[WalkGood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyotero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah I know it's note in a stable stage yet, but one could still test, lets say, rockboxed clip vs stock firmware on the fuze to see if there are SQ differences.

Yes, you can test it, I have been running rockbox on the clip for a few months now, but I don't have a fuze, although I prefer the rockbox sound settings over the OF flat eq. It will be great when it's done as when the glitch pops up it's easily noticeable. Rockbox has bass or treble by db, balance, channel configuration, stereo width, crossfeed, equalizer and dithering. Recently I read that a few have installed it on the fuze see here and also you can see a video here.

Apologies to the OP for the diversion, but the sound settings on rockbox are far superior to the eq settings on the clip OF.

 

[upstateguy]

From C-net, you've all seen this before, but in case someone missed it, here it is: audiophile mp3 players

the clip

 

[WalkGood]

When you pick creative zen as #1 you lose all street cred

 

[Roger.McMurphy]

I don't think psychoacoustics have much to do with graphs. Different ears hear much differently. While this has much to do with experience (of gear, of music, for instance), it also as to do with the quality of your organ (the ear, in that case, not the other one

)...

Ears are just like eyes. For instance, some people need corrective lens, and then others don't. Some people see up close, some others don't. So while some graphs can say a lot about frequency responses and overall quality of the digital to analog conversion, you really have to try the players yourself. While approximately 60% of our brain is related to visual functions (perception of movement, resolution, contrast, identification, etc.), we still can't say much about hearing. There is a lot to be learned here. Thinking otherwise is foolish, and C-Net just might be... it is still nice to see they posted graphs on precision though, something relevant of "precision", but doesn't say anything about how pleasing the players are.

Again, thinking otherwise is foolish. Most of us know it's mostly a matter of opinion. We can't blame our senses.

That's a huge reason why these forums are so popular.

I'm sure not many people here can listen to such an heavily EQed Clip as mine is...

And please, don't try to contradict someone with a low-post count such as I do have. I verify my facts, so I don't say anything irrelevant. Yet, it happens so often that a fact is stated in the forums (or in that case, a widely accepted, logical hypothesis), then is flamed or contradicted. In the end, not everything is opinion, and many people should be introduced to the concept of psychoacoustics, the perception of the sound. I've studied the matter and I've been part, as a subject, of quite a few studies related to the phenomenon.

Great thread by the way! More people should know that the Clip is definitively EQable, that it seems to sound just as good (the +4 reference point still is weird), and that they're is nothing wrong with EQing. The Clip's EQ might only have 5 bars, but in the end, it's all a matter of personal preference. I like it. You guys do. I'm sure others do, and will do, with this thread.

 

[Punnisher]

The clip EQ would be fine if the sound was the same when the EQ is off and when the EQ is in custom mode. You wouldn't have to start at +4 as a reference point. I wonder why they did it this way.

 

[Peyotero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WalkGood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, you can test it, I have been running rockbox on the clip for a few months now, but I don't have a fuze, although I prefer the rockbox sound settings over the OF flat eq. It will be great when it's done as when the glitch pops up it's easily noticeable. Rockbox has bass or treble by db, balance, channel configuration, stereo width, crossfeed, equalizer and dithering. Recently I read that a few have installed it on the fuze see here and also you can see a video here. Apologies to the OP for the diversion, but the sound settings on rockbox are far superior to the eq settings on the clip OF.

Which one is in a more advanced stage? The fuze or the clip? Also how easy it is to install the unfinished rockbox. I might compare the two.

 

[WalkGood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyotero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Which one is in a more advanced stage?The fuze or the clip?

Don't quote me, but from what I've read and the only one I have tried is the clip. I just installed the latest compiled version and it's very nice now, no gliches in music playback at all, sq is good. There are still other glitches to be worked out and your guess on release is as good as mine. But do what I did, buy a refurb (14.99 at buy.com) and test it out, btw afaik only running on v1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyotero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also how easy it is to install the unfinished rockbox. I might compare the two.

I could be wrong, but the clip version is really close and runs nice. If you compile a version, you just drag the m300a.bin and .rockbox folder into the root of your clip or copy/paste, unplug the clip and leave it alone while it installs. Edit: BTW, it's set up for dual boot to OF if you wish by holding down the home button on boot.

 

[RubenNYC]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punnisher /img/forum/go_quote.gif The clip EQ would be fine if the sound was the same when the EQ is off and when the EQ is in custom mode. You wouldn't have to start at +4 as a reference point. I wonder why they did it this way.

Hey, sorry I'm late to the thread. I'm just going to throw out a wild guess: Maybe they did it to reduce the chances of clipping? Most of the general public when they EQ probably do it to boost a particular frequency rather than cutting the rest (which is preferred), increasing the likelihood of clipping, or what sounds like distortion. On the flip side, they probably figured they probably start their "Normal" EQ at +4 across the board to make it seem to sound better to the typical buyer.

Again, this is just wild speculation on my part.

Someone mentioned the Karma earlier in the thread. Well, when you boost EQ bands on the Karma, the firmware dynamically re-levels the overall gain to keep it at a net 0 gain, specifically to prevent clipping. (As far as I can tell, the vibez does the same thing).

I'm just saying there may be a reason for whackiness.

Peace.

 

[userlander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WalkGood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, you can test it, I have been running rockbox on the clip for a few months now, but I don't have a fuze, although I prefer the rockbox sound settings over the OF flat eq. It will be great when it's done as when the glitch pops up it's easily noticeable. Rockbox has bass or treble by db, balance, channel configuration, stereo width, crossfeed, equalizer and dithering. Recently I read that a few have installed it on the fuze see here and also you can see a video here. Apologies to the OP for the diversion, but the sound settings on rockbox are far superior to the eq settings on the clip OF.

No need for any apologies.

This thread is about clip EQ, so everything about that is fair game as far as I'm concerned. I'm a novice when it comes to all this stuff anyway, especially firmware, so I'm interested in learning whatever I can about it.

As for rockbox, I saw the clip listed on the site, so when I found out here that maybe it wasn't 100% yet, that was useful news to me. Keep the info coming.

 

[daglesj]

I bought a Clip yesterday. Its a nice bit of kit and sounds superb through my AD700's. Not so great with the Vibes, but there you go.

Anyway I went through the EQ settings and the setting that sounded best to me was the flat custom setting. Normal sounded close or around the same, not sure.

The rest were terrible.

 

[onurrus]

I think "Rock" EQ setting is notbad too.It gives a warmer sound but lack of little something,It reminded me of iriver clix2 sound.

I must say normal is the best though.

 

[tstarn06]

Quote:

Originally Posted by daglesj /img/forum/go_quote.gif I bought a Clip yesterday. Its a nice bit of kit and sounds superb through my AD700's. Not so great with the Vibes, but there you go. Anyway I went through the EQ settings and the setting that sounded best to me was the flat custom setting. Normal sounded close or around the same, not sure. The rest were terrible.

The "flat" custom setting (all even), for some strange reason, automatically defaults to the Normal, which is +4 across all bands. Been documented (via listening) by a few members already. THat's why it sounds the same. Something Sansa decided to do for unknown reasons (but see some guesses above).

For nearly flat, best you can do is +1 or -1 across the bands, but then the volume drops.

 

[WalkGood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by userlander /img/forum/go_quote.gif No need for any apologies. This thread is about clip EQ, so everything about that is fair game as far as I'm concerned. I'm a novice when it comes to all this stuff anyway, especially firmware, so I'm interested in learning whatever I can about it. As for rockbox, I saw the clip listed on the site, so when I found out here that maybe it wasn't 100% yet, that was useful news to me. Keep the info coming.

For this subject, if your interested in following the Rockbox forums click here or for the Clip TWiki click here.

To continue along with the thread, IMHO paired with the right phones the clip has a great sound quality which has something to do with the
SOC and/or DAC hardware, it actually sounds better than many players on the market. But when activated the EQ circuit/firmware makes the sound suck and it ruins the sound signature of the clip. So imo the phones can make or break you, although my point to bring rockbox up was that tweaking it doesn't ruin the sound signature of the clip. It enhances it and gives you more features ...

Nuff said from me

 

[Peyotero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WalkGood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't quote me, but from what I've read and the only one I have tried is the clip. I just installed the latest compiled version and it's very nice now, no gliches in music playback at all, sq is good. There are still other glitches to be worked out and your guess on release is as good as mine. But do what I did, buy a refurb (14.99 at buy.com) and test it out, btw afaik only running on v1. I could be wrong, but the clip version is really close and runs nice. If you compile a version, you just drag the m300a.bin and .rockbox folder into the root of your clip or copy/paste, unplug the clip and leave it alone while it installs. Edit: BTW, it's set up for dual boot to OF if you wish by holding down the home button on boot.

What do you mean by "compile"? Some coding stuff? I know nothing about coding. Isn't there any compiled version for the clip?

 

[WalkGood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyotero /img/forum/go_quote.gif What do you mean by "compile"? Some coding stuff? I know nothing about coding. Isn't there any compiled version for the clip?

No compiled version for mass use yet as it isn't supported because it hasn't been released (see link I posted above to SansaClip Twiki). I am currently running a build a friend of mine compiled, but no coding is involved, if you are interested read The Simplified Guide To Compiling The Rockbox Source Code to compile your own version. Once rockbox releases it, it would be on their “Current Rockbox Builds” page, that’s why I had posted the links in other posts so you could follow the development if you’re interested.