Watts Up...?
Nov 11, 2021 at 4:56 PM Post #2,793 of 3,594

The Jester

500+ Head-Fier
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Posts
866
Likes
584
Location
Australia
Why only a line level output?? The volume control doesn't cost anything. (just software) put the DAC in DAC mode if you want a less transparent sound and to waste money on a pre-amp, interconnects and a power cable. The "perfect DAC" should have a widely adjustable output voltage range or gain range (like the TT 2) so that only a few db of digital attenuation is required imho.
Various opinions are all valid, but there’s plenty out there with extensive vinyl collections, not to mention the current upsurge in popularity of the format that still want good digital reproduction as well, so more about appealing to as wider audience as possible than further dividing digital and analogue, there’s original analogue versions I prefer to remasters, both analogue and digital, and also digital versions I much prefer to analogue, there are those who say spending more than $xx on a DAC is a waste of money while others buy turntables that cost more than a Dave/MScaler, in the end it’s all about music and how it makes you feel.
 
Nov 12, 2021 at 1:15 PM Post #2,796 of 3,594

uzi2

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,628
Likes
471
Qutest already has a volume control, it just has only two positions. The pricing is all marketing/positioning.
They are not volume controls, they are compatibility modes. If you choose to use Qutest with an amp, then the amp will control volume. If you choose to drive headphones directly, then you will use a software digital volume for control (eg. HQPlayer)
 
Nov 12, 2021 at 2:36 PM Post #2,797 of 3,594

jarnopp

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Nov 26, 2014
Posts
2,116
Likes
1,344
They are not volume controls, they are compatibility modes. If you choose to use Qutest with an amp, then the amp will control volume. If you choose to drive headphones directly, then you will use a software digital volume for control (eg. HQPlayer)
I understand. My point is, the voltage output is controlled by software in both Qutest and other Chord dacs. There would likely not be significant additional cost associated with adding a volume control to Qutest since the software already exists. But you can think of it as very limited position volume control. If you added 60 more “compatibility modes” you’d be there.
 
Nov 13, 2021 at 1:11 PM Post #2,798 of 3,594

x RELIC x

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Posts
12,058
Likes
7,738
Location
The West Coast, Canada
Depends on the depth or your pockets, MScaler switching inputs and DAC mode output to a preamp means your paying for a lot of high end stuff to simply bypass it ?
You seem to not realize that nothing is ever bypassed in Chord DACs, no matter what output you choose. There is no separate amp stage from the DAC output. The different ‘modes’ are simple digital settings for convenience. It’s not like conventional DAC/amp combo’s. No one else does it like Rob’s designs. Think of all of the different modes as listening to the line-out from the DAC. There is no waste of unused components.
 
Nov 13, 2021 at 3:41 PM Post #2,799 of 3,594

The Jester

500+ Head-Fier
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Posts
866
Likes
584
Location
Australia
Using the MScaler makes all the inputs redundant so I’m talking more about a “reference” DAC only version of the Dave, basic coloured lights for input sample rate and a simple fixed output … not one that’s capable of driving speakers as well like the Dave and TT2
 
Last edited:
Nov 13, 2021 at 3:56 PM Post #2,800 of 3,594

x RELIC x

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Posts
12,058
Likes
7,738
Location
The West Coast, Canada
Using the MScaler makes all the inputs redundant so I’m talking more about a “reference” DAC only version of the Dave, basic coloured lights for input sample rate and a simple fixed output … not one that’s capable of driving speakers as well like the Dave and TT2
You will never get something different with Rob’s designs though, because they already incorporate the simplest output from the DAC, with the bonus ability to also drive transducers without adding more output stages. It’s already a reference DAC only. Again, it’s different from everyone else’s designs.

Edit: The following is regarding the Hugo, but the basic design is the same for all his DACs.
 
Last edited:
Nov 13, 2021 at 6:17 PM Post #2,801 of 3,594

x RELIC x

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Posts
12,058
Likes
7,738
Location
The West Coast, Canada
Firstly, no body can possibly know how good the headphone amp in Hugo is, because there is not a separate headphone stage as such - its integrated into the DAC function directly. You can't remove the sound of the headphone amp from the sound of the DAC, it's one and the same.
 
Nov 15, 2021 at 3:27 AM Post #2,802 of 3,594

The Jester

500+ Head-Fier
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Posts
866
Likes
584
Location
Australia
You will never get something different with Rob’s designs though, because they already incorporate the simplest output from the DAC, with the bonus ability to also drive transducers without adding more output stages. It’s already a reference DAC only. Again, it’s different from everyone else’s designs.

Edit: The following is regarding the Hugo, but the basic design is the same for all his DACs.
This is more what I’m thinking:
From the first page of the new Qutest thread here …
Qutest is a UK made stand alone digital to analogue converter based on our multi award winning Hugo 2 technology ….
And
Pair Qutest with your headphone amplifier to tailor the sound to your liking, or connect to your amplifier for the purest audio experience …
And
The new Qutest greatly improves on the previous 2Qute and user comments on the forum has helped shape its development…

Looking forward is there a possibility, maybe when such a thing as “Dave 2” eventuates, or sales of Dave eventually slows as everyone who wants and can afford one, owns one, could we see a “Qutest 2” and changing the first line to “:a stand alone digital to analogue converter based on our award winning Dave technology” …
Is that clearer ?
 
Nov 15, 2021 at 12:31 PM Post #2,803 of 3,594

x RELIC x

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Posts
12,058
Likes
7,738
Location
The West Coast, Canada
This is more what I’m thinking:
From the first page of the new Qutest thread here …
Qutest is a UK made stand alone digital to analogue converter based on our multi award winning Hugo 2 technology ….
And
Pair Qutest with your headphone amplifier to tailor the sound to your liking, or connect to your amplifier for the purest audio experience …
And
The new Qutest greatly improves on the previous 2Qute and user comments on the forum has helped shape its development…

Looking forward is there a possibility, maybe when such a thing as “Dave 2” eventuates, or sales of Dave eventually slows as everyone who wants and can afford one, owns one, could we see a “Qutest 2” and changing the first line to “:a stand alone digital to analogue converter based on our award winning Dave technology” …
Is that clearer ?

I know what you are thinking, but the Qutest is already fundamentally designed the same way the DAVE is, just without the ability to control the digital volume and without a headphone jack, and less Pulse Array elements, less TAPs in the WTA filter, and a less sophisticated noise shaper on the output. The Qutest has the output stage of the Mojo and the WTA filters of the Hugo2. It’s priced for a specific market, and it’s just marketing you’re latching on to and not the engineering behind it.

The DAVE’s headphone output is the same signal path as the RCA output. There is no bypassing any hardware internally when switching modes (same with all of Chord DACs). It’s all basically a digital volume preset between modes. There would be no logic for a DAVE2 to remove anything because you can’t remove the analogue output from the DAC. If someone wanted to add an amp to the DAVE(2) it would be no different than using the Qutest in that regard, except for not having the option to digitally control the volume.
 
Nov 15, 2021 at 12:50 PM Post #2,804 of 3,594

The Jester

500+ Head-Fier
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Posts
866
Likes
584
Location
Australia
I think you’re getting there,
Not so much a “Dave2” and more the possibility of a “Qutest2” using the larger FPGA and trickle down technology from the Dave’s superior WTA, noise shaper and pulse array count, don’t get me wrong I’m extremely happy with my MScaler/Qutest combo but any further upgrade path at the moment is the TT2 or the Dave to go along with the MScaler which in my opinion is the digital “game changer”, bring out something like a “Qutest2” priced up to that of the MScaler and I’d seriously consider it as the TT2 wouldn’t be enough of a step up for the $$ and the Dave is unfortunately beyond my budget in the foreseeable future, after I auditioned the Qutest it took a few weeks to make the choice, then listening to the addition of the MScaler it was a relatively expensive “no brainer” for me at least …
Edit:
Maybe “Qutest2” is the wrong description and instead a possible addition to the TableTop range with a similar case to the TT2 and MScaler, I’d guess there’d be some out there that would consider such a product as an upgrade to a TT2/MScaler pair in a dedicated system and use the TT2 as a stand alone desktop DAC/amp/headphone amp without going all the way up to the Dave…
As you said, marketing as opposed to new technology ?
 
Last edited:

Users who are viewing this thread

Top