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Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Mar 24, 2004
- Posts
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- 19
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This is the deck we are talking about right? so are you saying there is a subchassis spider construction isolated from the plinth?
I thought Trio / Kenwood would utilise some form of experimental composite of pulverised stone/marble and glue like they do on the KD-500/550 and on the L07-D.
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I'm not the greatest fan of Rega arms but you have to credit them with coming up with the idea of a single casting which was obviously a big financial gamble for a small British specialist company as initially the costs of developing the cast would be high but then of course subsequently they would fall with the benefit of mass production.
Tonearms that many love to hate like the Linn Ittock or Basic were in fact designed and built in Japan to Linn specs by companies like Denon, Audio Technica and Jelco until Rega and later SME came along with the single casting design., Interesting piece about it here http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/smeiv_e.html
Most tonearms which don't follow this pattern today like unipivots are still built in the traditional way in low volume by craftsmen in small machine shops. The Japanese mass produce the parts but these still have to be assembled probably by very well trained workers on a production line as in the case of something like the Technics SL1200 tonearm which is basically glued and screwed together often with layers of rubber in between the moving parts.
It's joints are finely toleranced but the sound will be affected by a modular structure. This is why SME only continue to offer removable headshells on the more basic models. It's a sonic compromise albeit a useful one and the same goes for automatic features.
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I agree that suspended subchassis can cause colouration but the high mass route is more difficult to follow in an average domestic setting unless you have stone ar concrete floors and equally solid walls then isolating your turntable is always going to be difficult. In many ways I feel the leaf sprung suspension invented by Bang and Olufsen and adopted by Thorens is the best suspended subchassis design as it alleviates the need to constantly tweak the suspension.
I have experimented with different grades of springs and damping on my suspended subchassis decks to tune the suspension which I still find more flexible in my environment. When I get to have a specific room just for my Hi-Fi with a properly solid floor then I will experiment more with high mass plinths.
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But Pickering don't exist anymore ( or do they? ) which is what I meant. So you have to go with NOS.
I also am finding modern MC's are a bit in your face in the higher frequencies which could be because I am using a fairly low end one currently, the Dynavector DV20, but it could also be that they aren't as lush as they used to be, because people expect them to sound more akin to digital sources these days, which is bizarre but there you go.
I'm waiting for my Supex to be retipped. I'd definitely recommend you try one of these if you're looking for musicality as it the most musical cart I've heard short of a Koetsu Rosewood which I can but dream of....
Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have yet to see a TT, where the plinth is more or less de-coupled from the platter/motor and arm like the Kenwood and some of the other Japanese DDs. . |
This is the deck we are talking about right? so are you saying there is a subchassis spider construction isolated from the plinth?
I thought Trio / Kenwood would utilise some form of experimental composite of pulverised stone/marble and glue like they do on the KD-500/550 and on the L07-D.
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Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif A 'load of joins' - no just the one extra between headshell and arm. The high mass of arms like mine is exactly where it should be at the fulcrum point, which means superb tracking. You fail to mention that the one piece arm like the Rega and their copies are far cheaper to manufacture. Unipivots are the complete opposite, that's why they tend to cost more. Also there is no reason why modern Rega type arms could'nt be semi-automatic, it would'nt make them sound better but they would be far more functional. |
I'm not the greatest fan of Rega arms but you have to credit them with coming up with the idea of a single casting which was obviously a big financial gamble for a small British specialist company as initially the costs of developing the cast would be high but then of course subsequently they would fall with the benefit of mass production.
Tonearms that many love to hate like the Linn Ittock or Basic were in fact designed and built in Japan to Linn specs by companies like Denon, Audio Technica and Jelco until Rega and later SME came along with the single casting design., Interesting piece about it here http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/smeiv_e.html
Most tonearms which don't follow this pattern today like unipivots are still built in the traditional way in low volume by craftsmen in small machine shops. The Japanese mass produce the parts but these still have to be assembled probably by very well trained workers on a production line as in the case of something like the Technics SL1200 tonearm which is basically glued and screwed together often with layers of rubber in between the moving parts.
It's joints are finely toleranced but the sound will be affected by a modular structure. This is why SME only continue to offer removable headshells on the more basic models. It's a sonic compromise albeit a useful one and the same goes for automatic features.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif Belts are the main culprit in time smearing but suspension means that any movement at all and we know that the slightest movement in the platter will be reflected directly onto/into the stylus. Why have so many who bought into suspended platter TTs dumped them in favour of no suspension TTs |
I agree that suspended subchassis can cause colouration but the high mass route is more difficult to follow in an average domestic setting unless you have stone ar concrete floors and equally solid walls then isolating your turntable is always going to be difficult. In many ways I feel the leaf sprung suspension invented by Bang and Olufsen and adopted by Thorens is the best suspended subchassis design as it alleviates the need to constantly tweak the suspension.
I have experimented with different grades of springs and damping on my suspended subchassis decks to tune the suspension which I still find more flexible in my environment. When I get to have a specific room just for my Hi-Fi with a properly solid floor then I will experiment more with high mass plinths.
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Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't have any problem finding cartridges and I'm about to buy into the top of the range hybrid Pickering. Some love the Denon 103/R, some don't. This cartridge was really 'worked on' on a different forum - some love it and some hate it. It needs an awful lot of work to give of it's best but I doubt that I would gain anything more than I already get from the Pickering V15 -625E. In fact many say that the Pickering is the MM equivalent of the MC 103. I still say that most MCs are too analytical, if that's what you like fine but for me, musicality is far more important. Let's not forget just how much the best of the MCs cost. I would say that for someone getting into vinyl - pay less for the cartridge and buy more vinyl and indeed there are many who simply can't afford the best MCs - you pays yer money and makes yer choice. |
But Pickering don't exist anymore ( or do they? ) which is what I meant. So you have to go with NOS.
I also am finding modern MC's are a bit in your face in the higher frequencies which could be because I am using a fairly low end one currently, the Dynavector DV20, but it could also be that they aren't as lush as they used to be, because people expect them to sound more akin to digital sources these days, which is bizarre but there you go.
I'm waiting for my Supex to be retipped. I'd definitely recommend you try one of these if you're looking for musicality as it the most musical cart I've heard short of a Koetsu Rosewood which I can but dream of....