of departure in many areas, including the law

But hey, isn't it perfectly legal to rip a CD for yourself and then sell it? Or give it to a friend? I need to look up North Korea for this, but in the rest of the world I'm pretty sure it's sorta legal

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif Law is not made by aliens, right? I'm arguing for the position which could actually be a point of departure in many areas, including the law But hey, isn't it perfectly legal to rip a CD for yourself and then sell it? Or give it to a friend? I need to look up North Korea for this, but in the rest of the world I'm pretty sure it's sorta legal

BELOW is based on U.S. info:

No it is not legal to rip music then sell it!

Fair Use may allow you to make copies to give to a friend however this is a pretty complex law and I am not exactly sure. I know in the time of Tapes you could legally make a mix tape and GIVE to a friend, but you could not sell it.

 

[dexter3d]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif BELOW is based on U.S. info: No it is not legal to rip music then sell it!

Are you sure? I mean, buying a CD, ripping it to your PC, and then selling the same CD as second hand after a while? Could you give me a reference for this? It would be practically impossible to enforce such a rule. Authorities checking your private PC for audio rips and asking to provide original CD's, or something? It is very hard to imagine such a situation. I'm not American, but I'm very interested to know

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif Are you sure? I mean, buying a CD, ripping it to your PC, and then selling the same CD as second hand after a while? Could you give me a reference for this? It would be practically impossible to enforce such a rule. Authorities checking your private PC for audio rips and asking to provide original CD's, or something? It is very hard to imagine such a situation. I'm not American, but I'm very interested to know

Read up on Copyright laws and Fair Use. It is legal to copy a CD for personal use. It is not legal to make copies to SELL, which is exactly what you are doing. Sure you are selling the original, but you are making a copy so as not to lose the item you bought. How you think this is legal or at the least ethical is beyond me.

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif It would be practically impossible to enforce such a rule. Authorities checking your private PC for audio rips and asking to provide original CD's, or something? It is very hard to imagine such a situation. I'm not American, but I'm very interested to know

Just because you can get away with something does not mean you should! Yes you can do exactly what you are doing and I am willing to bet nothing will ever come of it. That does not make it right though.

 

[dexter3d]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif It is legal to copy a CD for personal use. It is not legal to make copies to SELL, which is exactly what you are doing. Sure you are selling the original, but you are making a copy so as not to lose the item you bought. How you think this is legal or at the least ethical is beyond me.

If the clause sounds like this (and clauses like that are very common in the world), then your interpretation is wrong. This clause prohibits so called 'pirating', i.e. making copies from original CD and then selling them for profit (selling _copies_, not originals). Selling your own original CD in second-hand exchange but leaving a rip on your PC is not legal in this context? Come on, it would be the worst legal case ever, like in those 'epic fail' scenarios

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just because you can get away with something does not mean you should! Yes you can do exactly what you are doing and I am willing to bet nothing will ever come of it. That does not make it right though.

I agree! But selling your original CD while leaving a rip for yourself still appears to be perfectly legal in the US. I've actually never sold any used CD of mine, but I think I would if I had to, because IMO this does not present any ethical problems on any account. Anyway, nice discussion about CD players

 

[m1abrams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dexter3d /img/forum/go_quote.gif If the clause sounds like this (and clauses like that are very common in the world), then your interpretation is wrong. This clause prohibits so called 'pirating', i.e. making copies from original CD and then selling them for profit (selling _copies_, not originals). Selling your own original CD in second-hand exchange but leaving a rip on your PC is not legal in this context? Come on, it would be the worst legal case ever, like in those 'epic fail' scenarios

Not sure why it makes a difference which copy you sell would define whether it is legal or not. If you think selling 1 copy versus 1000 makes a difference it does not.

OK I clearly am not going to convince you that what you are doing is ethically wrong or legally wrong. I am always sadden by the knowledge of people who have such low moral compass. You are on this forum because you enjoy music, however in your mind because you enjoy music it entitles you to have whatever music you want for free regardless of any ethical or legal issues. Sure you may buy the CD but by then keeping the content and selling the CD you are basically stealing it, just not very good at it cause you lost money from the original. Heck why stop there, you can open a CD case without breaking the security seal. So buy a new CD get the disc out copy it, put it back in there and return the CD to the store and get your money back.

 

[haloxt]

LOL get your money back. There's one site that lets you get over 500 cd-quality albums for cheap though, Magnatune: we are not evil will let you get full download access for $45/3 months, or $240 for a lifetime membership. This is one real valid reason to go PC over cd player

.

 

[El_Doug]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif OK I clearly am not going to convince you that what you are doing is ethically wrong or legally wrong.

Dexter3d is just trolling you, dude - dont take the bait

It is very illegal to buy a CD, make a copy, and sell the original.